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Thread: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

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    RBW Member Simon223 is an unknown quantity at this point Simon223's Avatar
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    JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Hi All

    I am searching the right eCCR for me. I know for shure a question which a lot of people asked. But I am Instructor (Full Cave, Sidemount Tec) and in the future my plan would be also to get instructor for eCCR. I know there is a lot work to do. On the other hand I am interested in wreck and cave diving. So its not that easy to choose the right option.

    Possible eCCR's are JJ / SF2 (Sidemount or Backmount) / Liberty / MEG/ Sentinel read head.

    What would you go for if you wanna have potential for teaching? I am right now located in switzerland but probably we will switch in other country as well.

    I tested the sentinel and liberty and for them i liked more liberty... JJ and sf2 comes to test. And MEG i search to test. But for MEG i guess there is less support here in Switzerland. And as well i dont know a good Instructor. Can anybody help?

    Thx for help and experience tips.... :)

    Simon

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    Banned CGOUGHN is an unknown quantity at this point CGOUGHN's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Welcome to the forum. I'd go with something that has excellent support and other divers using the same rig. I know there are a lot of JJ divers around you, so that would make sense. I like the versatility of the SF2, but I do not have much practical experience with it. I know a friend that loved his in BM, but didn't really like it in SM as the WOB went way up. I suppose that being able to use the system in both ways has it's perks. Out of the ones you listed, I'd probably stick with a JJ as those are the most widely used where you are. Have you considered rEvo? A lot of divers use them when I do my trips in Europe. I dive a Prism2, but they aren't easy to keep maintained in Europe as we are still waiting for the CE tests to come through. I love the unit, but it would be nice to be able to find parts closer to home.

    The liberty seems like a cool piece of kit, but it has way too much going on for my personal preferences. The MEG is bullet proof. The new MEG 15 head is really cool from what I've seen. Another friend of mine uses the same head for both his Pathfinder and standard MEG. That is an awesome option. Finding instructors might prove difficult in Switzerland.

    Either way, it's good that you did a couple of try dives. Do the other units on your list to help narrow down your search. Good luck finding what you want/need.

    Cheers - Chris

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    RBW Member dunny is an unknown quantity at this point dunny's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    I would say that if your plan is to teach on the unit then in the UK at least I would say the Inspo/JJ/rEvo are the most common. With the Inspo being by far the most common, if it where me I would want to pick the unit with the biggest pool of divers if I wanted to make a living from diving.

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    RBW Member JohnnyC is an unknown quantity at this point JohnnyC's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Any of those options will be fine rebreathers. Maximizing your teaching potential would probably mean going with whichever is most popular around your location.

    Guys are doing big dives with all of those, so it's sort of a 6 of one, half dozen of another. Pick which has the features and support that you desire and drive on.

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    RBW Member Simon223 is an unknown quantity at this point Simon223's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Thanks a lot for your recommendations. I was very confined with the liberty and i guess this machine has a huge potential but i have no expiriance for that i am very unshure....

    But I thought as well for the JJ. The Meg is the problem with the support and instructor trainer in our region.

    SF2 is a little community but growning up fast... and for cave diving in sidemount a option.

    So i will see...

    Thx again
    Simon

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    RBW Member Jens Kallmeyer is an unknown quantity at this point Jens Kallmeyer's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    HI Simon,

    I would not worry about the potential of a unit but first find one that you like. I decided on a SF2 about two years ago after a long time of test diving different units, about the same ones that you listed. They were all great, but in the end I went for the SF2. I can't even give you a definitive reason for the decision, the SF2 just felt better than the other ones.

    Cheers
    Jens

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    RBW Member Bea is on a distinguished road Bea is on a distinguished road Bea's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Hi Simon,

    before talking about the teaching step, the first one is certainly getting comfortable on a unit and doing all the experience you can do in different environments and situations (as well as with OC). All the units you have listed have their pro and contro and are certainly reliable, moreover you will always have time to change unit whenever you want. (personally, I think it's also a good thing for an instructor to have experience on different units). Trying different units is certainly a good thing to do to have a "first taste" but, especially since it would be your first one, it won't really show you what unit would works best for you.

    I'm personally using a Sentinel and had no problem at all in caves and wrecks but I've been diving also on the inspiration and the Liberty and I'm one who travels a lot. Therefore all I'm going to write is based on my own experience and needs, some things will certainly be attributable to other units as well.

    Personally I would choose a unit

    - on which you can find a reliable instructor (with a lot of experience in different situations on that unit, in your case maybe even caves) that can help you going trough this transition at 360° (which is not always so easy to find);

    - with a reliable "timing" assistance: Divesoft and VMS are both really quick and easy to relate with; Divesoft has also open a new branch in Florida. Moreover both units will allow you to send their parts singularly in case they need to be fixed;

    - "easy" to travel with: with the new red head you can use a normal hold luggage, removing the electronics it gives an ‘in box’ weight of just 27kg, with the box weighing 5kg. The Liberty can be disassembled as well and you can, again, use a normal hold luggage; (ALWAYS bring spare parts with you :D)

    From the unit features point of view, I would just highlight a few things for now (there are just so many!):

    - BM counterlung (The Sentinel got it, Liberty's are on their way, Inspo/evo got them now... for example), since you are more free on the front side and it will be "more similar" to your equipment in OC, making the "passage" easier;

    - a HUD system easy and quick to understand (for example: the Sentinel one is basically color based and not code based, it's big but does not bother you during the dive and you can see it really really well);

    - a low WOB in every positions: in this case I personally choose the Sentinel, but even the Liberty got a really low WOB;

    - a good predive sequence: The sentinel won't allow you to skip any fundamental check, the inspo got a good one too, the liberty got a list so you must be really honest and focused in doing it;

    - Redundancy redundancy redundancy!

    As I've said before... Those are some tips from my personal experience and point of view, it doesn't mean that they are perfect :) I hope they can help you!

    My 2 cents!

  8. #8
    Markku Diedrich Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure is a glorious beacon of light Fun Under Pressure's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon223  View Original Post
    Hi All

    I am searching the right eCCR for me. I know for shure a question which a lot of people asked. But I am Instructor (Full Cave, Sidemount Tec) and in the future my plan would be also to get instructor for eCCR. I know there is a lot work to do. On the other hand I am interested in wreck and cave diving. So its not that easy to choose the right option.

    Possible eCCR's are JJ / SF2 (Sidemount or Backmount) / Liberty / MEG/ Sentinel read head.

    What would you go for if you wanna have potential for teaching? I am right now located in switzerland but probably we will switch in other country as well.

    I tested the sentinel and liberty and for them i liked more liberty... JJ and sf2 comes to test. And MEG i search to test. But for MEG i guess there is less support here in Switzerland. And as well i dont know a good Instructor. Can anybody help?

    Thx for help and experience tips.... :)

    Simon
    Why do you think there is "less" Meg support here in CH ???? Look at megccr.com and you find me and other Meg Instructors in CH and we will support you with everything and of course with a lot of experience!!!!! Send you a pm,

    Cheers and regards
    Markku

  9. #9
    RBW Member michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon223  View Original Post
    But I am Instructor (Full Cave, Sidemount Tec) and in the future my plan would be also to get instructor for eCCR.
    If you want to get into diving an eCCR - great. Thats a good idea and it will open up a lot of opportunities that were undoable with OC gear.

    Figure on spending a couple of years diving it, and the RB that you buy to replace it before you are good and knowledgeable with your RBs. Only then should you consider becoming a RB instructor since I think that you owe it to your students to be experienced and someone who can be looked up to and also function as a source of information.

    In cavediving, years ago it would have been unthinkable to become an instructor without an Abe Davis, Wakulla Award etc and 2 instructors willing to sponsor you. I wish that a similar system existed for rebreather instructors. At least in school our teachers are a lot further along than their students, an 11th grade student doesn't function as a teacher for 9th grade students with the exception of sometimes mentoring them.

    I.o.w. You have a long way to go, before you should start inflicting yourself on RB students.
    Sorry to burst your bubble, but I feel that you will need a lot of experience (like 1000+ hrs) on a couple of units before you start teaching.

    As far as choosing a RB:
    The SF2, although not without problems, is an easy sell to Holgarthian style divers.
    The JJ, is the current RB of the DIR crowd, but unless you can teach it under the GUE flag you will have to look elsewhere for students.
    I've been drooling over the Liberty for the last 2 years, and hope to eventually have one - for normal divers though there are a lot of electronics inside that can break down and eventually need service or replacement - it may be too complex.
    I have no experience with the MEG, so can say nothing about it.
    You might want to look into the various BOB configurations and eventually teach how to configure and dive a BOB - Doing any of the current cutting edge RB dives without a BOB is a logistical nightmare using OC bailout.

    Michael

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    RBW Member michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch's Avatar
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    Re: JJ/SF2/MEG/Liberty. Which has the most potential?

    [QUOTE=Simon223;479822]SF2 is a little community but growning up fast... and for cave diving in sidemount a option. /QUOTE]

    Unfortunatly I feel the the counterlung placement on an SF2 an the bottom end of the RB (I.O.W just above your knee) to be severely suboptimal. All other sidemount RBs place the counterlungs either externally or at the top of the tube.

    Michael

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