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Thread: Choosing my first eCCR

  1. #51
    RBW Member Garethingham is an unknown quantity at this point Garethingham's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    I.e. You are asking us to make guesses about which manufacturers will have relevant units in 5-10 years. If you are asking as if you were doing the dive tomorrow the answer becomes much easier. I would say you don't want a ccr, you want a pscr. Most major cave records globally have been set on pscr.

  2. #52
    RBW Member michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Quote Originally Posted by Garethingham  View Original Post
    I would say you don't want a ccr, you want a pscr. Most major cave records globally have been set on pscr.
    You're right, but setting up PSCRs for setting records quickly becomes a real pain in the ass.
    It usually starts with dual RB80s using mismatched Cooper hoses, a special backplate + frame, extrawide Wing, and dual 20L 232Bar Tanks + Argon tank. The rig, without batteries for drysuit heating, weighs over 250lbs. The owners usually end up using a specially made stainless table in the water in order to setup/gear up since it is almost impossible to move over uneven terrain carrying that weight.
    In addition comes the multiple stages (usually more than 5), and scooters. By the time you are ready to move underwater your mass is around 500Kg or 1100Lbs and your setup divers have already dropped a dozen or more stages thousands of feet into the cave.
    I have seen pictures of setup divers exiting the cave towing a dozen stages each.
    Setting a new world record is a lot of hard work, not without risk, and requires at least 2 world class expedition divers and a shitload of support divers. If something happens, your family will need really good lawyers in order to get the life insurance money from the insurance company.

    Please explain why this is supposed to be fun?

    Michael

  3. #53
    RBW Member michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch is on a distinguished road michael-fisch's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Quote Originally Posted by Garethingham  View Original Post
    I would say you don't want a ccr, you want a pscr. Most major cave records globally have been set on pscr.
    You're right, but setting up PSCRs for setting records quickly becomes a real pain in the ass.
    It usually starts with dual RB80s using mismatched Cooper hoses, a special backplate + frame, extrawide Wing, and dual 20L 232Bar Tanks + Argon tank. The rig, without batteries for drysuit heating, weighs over 250lbs. The owners usually end up using a specially made stainless table in the water in order to setup/gear up since it is almost impossible to move over uneven terrain carrying that weight.
    In addition comes the multiple stages (usually more than 5), and scooters. By the time you are ready to move underwater your mass is around 500Kg or 1100Lbs and your setup divers have already dropped a dozen or more stages thousands of feet into the cave.
    I have seen pictures of setup divers exiting the cave towing a dozen stages each.
    Setting a new world record is a lot of hard work, not without risk, and requires at least 2 world class expedition divers and a shitload of support divers. If something happens, your family will need really good lawyers in order to get the life insurance money from the insurance company.

    Please explain why this is supposed to be fun?

    Michael
    Last edited by michael-fisch; 6th February 2015 at 09:22. Reason: Sorry for the double posting

  4. #54
    RBW Master Plumber lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof is a glorious beacon of light lof's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Consider this unit.
    http://www.golemgear.com/p-729-ccr-liberty.aspx

    Has most features of other units and number of new ones nobody else has.

  5. #55
    RBW Member TecDiver1990 is an unknown quantity at this point TecDiver1990's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Anyone have anything good or bad about the CCR Liberty?

  6. #56
    RBW Member tkfx2000 is an unknown quantity at this point tkfx2000's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    I find the questions a bit odd. Perhaps this is inexperience. The question : what rebreather you should get suggests a lack of understanding of the problem. It is like asking what is the best plane? What is the best car?

    There is no correct answer.
    Which is why "what do you think of rebreather X" is not a useful question. It is only useful when there is an understanding of where a person stands within the spectrum of experience using rebreathers.
    Owning a rebreather is as much about learning and the journey of diving as it is any actual dive. You need to maintain a mindset of learning and vigilance. Not just learning about the rebreather, but learning about your relationship with a device. Your relationship to the device is more likely to kill you than the device on its own.

    It is the journey that is important. This is why other members on the forumn have stated that, given your goals, you will own more than one rebreather. That is the truth. Stating that you are aware of the costs of your goals, but seemingly unwilling to accept the cost of an additional rebreathers over time. This attitude strikes me as dangerous.

    Rebreathers have one real consumable : money. If you can't feed a rebreather enough money, it will revolt in some way. Trying to be cheap can get you killed. Accept that diving a rebreather is expensive. For many people it is not worth the cost Open Circuit is still a better option for diving in many many ways.

    So where to go? What to do? Start reading. Buy every book you can find on rebreathers. Stop asking questions not in the context of what is a better unit. Start asking questions as to what is the advantage and disadvantage of feature A over B? Then you are asking informed questions and begin to understand the tradeoffs of each unit. There is no perfect unit.

    Find the best instuctor you can, based on what you learned in your reading. Interview at least three instuctors. Don't accept an instuctor that does not make you do lots of drills. Get the course requirments and make sure the schedule you instuctor plans can meet the requirements for certification. Take a class on the unit they recommend you start with. Perhaps, buy a used unit and have it serviced. This can give you great savings, without the same up front costs of a new first unit. Dive that unit for some time. Then you will be ready to buy the rebreather you want, because you will know what your needs actually are and what you are willing to invest.

    Best of luck.

  7. #57
    RBW Member Garethingham is an unknown quantity at this point Garethingham's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    My final tip would be to buy a scooter before buying a rebreather if you are a cave diver. You can do some very big OC 30m scooter cave dives on nitrox 32 without needing to invest in a breather. Get some mentoring if you are serious about working towards 12hr dives. Support some active explorers and watch the prep, planning and pain they go through to make them happen.

  8. #58
    Dive Addicts Michael Thornton will become famous soon enough Michael Thornton will become famous soon enough Michael Thornton will become famous soon enough Michael Thornton will become famous soon enough Michael Thornton's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Quote Originally Posted by diverklondike  View Original Post
    For what it's worth, I run my HH with 4 cells. (Note that the cell holder for the extreme head does have spots for 4 cells)
    All of our extreme heads ARE prewired for 4 cells.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  9. #59
    Hammerhead CCR diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike has a reputation beyond repute diverklondike's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    It provides a great option to then get the head wired the way "you" want it!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Thornton  View Original Post
    All of our extreme heads ARE prewired for 4 cells.




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. #60
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    Re: Choosing my first eCCR

    Quote Originally Posted by michael-fisch  View Original Post
    You're right, but setting up PSCRs for setting records quickly becomes a real pain in the ass.
    It usually starts with dual RB80s using mismatched Cooper hoses, a special backplate + frame, extrawide Wing, and dual 20L 232Bar Tanks + Argon tank. The rig, without batteries for drysuit heating, weighs over 250lbs. The owners usually end up using a specially made stainless table in the water in order to setup/gear up since it is almost impossible to move over uneven terrain carrying that weight.
    In addition comes the multiple stages (usually more than 5), and scooters. By the time you are ready to move underwater your mass is around 500Kg or 1100Lbs and your setup divers have already dropped a dozen or more stages thousands of feet into the cave.
    I have seen pictures of setup divers exiting the cave towing a dozen stages each.
    Setting a new world record is a lot of hard work, not without risk, and requires at least 2 world class expedition divers and a shitload of support divers. If something happens, your family will need really good lawyers in order to get the life insurance money from the insurance company.

    Please explain why this is supposed to be fun?

    Michael
    I guess this is how they used to do it before they realized they didn't have to do all that...


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