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Thread: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

  1. #141
    RBW Member Semaj is an unknown quantity at this point Semaj's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Every rebreather course (MOD1 through to 3 with TDI, IANTD, SSI) I have had use a check list drilled into me and use the rEvo engraved check list religiously.

  2. #142
    RBW Member rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by Semaj  View Original Post
    Every rebreather course (MOD1 through to 3 with TDI, IANTD, SSI) I have had use a check list drilled into me and use the rEvo engraved check list religiously.
    The revo engraved thing plate looks similar to the TDI/IANTD credit cards. Good for them incorporating that into wearing it post build. Otherwise for actually building a unit yes, every manufacturer drills on the build checklist. The ISC build checklist is 50 items long and in miniscule type, that is useless on a boat and could only have been written by a lawyer.

    BUT, then you take it to the dive site
    Put it on
    Do pre-breathe sorta maybe under eyes of a buddy or possibly not
    Splash

    Here is another and arguably better example of a pre-splash checklist, you might recognize the diver, a well known hyperbaric physician who also knows something about designing checklists...
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/wbop81jxfl...video.MOV?dl=0

  3. #143
    RBW Member dreamdive has disabled reputation dreamdive's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterVICEG  View Original Post
    Funny, everyone seems to think this is the answer.

    A turned off O2 tank should be no more an issue than a momentary inconvience. Ask any MCCR diver.

    I donít know much about the Liberty, it seems to turn itself on at depth, but in any event if the diver was keeping an eye on the PO2 of the loop, he would have become aware of the problem of a unit turned off.

    No one is going to argue that a check list is a bad idea. The direct cause of this tragic incident however was the diver paying no attention at all to the PO2 of his loop.

    How about a sticker that says ; PO2? Probably wouldnt be effective.

    So sad!
    I totally get your point. In addition to a checklist, I always reach back to check that the valve is on just before I splash.

    I agree though that even if you forget and immediately start your dive, the decrease in loop volume would prompt you to add .....something. He was on air dil. If you tried to add O2 and nothing happened, that should tell you to turn on the tank. But that is what experienced CCR divers do or know how to deal with. He was a newbie.

    Of course the adage "Always know your PO2" goes beyond turning on tanks. However, a pre-splash checklist (at least on rEvo) does tell you to have a PO2 of 0.7. Don't know what kind of HUD the liberty has or he was using. That's usually my way of verifying what my PO2 is before jumping in.

    According to the analysis, the diver remained shallow. Still, how did he deal with the drop in loop volume?

  4. #144
    RBW Member dreamdive has disabled reputation dreamdive's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by rjack  View Original Post
    The revo engraved thing plate looks similar to the TDI/IANTD credit cards. Good for them incorporating that into wearing it post build. Otherwise for actually building a unit yes, every manufacturer drills on the build checklist. The ISC build checklist is 50 items long and in miniscule type, that is useless on a boat and could only have been written by a lawyer.

    BUT, then you take it to the dive site
    Put it on
    Do pre-breathe sorta maybe under eyes of a buddy or possibly not
    Splash

    Here is another and arguably better example of a pre-splash checklist, you might recognize the diver, a well known hyperbaric physician who also knows something about designing checklists...
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/wbop81jxfl...video.MOV?dl=0
    I dive units that do not have their own checklists, so I made my own. The rEvo one is slick. I just laminate the ones I made and they usually hold up pretty well.

  5. #145
    RBW Member rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack will become famous soon enough rjack's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by dreamdive  View Original Post
    According to the analysis, the diver remained shallow. Still, how did he deal with the drop in loop volume?
    It was a mod2 class so he had normoxic trimix in the loop (21/35, 18/45 or something) and it was in surface mode which only tries to maintain a setpoint of 0.23 The Meg has a similar mode, it only tries to maintain a setpoint of 0.21

    If you splash with these settings and a fairly full loop of dil or 18/45 etc. you can breath the loop down to hypoxia before the volume reduction becomes apparent. He had enough O2 and volume to put the loop in his mouth and jump off the back of the boat. But that's about it. So he clearly didn't do any kind of presplash checks nor a 5 min prebreath checking that everything was turned on. I don't know how big the CLs on the liberty are but it wouldn't be too hard to figure out how long he had the loop in his mouth since his ppO2 dropped to about 1.5%

  6. #146
    RBW Member dreamdive has disabled reputation dreamdive's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by rjack  View Original Post
    It was a mod2 class so he had normoxic trimix in the loop (21/35, 18/45 or something) and it was in surface mode which only tries to maintain a setpoint of 0.23 The Meg has a similar mode, it only tries to maintain a setpoint of 0.21

    If you splash with these settings and a fairly full loop of dil or 18/45 etc. you can breath the loop down to hypoxia before the volume reduction becomes apparent. He had enough O2 and volume to put the loop in his mouth and jump off the back of the boat. But that's about it. So he clearly didn't do any kind of presplash checks nor a 5 min prebreath checking that everything was turned on. I don't know how big the CLs on the liberty are but it wouldn't be too hard to figure out how long he had the loop in his mouth since his ppO2 dropped to about 1.5%
    Thanks Rjack, that makes sense - depending on the agency, you dive 10/50 for your 200ft cert. Too bad he did not catch this during his pre-breathe or somehow only added diluent.

  7. #147
    Pucks & sharks! hroark2112 is an unknown quantity at this point hroark2112's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    I was one of the divers referenced in that blog. Bad day that I'll never forget. Now I've got this on my Petrel.


    O2ptima sticker.jpeg

  8. #148
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by Chett.L  View Original Post
    Hi Andy,

    Not to mention that weight of the valves on top would help the trim on most rebreathers.
    I noticed how nice the trim was when I test dove the poseidon CCR.

    Best regards,
    Hi Chett, yes good horizontal trim is easier to achieve with valves up, but my point is you will need 6+lbs to get down depending on what type suit you dive, so put some trim weight pockets up top to distribute more weight there, instead of lower down and put the tank valves down where you can reach them. CCR diving is risky enough without adding unreachable gas valves to the list of fatal mistakes you can make. I donít see how achieving easier trim is worth anyoneís life..:-(

  9. #149
    RBW Member Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1 has a reputation beyond repute Gobfish1's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterVICEG  View Original Post
    Funny, everyone seems to think this is the answer.

    A turned off O2 tank should be no more an issue than a momentary inconvience. Ask any MCCR diver.

    I don’t know much about the Liberty, it seems to turn itself on at depth, but in any event if the diver was keeping an eye on the PO2 of the loop, he would have become aware of the problem of a unit turned off.

    No one is going to argue that a check list is a bad idea. The direct cause of this tragic incident however was the diver paying no attention at all to the PO2 of his loop.

    How about a sticker that says ; PO2? Probably wouldnt be effective.

    So sad!

    02 breather down to 6m . o2 pumped in lungs be4 you even step of the boat , why let the unit run the po2 at the start of the dive , just push the big green button ,
    safe known po2 ,


    10/50 or air its still o2 only breather in 6m or less
    Last edited by Gobfish1; 11th December 2018 at 20:38.

  10. #150
    Mature mouth breather silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running has a reputation beyond repute silent running's Avatar
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    Re: My MOD 1 Experience with Darren Fox @ Ocean Legends‏

    Quote Originally Posted by Gobfish1  View Original Post
    02 breather down to 6m . o2 pumped in lungs be4 you even step of the boat , why let the unit run the po2 at the start of the dive , just push the big green button ,
    safe known po2 ,


    10/50 or air its still o2 only breather in 6m or less
    You would think every hypoxic dil/mod 3 class would have something like the above as standard protocol. IMHO people are too worried about O2 spiking on descent, donít most tox events occur during extended periods of high PO2 during deco at relatively shallow depths? Arenít there way more accidents with hypoxic dil at or near the surface than O2 toxing at depth?

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