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Thread: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

  1. #31
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by cool_hardware52  View Original Post
    I'll note that the pack in the link you provided is way too heavy for a standard Sierra, and is only 1/2 the voltage needed for a Cuda.

    Two of these is way too heavy for a 550 or 650 Cuda.

    The next smaller 24 volt pack offered

    24V 20AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    is light enough for a Sierra, but is recommended for 350 watt applications.

    Now you have a battery you can't fly with, and it's only offers 25% more capacity than the factory NiMh...........

    Tobin
    Tobin that is a just a example of one that some else posted earlier. yes it is too heavy for a Standard but not a long body. It is not the best fit buy any means but it would work. The same company makes 48volt packs as well. As do 1000's of other companies around the world. And most of those companies will also make a custom pack for you for the same cost range or just a little more. Tobin they are in the same business you are building battery's it is just that their customer base is in the millions vs the dive industry side is very small.


    A factory Sierra battery is $750.00 for a 13ah NiMh battery, that even DiveX says it starts going south after 500 cycles. Or pay $300-$400 for a 20-24ah LiFE battery that will do the job and should last well over 1000 cycles. You just have to find one that works for the scooter. If you have a long body just about anything fit's quite easy.

    I cannot remember off the top of my head how many watts the sierra and cuda motors are Ray had told me a while back. And it was posted up on a thread on RBW. You contact the manufacture and ask them will it work. these are replacement battery packs for approved vehicles so the safety factors are huge for government regulation. The 24ah US build pack I have was no problem and has had no problems.

  2. #32
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by Loanwolf  View Original Post
    Tobin that is a just a example of one that some else posted earlier. yes it is too heavy for a Standard but not a long body. It is not the best fit buy any means but it would work. The same company makes 48volt packs as well. As do 1000's of other companies around the world. And most of those companies will also make a custom pack for you for the same cost range or just a little more. Tobin they are in the same business you are building battery's it is just that their customer base is in the millions vs the dive industry side is very small.


    A factory Sierra battery is $750.00 for a 13ah NiMh battery, that even DiveX says it starts going south after 500 cycles. Or pay $300-$400 for a 20-24ah LiFE battery that will do the job and should last well over 1000 cycles. You just have to find one that works for the scooter. If you have a long body just about anything fit's quite easy.

    I cannot remember off the top of my head how many watts the sierra and cuda motors are Ray had told me a while back. And it was posted up on a thread on RBW. You contact the manufacture and ask them will it work. these are replacement battery packs for approved vehicles so the safety factors are huge for government regulation. The 24ah US build pack I have was no problem and has had no problems.

    Once again, if little or no gains in capacity, and no reduction in weight, and the loss of the flood resistant battery compartment and loss of transport on passenger aircraft is acceptable then go for it, shove a square peg in a round hole.

    OTOH if you want greatly increased performance, and improved cycle life, maintain the flood resistant design with a purpose built product the choice clear.

    Tobin

  3. #33
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by cool_hardware52  View Original Post
    Once again, if little or no gains in capacity, and no reduction in weight, and the loss of the flood resistant battery compartment and loss of transport on passenger aircraft is acceptable then go for it, shove a square peg in a round hole.

    OTOH if you want greatly increased performance, and improved cycle life, maintain the flood resistant design with a purpose built product the choice clear.

    Tobin
    Tobin if the bulkhead is in you maintain flood resistance.

  4. #34
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by Loanwolf  View Original Post
    Tobin if the bulkhead is in you maintain flood resistance.
    Have you actually done what you are advocating with a standard Sierra?

    There's less than 6 inches of hull forward of the Battery snap ring, even less from inside of the bulkhead forward.

    This battery won't fit, no concern because it's too heavy anyway.

    24V 20AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    And this battery might fit, but don't think so,

    24V 15AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    This one will fit, but it's only 10AH, and is recommended for 200 watt motors. Now the all you need is place for 5-6 lbs of extra lead you will need.

    24V 10AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    Niffty stuff.

    Tobin

  5. #35
    New Member Hugh is an unknown quantity at this point Hugh's Avatar
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Im looking at dropping one of the 30amp packs into my Short SS, has anyone down this?


    Regards



    Hugh

  6. #36
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by cool_hardware52  View Original Post
    Have you actually done what you are advocating with a standard Sierra?

    There's less than 6 inches of hull forward of the Battery snap ring, even less from inside of the bulkhead forward.

    This battery won't fit, no concern because it's too heavy anyway.

    24V 20AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    And this battery might fit, but don't think so,

    24V 15AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    This one will fit, but it's only 10AH, and is recommended for 200 watt motors. Now the all you need is place for 5-6 lbs of extra lead you will need.

    24V 10AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    Niffty stuff.

    Tobin
    Tobin you do lot listen well do you in a Standard they are hard to find one that fits but in a long body it is easy. That is why you look and their are many other options that one can look at that are far less money.

  7. #37
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by Loanwolf  View Original Post
    Tobin you do lot listen well do you in a Standard they are hard to find one that fits but in a long body it is easy. That is why you look and their are many other options that one can look at that are far less money.

    I have a listening problem?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lancer4545  View Original Post
    I am considering changing my Sierra std Nicad batteries to Lithium. Has anyone already done this and like to share your experiences.

    Thanks,

    Lance
    The OP in this thread is looking for a battery for a Std Sierra

    I must have missed the part where he's contemplating a new hull to fit your budget battery...............


    Tobin

  8. #38
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by cool_hardware52  View Original Post
    I have a listening problem?



    The OP in this thread is looking for a battery for a Std Sierra

    I must have missed the part where he's contemplating a new hull to fit your budget battery...............


    Tobin
    24V 20AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    This one have the right weight ( 4.9 kg versus 5.2 for the std sierra pack )
    For the size it would be necessary to remove the internal plastic cylinder of the the body ( dont kow if its easy and reversible, but I suspect it is a screwing system, perhaps a clip in the nose )
    A problem could be the lengh of the pack so the center weight is not excatly at the right place perhaps but you can add 0.3 kg to "move" it.
    For the power (someone asked ), the motor of the sierra is 450W.
    For the capacity of the pack, if 20 A is not good so 13 A is ridiculous.
    Now that I have bought this ridiculous scooter I dont want to spend too much money in it;
    When the NIMH will be dead ( perhaps before that ) Ill test the NIFe, 20 A is 35% so for me a correct improvement for a much lower price.
    I dont care about airflight but of self discharge on the way to a cave dive with such a small capacity pack;
    About SS scooter a collegue done that on a UV 18 (easy to do, low cost, awesome result ) its way to go.

  9. #39
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc T  View Original Post
    24V 20AH V2.5 LiFePO4 Battery Pack

    This one have the right weight ( 4.9 kg versus 5.2 for the std sierra pack )
    For the size it would be necessary to remove the internal plastic cylinder of the the body ( dont kow if its easy and reversible, but I suspect it is a screwing system, perhaps a clip in the nose )
    A problem could be the lengh of the pack so the center weight is not excatly at the right place perhaps but you can add 0.3 kg to "move" it.
    For the power (someone asked ), the motor of the sierra is 450W.
    For the capacity of the pack, if 20 A is not good so 13 A is ridiculous.
    Now that I have bought this ridiculous scooter I dont want to spend too much money in it;
    When the NIMH will be dead ( perhaps before that ) Ill test the NIFe, 20 A is 35% so for me a correct improvement for a much lower price.
    I dont care about airflight but of self discharge on the way to a cave dive with such a small capacity pack;
    About SS scooter a collegue done that on a UV 18 (easy to do, low cost, awesome result ) its way to go.
    What's your point?

    As I stated before, you probably can physically fit that pack, but you will loose the water resistant battery compartment.

    X scooters don't have an "internal plastic cylinder" that I'm aware of.

    The hulls are a welded aluminum assembly, quite different than the plastic body scooters build using pipe.

    Tobin

  10. #40
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    Re: Changing to Lithuim Scooter Batteries


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