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Thread: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

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    New Member scuba jerm is an unknown quantity at this point scuba jerm's Avatar
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    Question Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    First of all, you must understand... I don't know squat about rebreathers, nor do I have any experiance with them, or even seen one (except at DEMA).

    With that said, here is my newbie question. What are some of the benefits of using a rebreather, vs the standard Tank? What are some draw backs? (if any). I did a quick search of this topic but wasn't sucessful in finding any threads on the comparison.

    I am anxious to learn more about them, and would love to hear what you all have to say about them,

    Thanks,

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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    First off , welcome to the RBW , I assume you are a shop owner or a very proud employee. Nice site I did a quick scan and found nothing about rebreathers. Spend some time reading so of the threads as they contain much more then the title, If you are truly interested in a rebreathers and want to get into it. you would be miles ahead to share the site with your customers, by news letter or link. This will generate some interest that will pay off when you decide which Rb to bring into the store.

    I Will PM you.

  3. #3
    Dave Tomblin wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc has a reputation beyond repute wedivebc's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    Quote Originally Posted by scuba jerm
    First of all, you must understand... I don't know squat about rebreathers, nor do I have any experiance with them, or even seen one (except at DEMA).

    With that said, here is my newbie question. What are some of the benefits of using a rebreather, vs the standard Tank? What are some draw backs? (if any). I did a quick search of this topic but wasn't sucessful in finding any threads on the comparison.

    I am anxious to learn more about them, and would love to hear what you all have to say about them,

    Thanks,
    Well I can't promise opinions on this forum might be a little biased but here goes.
    I can do several hours at any depth my OC contemporaries can do and use way less gas.
    For instance 2 days ago I did 1hr mostly at 100ft used 300psi out of 2 20cuft tanks. My buddy mostly emptied 2 aluminim 80s.
    I do way less deco than OC divers because the partial pressure of oxygen that I am breathing is optimized for any depth. When you dive nitrox on open circuit you might plan the best mix for the deepest part of the dive, but the rebreather gives me the best mix at all depths of the dive.
    I go on charters with technical OC divers who have to carry several sets of heavy doubles one for each dive. I can do 2-3 dives without refilling my tanks or my scrubber.
    My system weighs slightly more than a single al80 setup yet less than a doubles setup and I can go deeper and stay longer than the doubles diver.
    In Canada we can pay upwards of $0.80 per cubic foot of helium. That means it cost $80-100 for helium on OC per dive but I pay less than $10 for enough helium to do 2-3 dives.
    Cheers,

    Dave....

    www.wedivebc.com

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    Reads fine print (mostly) Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather has a brilliant future Skipbreather's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    Quote Originally Posted by scuba jerm
    With that said, here is my newbie question. What are some of the benefits of using a rebreather, vs the standard Tank? What are some draw backs? (if any). I did a quick search of this topic but wasn't sucessful in finding any threads on the comparison.

    I am anxious to learn more about them, and would love to hear what you all have to say about them,

    Thanks,
    Hi SJ-

    I suspect that you just might get as many answers as there are members.

    There were many reasons I was seduced to the Dark Side, but chief among them was the luxury of TIME. Time to enjoy more diving, sure, but mostly time to carefully and systematically think thru problems that intrude into a dive plan and then create and execute a well thought out solution- without the stress of seeing my pressure gauge drop with each breath.

    A “There I was” story to illustrate the point: About 4 or 5 years ago I was pretty far back inside a wreck when one of those ‘shite happens’ moments came to pass. My buddy turned one way while I was looking another and in about three heartbeats he had caused a total silt out and I’d lost the line. This wasn’t all that deep, but even at 40 m/ 135 ft gas could have become an issue if on OC. My first reaction was to check my O2 gauge. Some quick & dirty math showed about 6 cf remaining. Solution: no problem! Plenty to sit here for an hour & let the silt settle, then 30 min for finding the line and the exit, then another hour an a half left for deco. And the deco itself will be shortened over OC since I’ll be breathing best mix all the way to 20 ft- where I’ll be on 100% O2.

    Simply put, rebreathers liberate you to completely reorient your dive planning. But be forewarned: Darwin prevails with a merciless vengeance for those who dive CCR. The careless often manage to wind up killing themselves in somewhat short order. The complacent only take a little longer to eventually meet the same fate. That said- for the careful diver that cares for his gear, plans his dives, and stays at the top of his game they are a richly rewarding passport to an entirely new way to experience whatever that special ‘something’ is that draws YOU underwater!

    Read & learn. Surf the links. This site is a truly great resource.

    Best,
    Ken

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    RBW Member leadking is on a distinguished road leadking is on a distinguished road leadking's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    Quote Originally Posted by scuba jerm
    With that said, here is my newbie question. What are some of the benefits of using a rebreather, vs the standard Tank? What are some draw backs? (if any). I did a quick search of this topic but wasn't sucessful in finding any threads on the comparison.


    Thanks,
    The best way to say it is: 2 hour runtime 200', lunch, 1.5 hour runtime 150'
    total trimix used: 6cf
    total oxygen used: 6cf

    When you invest the time and money to travel (to Truk for example) I was able to see more, go places no OC diver can go, and spend more time, at depth than an OC diver can on five trips. Money well spent!

    I did OC for 25+ years before I purchased my rebreather and am still coming to fully appreciate its benefits. I now believe that CCR rebreathers are safer than OC, allow more freedom underwater, and as stated above, are more economical.

    Lee
    www.seapearls.com

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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    As the others have said the magic ingredient is time.

    Shallow diving I have stupid amounts of no stop time and no gas limits. At 20 meters (60 ft) I am limited by the CNS unless I wind the O2 down.

    Deep again time becomes better. I no longer run set plans as I can extend the bottom time if it is really good up to what I can deco from on my bailout gas. Since this is mint and untouched it's long. Admitedly it took two trimix dive computers and tables in my pocket to get to this point

    If something goes wrong, other than my loop oxygen, I can stop-breathe-think. On OC almost all faults remove 'breathe' and that eliminates the other two in a moment.

    If my buddy has a problem deep diving I can stay with them through whatever profile we need to get out unbent. All my bailout is probably going to be available for him if he has a second problem and I can stay as long as he needs.

    OK the days of dragging the kit home, dumping it on the patio and pointing the hose at it are gone as I have to be far more diligent on my cleaning and set up. It is a bit of a faf at times but it pays me back. I am definitely convinced that a careful diver is safer on CC than OC but the problem is that the current crop of rebreathers are so good that we rarely see problems and it is easy to let the drills slide.

  7. #7
    So many CCR So little etc Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase has a reputation beyond repute Mark Chase's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    Quote Originally Posted by scuba jerm
    First of all, you must understand... I don't know squat about rebreathers, nor do I have any experiance with them, or even seen one (except at DEMA).

    With that said, here is my newbie question. What are some of the benefits of using a rebreather, vs the standard Tank? What are some draw backs? (if any). I did a quick search of this topic but wasn't sucessful in finding any threads on the comparison.

    I am anxious to learn more about them, and would love to hear what you all have to say about them,

    Thanks,

    Benefits: Massive cost saving for deep trimix divers

    My last season of OC trimix cost me £2680 in gas. I expect that to drop to arround £300 on CCR


    Makes shallow trimix in the 30 -45m range cost effective.

    No wasted gas: you always have the best mix for the dive. I dive 16/45 for everything down to 70m

    Its warmer than OC when diving in winter

    The gas is moist so less dehydration

    The PP02 set point reduces decompression to the minimum for the given dive depth

    Unlimited gas no matter what the depth. So if i get lost or stuck on a deep dive i have hours to sort it not minutes.

    No bubbles so less disturbance of silt/fish and less noise

    Logistically compact for multi day deep dive trips

    Makes home filling of tanks an easy and effective option

    AGAINST

    Expensive to buy and train on

    High degree of maintenance/preparation & cleaning work

    You need a practical mind to work with them and understand them

    Heavy kit if com paired to a simple twin set.

    32kg and big to travel abroad with

    They have three subtle ways of killing you without warning (two of which should never happen but unfortunately sometimes do)

    Some units have a lot of clutter and the in water drag of a buss.

    When they break down you lose dives and they do break down






    Thats all I can think of for now.

    IMHO Unless your regularly diving below 40m don't bother UNLESS there is a specific reason to be bubble less.



    ATB

    Mark Chase

  8. #8
    Shearwater Copis Diver Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy has a reputation beyond repute Gill Envy's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    My wife and i start training on our evolutions tomorrow. Our reasons for putting out the extra cash and taking on the added complexity are:
    -we are cold water divers and would like to conserve heat...breathing compressed gas robs the body of heat, gas going from a high pressure to low pressure is endothermic...CCRs recirculate the heat in your breath and add heat to it when the air passes through the scrubber due to the exothermic reaction of the sorb and co2.
    -the air in the loop is at %100 relative humidity, as apposed to %0 dry OC air...we are looking forward to the added comfort of moist, warm air and reduced dehydration.
    -The per minute cost of bottom time on OC on a trip to say, honduras, or egypt, if you add up all the expenses of getting there, staying there and chartering is very high since the dives are so limited by decompression and gas limits and we are not even cave or wreck divers. We are thiniking in terms of value, rebreathers will greatly increase how much bottom time we get per overall dollar spent per trip, and that is the case even though we don't do much diving below recreational limits. Yes, it costs more overall, but you get soo much more time to enjoy what you love for your money, precious time off and considerable effort.
    -Life is short, we may not have the luxury of going to every cool place around the world more than once, and with climate change, pollution and over fishing taking big bites out of the worlds reefs, I want to fully take advantage of my time spent in each place.
    -CCR diving offers extended range in multiple ways. Aside from being able to stay down deeper longer, not having to come up when things are just getting good, we are kayak divers and like to go off away from it all. We are planning on take exteneded jaunts around the puget sound, San juan islands and Gulf island of british columbia, while camping and diving from our kayaks. We have gone on such trips and hauled up to 25 80cf tanks, having to return to the car frequently for swapping out...it's too much gear hauling and takes away from our enjoyment of the out doors. We will be able to easily take four 13 CF tanks per kayak, food and camping gear and all the scrubber we need for many dives without having to return to our car. that spells big time adventure to us!
    -my back is getting old, and i'm only 36, every year it takes longer to recover from long dive trips where i have to haul heavy 80cf tanks around... 10 grand is nothing compared to the suffering and cost of blowing a disc, being out of work and going through months of rehab after surgery and possibly never fully recovering. Spinal health is priceless!
    -we are hoping that constant Po2 diving equates into less fatigue from nitrogen....more diving!
    - increasing our no decompression limit is a big plus, since we are exerting ourselves post dive by kayaking, we like the added safety margine and if we do get into decompression diving the stops are of course much shorter.
    - we started to get into nitrox and immediately realized the limits of a set gas mix... a continuious nitrox mixer on your back is where it's at!
    - no bubbles= silence...we like taking photos and like the serenity of silence. we expect to get up close and more personal with the critters, hopefully increasing our chance of encounters with the big palagics.

    Gill Envy

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    Confectioner to N@90 Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou is a splendid one to behold Louby Lou's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    There are a million and one reasons for choosing to go CCR and a million and one to stay OC... I could go on about warmer gas, extended time, optimum ppO2, gas bills, deeper, darker, better etc but at the end of the day... there's nothing like experiencing one first hand :p

    I don't do deep, dark dives... I admit I'm a girlie woose but I dive because I like it and diving CCR makes it far more enjoyable... it makes it by far an experience rather than just a dive :D

    If you are diving in 30m, 60m or 90m the experience on CCR far outweighs that of OC... its something that can't be written down, you just have to try it :p

    Don't believe me, do a try-dive on a unit, try it out... you'll love it :D

    You've also got the world's best rebreather source at your finger tips on here :D

  10. #10
    New Member scuba jerm is an unknown quantity at this point scuba jerm's Avatar
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    Re: Rebreather vs Tank (what are the benefits of Rebreathers?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Louby Lou

    Don't believe me, do a try-dive on a unit, try it out... you'll love it :D

    You've also got the world's best rebreather source at your finger tips on here :D
    I'd love to try it, seems like it's used considerable less than OC diving. So availabilty to learn locally maybe an issue? Don't know yet.

    But you're right.... for now I think this is a great source to learn.

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