Vr3 Hd ?????

depth · 11th June 2008, 10:16

Hi

I have no opinion on whether it is good marketing or not.

However I think the reason for this solution is purely based on a hard $$$ calculation. It is more expensive to produce two different versions because:

Hard to predict how many should be produced of each to meet demand causing over production.
Theoretically they will get a bigger discount when buying a larger number of color screens instead of buying a smaller number of color and non color screens.
The software might need to be changed to accommodate a non color screen which could be expensive.

I can support Delta P if they have based their decision it on the following theory:

If they produce a VR with a non color screen, retail price will be e.g. £500
If they produce a VR with a color screen, retail price will be e.g. £700

So they choose only to design one VR and sell set the price as follows:

VR with color screen disabled, retail price £500
VR with color screen enabled, retail price £700
VR color screen pin number, retail price £200

If they have done this, the actually might sell you a solid up-gradable computer with color screen (but color disabled) with no income at all. This way, you get a computer that fits your needs at the moment (no color), but if you ever get contaminated with the "need new gadgets now virus", you are just a pin-number away

Delta P will start making money before the day you order the pin number upgrade.

But all above is just theory, I have no clue if there is anything correct.

Just my thoughts...

/Christian

UWshutterbug · 11th June 2008, 13:25

Marketing good or not, this what I see about it.

$1,745 U.S. gets you a Shearwater Pursuit ready out of the box for open and closed circuit, trimix, and external ppo2 monitor (up to three cells).

$1,474 (from a most US dealers) will get you Delta-P’s new VR3HD.
But wait, if you are a rebreather diver, you need the up grades.
1. Multi-color activation pin so display is full color. . . $225.
2. Constant ppo2 monitoring. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $100.
3. Be able read external ppo2 (one cell only). . . . . . . $225.
4. Helium support for Trimix. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $200.

When it all said and done, especially the joyous part of putting all those pins yourself, you have invested $ 2,224. And lets talk about the other featured upgrade costs.

I'm a CCR diver, and I endorse this message.

brockbr · 11th June 2008, 13:42

Quote: (Originally Posted by depth)

Hi

I have no opinion on whether it is good marketing or not.

However I think the reason for this solution is purely based on a hard $$$ calculation. It is more expensive to produce two different versions because:

Hard to predict how many should be produced of each to meet demand causing over production.
Theoretically they will get a bigger discount when buying a larger number of color screens instead of buying a smaller number of color and non color screens.
The software might need to be changed to accommodate a non color screen which could be expensive.

I can support Delta P if they have based their decision it on the following theory:

If they produce a VR with a non color screen, retail price will be e.g. £500
If they produce a VR with a color screen, retail price will be e.g. £700

So they choose only to design one VR and sell set the price as follows:

VR with color screen disabled, retail price £500
VR with color screen enabled, retail price £700
VR color screen pin number, retail price £200

If they have done this, the actually might sell you a solid up-gradable computer with color screen (but color disabled) with no income at all. This way, you get a computer that fits your needs at the moment (no color), but if you ever get contaminated with the "need new gadgets now virus", you are just a pin-number away

Delta P will start making money before the day you order the pin number upgrade.

But all above is just theory, I have no clue if there is anything correct.

Just my thoughts...

/Christian

Here is the problem with the economics...

The color screen is TRIVIAL - The difference in COST from a monochrome to color is around $30 (15 EUR) at RETAIL pricing quantities (1-10 pieces for a TFT Color 320x240 LCD). Period - End of statement.

The software development to support the color screen had to occur ANYWAY. And not only that, now the VR3 source is more complicated BECAUSE they included 2 modes - mono & color. The development and testing would have most certainly been less expensive just going with a color model.

Now here is the biggest problem: If you buy one of these you are paying for the color display (because its there in the hardware), you simply get jacked out of the color functionality being "turned on" in the software.

This is NOT smart marketing nor is it smart business. Its shenanigans - They aren't saving the user ANY money by offering monochrome this way, and they are complicating the source code to do it.

And by the way - ANYONE could go purchase a full color TFT LCD Display for $140 (69 EUR) -

I bring that up because even your average person could outright buy the display for less than DeltaP is charging for the "Color" PIN. Ridiculous.

depth · 11th June 2008, 13:55

Quote: (Originally Posted by brockbr)

Here is the problem with the economics....

There goes my theory

Humuhumu · 11th June 2008, 13:58

Hi,

After reading other posts about VR£ versus Pursuit, considering the value for money, I have decided to order a Pursuit... I'm not a milk cow and want a good product for good money and no hidden costs. I agree totally: this is poor marketing and selling such a small colour panel (I don't care: it's of no use under water a larger screen is a better solution to make displayed information clear) for so much money is ridiculous as it is absolutely no more realistic today.

Furthermore I had some email contacts with Bruce and he is a nice person.

Cheers

Humuhumu

Nad · 11th June 2008, 14:15

I don't really care about the marketing strategy of a company if it's not mine or a direct concurrent.If the product fit my needs as requested that's fine, all other speculations are just BS.The option to have multicolor enabled by a PIN is far better than ship the unit back for it, as did happen yet.I had the opportunity to play with the HD some month ago and I have to say I was impressed because of the many features and improvement.This is why I already ordered 4 of them.Nad

Humuhumu · 11th June 2008, 20:53

Hi,

for me it's poor marketing, if it fits the needs is not the question, it's like every time a question of behavior... It seems to be cultural for this company to believe that all divers are milk cows and I cannot subscribe to this point of view, I'm really disappointed by this way of thinking. I want good value for good money, that's all. I don't want anything valuable for free, but this kind of strategy is not compatible (to my opinion) with the divers way of living...

Anyway, if you're happy, I'm happy with you...

Cheers

Humuhumu

Ilikerisk · 20th June 2008, 19:13

Quote: (Originally Posted by Humuhumu)

Hi,

for me it's poor marketing,

The poor marketing is releasing each year's update in the middle of diving season when it takes 8-10 weeks to get the update applied! If they released the updated in the dead of winter people would be more inclined to do it.

I'm happy to pay for the update, and part of the case where the handstrap goes on snapped off so I have to send it in anyway, but I'll be dammed if I give it up for the season.

Humuhumu · 20th June 2008, 20:41

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ilikerisk)

The poor marketing is releasing each year's update in the middle of diving season when it takes 8-10 weeks to get the update applied! If they released the updated in the dead of winter people would be more inclined to do it.

I'm happy to pay for the update, and part of the case where the handstrap goes on snapped off so I have to send it in anyway, but I'll be dammed if I give it up for the season.

Buy a Pursuit !

Cheers

Humuhumu

tibby · 20th June 2008, 23:48

You know how you can buy an Itunes song for $0.99?...DeltaP could do the same; simply go on their wesite and buy your next dive. Let's say $3.99 per nitrox dive and $5.99 per trimix dive. VPM-BE extra $0.99 per dive.
Of course, if you run out of battery power it will erase your pin but if you use your handy-dandy wireless VR3 internet feature (extra for the PIN) you can order another dive right there on the boat! Just make sure you have your Visa handy.
How's that for marketing strategy?
What's the world coming to...
Tibby

11th June 2008, 10:16	#11 (permalink)
depth Christian Rasmussen Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Megalodon Not Bought Yet Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denmark Posts: 239	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Hi I have no opinion on whether it is good marketing or not. However I think the reason for this solution is purely based on a hard $$$ calculation. It is more expensive to produce two different versions because: Hard to predict how many should be produced of each to meet demand causing over production. Theoretically they will get a bigger discount when buying a larger number of color screens instead of buying a smaller number of color and non color screens. The software might need to be changed to accommodate a non color screen which could be expensive. I can support Delta P if they have based their decision it on the following theory: If they produce a VR with a non color screen, retail price will be e.g. £500 If they produce a VR with a color screen, retail price will be e.g. £700 So they choose only to design one VR and sell set the price as follows: VR with color screen disabled, retail price £500 VR with color screen enabled, retail price £700 VR color screen pin number, retail price £200 If they have done this, the actually might sell you a solid up-gradable computer with color screen (but color disabled) with no income at all. This way, you get a computer that fits your needs at the moment (no color), but if you ever get contaminated with the "need new gadgets now virus", you are just a pin-number away Delta P will start making money before the day you order the pin number upgrade. But all above is just theory, I have no clue if there is anything correct. Just my thoughts... /Christian __________________ I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not.............
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 13:25	#12 (permalink)
UWshutterbug Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: West Palm Beach, FL Posts: 165	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Marketing good or not, this what I see about it. $1,745 U.S. gets you a Shearwater Pursuit ready out of the box for open and closed circuit, trimix, and external ppo2 monitor (up to three cells). $1,474 (from a most US dealers) will get you Delta-P’s new VR3HD. But wait, if you are a rebreather diver, you need the up grades. 1. Multi-color activation pin so display is full color. . . $225. 2. Constant ppo2 monitoring. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $100. 3. Be able read external ppo2 (one cell only). . . . . . . $225. 4. Helium support for Trimix. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . $200. When it all said and done, especially the joyous part of putting all those pins yourself, you have invested $ 2,224. And lets talk about the other featured upgrade costs. I'm a CCR diver, and I endorse this message.
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 13:42	#13 (permalink)
brockbr Train Wrecked ;) Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Alabaster, AL Posts: 321	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Quote: (Originally Posted by depth) Hi I have no opinion on whether it is good marketing or not. However I think the reason for this solution is purely based on a hard $$$ calculation. It is more expensive to produce two different versions because: Hard to predict how many should be produced of each to meet demand causing over production. Theoretically they will get a bigger discount when buying a larger number of color screens instead of buying a smaller number of color and non color screens. The software might need to be changed to accommodate a non color screen which could be expensive. I can support Delta P if they have based their decision it on the following theory: If they produce a VR with a non color screen, retail price will be e.g. £500 If they produce a VR with a color screen, retail price will be e.g. £700 So they choose only to design one VR and sell set the price as follows: VR with color screen disabled, retail price £500 VR with color screen enabled, retail price £700 VR color screen pin number, retail price £200 If they have done this, the actually might sell you a solid up-gradable computer with color screen (but color disabled) with no income at all. This way, you get a computer that fits your needs at the moment (no color), but if you ever get contaminated with the "need new gadgets now virus", you are just a pin-number away Delta P will start making money before the day you order the pin number upgrade. But all above is just theory, I have no clue if there is anything correct. Just my thoughts... /Christian Here is the problem with the economics... The color screen is TRIVIAL - The difference in COST from a monochrome to color is around $30 (15 EUR) at RETAIL pricing quantities (1-10 pieces for a TFT Color 320x240 LCD). Period - End of statement. The software development to support the color screen had to occur ANYWAY. And not only that, now the VR3 source is more complicated BECAUSE they included 2 modes - mono & color. The development and testing would have most certainly been less expensive just going with a color model. Now here is the biggest problem: If you buy one of these you are paying for the color display (because its there in the hardware), you simply get jacked out of the color functionality being "turned on" in the software. This is NOT smart marketing nor is it smart business. Its shenanigans - They aren't saving the user ANY money by offering monochrome this way, and they are complicating the source code to do it. And by the way - ANYONE could go purchase a full color TFT LCD Display for $140 (69 EUR) - I bring that up because even your average person could outright buy the display for less than DeltaP is charging for the "Color" PIN. Ridiculous. __________________ iDeco - iPhone Decompression Planning - FREE!!! iPhoneDeco.com Last edited by brockbr : 11th June 2008 at 13:47.
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 13:55	#14 (permalink)
depth Christian Rasmussen Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Megalodon Not Bought Yet Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Denmark Posts: 239	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Quote: (Originally Posted by brockbr) Here is the problem with the economics.... There goes my theory __________________ I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not qualified to make my own meg batteries!!! I am not.............
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 13:58	#15 (permalink)
Humuhumu Yellow Box Of Delight Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Blue Planet Posts: 147	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Hi, After reading other posts about VR£ versus Pursuit, considering the value for money, I have decided to order a Pursuit... I'm not a milk cow and want a good product for good money and no hidden costs. I agree totally: this is poor marketing and selling such a small colour panel (I don't care: it's of no use under water a larger screen is a better solution to make displayed information clear) for so much money is ridiculous as it is absolutely no more realistic today. Furthermore I had some email contacts with Bruce and he is a nice person. Cheers Humuhumu __________________ Humuhumu Nukunuku Apua'a
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 14:15	#16 (permalink)
Nad Rebel to the Bone Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 1,014	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? I don't really care about the marketing strategy of a company if it's not mine or a direct concurrent.If the product fit my needs as requested that's fine, all other speculations are just BS.The option to have multicolor enabled by a PIN is far better than ship the unit back for it, as did happen yet.I had the opportunity to play with the HD some month ago and I have to say I was impressed because of the many features and improvement.This is why I already ordered 4 of them.Nad __________________ The Impossible is often the Untried
(Offline)

11th June 2008, 20:53	#17 (permalink)
Humuhumu Yellow Box Of Delight Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Blue Planet Posts: 147	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Hi, for me it's poor marketing, if it fits the needs is not the question, it's like every time a question of behavior... It seems to be cultural for this company to believe that all divers are milk cows and I cannot subscribe to this point of view, I'm really disappointed by this way of thinking. I want good value for good money, that's all. I don't want anything valuable for free, but this kind of strategy is not compatible (to my opinion) with the divers way of living... Anyway, if you're happy, I'm happy with you... Cheers Humuhumu __________________ Humuhumu Nukunuku Apua'a
(Offline)

20th June 2008, 19:13	#18 (permalink)
Ilikerisk New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: New York Posts: 48	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Humuhumu) Hi, for me it's poor marketing, The poor marketing is releasing each year's update in the middle of diving season when it takes 8-10 weeks to get the update applied! If they released the updated in the dead of winter people would be more inclined to do it. I'm happy to pay for the update, and part of the case where the handstrap goes on snapped off so I have to send it in anyway, but I'll be dammed if I give it up for the season.
(Offline)

20th June 2008, 20:41	#19 (permalink)
Humuhumu Yellow Box Of Delight Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Blue Planet Posts: 147	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Ilikerisk) The poor marketing is releasing each year's update in the middle of diving season when it takes 8-10 weeks to get the update applied! If they released the updated in the dead of winter people would be more inclined to do it. I'm happy to pay for the update, and part of the case where the handstrap goes on snapped off so I have to send it in anyway, but I'll be dammed if I give it up for the season. Buy a Pursuit ! Cheers Humuhumu __________________ Humuhumu Nukunuku Apua'a
(Offline)

20th June 2008, 23:48	#20 (permalink)
tibby untitled Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2007 Location: Salt Lake City, UT Posts: 338	Re: Vr3 Hd ????? You know how you can buy an Itunes song for $0.99?...DeltaP could do the same; simply go on their wesite and buy your next dive. Let's say $3.99 per nitrox dive and $5.99 per trimix dive. VPM-BE extra $0.99 per dive. Of course, if you run out of battery power it will erase your pin but if you use your handy-dandy wireless VR3 internet feature (extra for the PIN) you can order another dive right there on the boat! Just make sure you have your Visa handy. How's that for marketing strategy? What's the world coming to... Tibby __________________ Does the voice of reason change when you add helium to the mix?...hmm
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