+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 15

Thread: Chain of events: break it!

  1. #1
    RBW Member fsardone is an unknown quantity at this point fsardone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    15
    APD Inspiration Vision

    Chain of events: break it!

    I am sharing this to highlight how a simple (stupid?) mistake might severely impact a dive and end up in a quite serious situation.

    Yesterday I went to a lake (Lago di Bracciano) near Rome because sea was bad and I wanted to get wet in order to build time on my Inspiration. I am a new driver and while I am a cave, solo, hypoxic trimix diver OC, I am a 10 hour Air-dil deco CCR driver. So off we go.

    After building the machine at home, drove to the lake I meet with a group of friends all doing advanced Nitrox final dive for certification except the instructor who is sometime my buddy and let me join the group for the dive. While the instructor is a Megalodon driver, today I am the only one in CCR.

    There I calibrate redo my pos and neg pressure tests and happy with it I turn of the electronics and wait for everybody to get ready. After about half hour the instructor asks me if I was willing to do an initial dive to go set the buoy for the deco station setup for the students. I was happy to oblige since this would give me the chance of doing some more than expected and build quality time.

    So I put on my drysuit (it is already quite warm out but the lake is 10 C, so being dry with the full protective clothing on is not nice …) and I switch on the reb for donning it. Surprise, surprise, battery1 fails self test. Dive now? The electronics says. I had been tempted to say yes, we were ready to go in the cool water, I have a second battery which can drive the whole thing and the solenoid why not! And I actually say yes (not sure if only to see what would the machine do): the thing switches off!

    Well, it stops there and then, tell everybody I need 10 minutes delay, open up the reb and replaced B1 with B2 and put one new CR123 in B2. Yes ONE! Let me explain for the non Inspiration/Vision drivers. The machine has two sealed compartments which hold 2 CR123 batteries. Fact is that yesterday gravity force was not enough to make the battery fall out of the compartment and I put fresh batteries in the machine only once about 2 months ago before my course. So what I actually did was putting the top B2 battery on the bottom B1 battery (used up). Switch on and now the vision sw passes battery self test, great! But strangely enough with 2 battery squares in B1 rather than the 3 the same (I tought at the time) B2 used to have. Time to dive.

    The dive: 40 meters, limited visibility in the first. In the second with the student near the bottom, zero visibility and following the line out and back to the descent line to the deco station, it looked to me I was doing cave again! So I turn the console back light to always on. Bang on 2 minutes later B1 battery warning with buzzer and HUD flashing at me. Could not let go of the line at that time ended up annoying the whole lot until in deco I could silence the bugger.

    So:
    Battery went dead on surface (should happen once in a while)
    Diver half replace it (should not happen ever: once you know there are 2 I knew but forgot in the heat of the battle–I wont forget now!)
    Diver goes diving (we hope it happen often )
    Diver end up zero vis and switch backlight on (additional strain on batt)
    Diver end up on B2 driving the whole lot.

    This chain of events did create a non issue (using B2) thanks to redundancy and good design of vision HW and SW. But consider:

    Diver goes diving with only one battery (willingly giving up redundancy)
    That battery for some reasons goes belly up (continuous light on or cold or cap not screwed up correctly)
    Diver is without electronics and maybe task loaded: this per se is not an accident but it is a good set up for one.

    Bottom line:
    - Break up the chain of events at the earliest possible point: (correctly) replace battery or do not go diving.
    - Carry essential spares: had I not have a replacement battery at hand I might have gone diving only with B2!
    - Know your system: nothing to add here: my fault!

    Hope this helps somebody else avoiding my mistake (or a similar one for the matter).

    Cheers

    Fabio

  2. #2
    RBW Member Remco is an unknown quantity at this point Remco's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    81
    JJ CCR

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    Good story ,

    Never let the dive site or buddy's pusch you in to a dive .
    Be carefull ........ "Murphy's law" ....

  3. #3
    RBW Member sailor is on a distinguished road sailor is on a distinguished road sailor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    355
    TR300c hCCR, Ray mCCR

    Dolphin, Inspiration Vision

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    Hi Fabio,

    the reason for your rebreather to switch off after choosing "dive now" at first was most propably a weak battery 2 as well.
    B1 was dead and B2 was to weak to be accepted by the electronic as the only available battery, thats why it switched off.
    That was also the reason for two battery squares only after changing / switching the batteries.
    Now the switched battery B1 was accepted by the electronics because the new battery B2 was available and full.
    It also happened to me. After switching a battery from B2 to B1 it failed on the next dive.
    Better to change both batteries if possible when there are only 2 squares for B1 after switching it from B2.

    Reiner

  4. #4
    RBW Member fsardone is an unknown quantity at this point fsardone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    15
    APD Inspiration Vision

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    Quote Originally Posted by sailor  View Original Post
    Hi Fabio,

    Better to change both batteries if possible when there are only 2 squares for B1 after switching it from B2.

    Reiner
    Thanks

    Good advice!

    Fabio

  5. #5
    Supporting Member Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36 has a reputation beyond repute Dsix36's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Deerfield_Beach, Florida
    Posts
    4,023
    rEvo

    Defender Optima Dolphin

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    Thanks for having the guts to post about you mistake. Hopefully others will be able to learn form this and prevent an incident.
    .
    I guarantee that if you CLICK HERE you will not have your view blocked by clothing





    Quote Originally Posted by kwinter  View Original Post
    I could just be blowing smoke out my butt.
    Quote Originally Posted by kwinter  View Original Post
    And note the wisdom from DSix36
    MY ADVICE AND POSTS ARE WORTH EXACTLY WHAT YOU PAID FOR THEM!!!!!!
    POLITICAL CORRECTNESS IS SO YESTERDAY AND I AM DONE WITH IT!!!!!

  6. #6
    RBW Member fsardone is an unknown quantity at this point fsardone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Italy
    Posts
    15
    APD Inspiration Vision

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    Quote Originally Posted by sailor  View Original Post
    Hi Fabio,
    the reason for your rebreather to switch off after choosing "dive now" at first was most propably a weak battery 2 as well.
    B1 was dead and B2 was to weak to be accepted by the electronic as the only available battery, thats why it switched off.
    That was also the reason for two battery squares only after changing / switching the batteries.
    Reiner
    Hi Sailor,

    I re-read your post and I wish to make clearer:
    By mistake I did move only one of the two cells making up B2 in the B1 slot from which I removed only ONE of the two cells making up B1.
    As a result of this I had
    in B1: a dead cell from B1+partially used one from B2
    in B2: a new good cell+partially used one from B2

    The root reason of this mess-up is I forgot there were 2 cells in each compartment, it was my first battery change after initial install, turning the lid upside down did not cause the cells to drop out and I had to pull them out, I was under time pressure.

    This is why I had a further failure of B1 (beside the main brain failure which is the root cause).

    Cheers
    Fabio

  7. #7
    RBW Member sailor is on a distinguished road sailor is on a distinguished road sailor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    355
    TR300c hCCR, Ray mCCR

    Dolphin, Inspiration Vision

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    This makes more sense.
    I'm only used to the old battery compartment, never opened or seen the new compartmnet with 2 x 2 button type batteries.
    So there's a new failure-point with the new battery compartment.

  8. #8
    Capt/ Instructor
    tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1 is a jewel in the rough tmccar1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    406
    SF2 | rEvo

    PRISM Topaz

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    I think self discipline can be hard to come by sometimes but I also think that it keeps rebreather divers safer than anything. If you can recognize your own faults then that alone is a step in the right direction!

    Thanks for sharing.
    Last edited by tmccar1; 4th May 2015 at 15:59.
    -Capt Tom McCarthy
    Stone Rust | East Coast Wreck Diving
    SF2 | rEvo
    Training | Charters | Equipment

  9. #9
    Rebreather addicted wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt has a spectacular aura about wizebt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    La Gaude, France
    Posts
    205
    ISC Megalodon

    Inspiration, Sentinel, Dolphin

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    IMHO this is a design issue with two batteries piled up. You are not the first or the last to experience such issue. Better to have just one batterie in each compartment as before. Now you are aware. Safe dives
    Last edited by wizebt; 5th May 2015 at 04:19.

  10. #10
    RBW Member uwxplorer is on a distinguished road uwxplorer is on a distinguished road uwxplorer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    337
    rEvo mini III Hybrid rMS

    Re: Chain of events: break it!

    What does the manual/checklist say? I found a manual for the vision online, and it did not mention two cells per compartment, so I could not quite understand what you were talking about.
    Doesn't the battery level get checked when you do a pre-dive test? Are you saying that this check doesn't tell you anything useful about what may happen during the dive?

    Let's suppose that your second battery also did not read properly during the pre-dive test (looked fine but died after the unit switched to controller 2 after battery 1 failure). What would be your options?
    Is the continuous beeping/flshing not a stupid thing to do when you have one set of battery left to finish the dive?
    Just curious.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts