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Thread: Flight 1549

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    RBW Member hamrhed42 is an unknown quantity at this point hamrhed42's Avatar
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    Flight 1549

    ATC: "Cactus 1549 what runway do you want?"
    Cactus 1549: "Were going to be in the Hudson"

    Alot of us on the board fly, myself included. Can't understand how he fought off the panic. I got thiss form a FAA friend of mine.
    Hudson1.flv video by hamrhed42 - Photobucket
    Last edited by hamrhed42; 5th March 2009 at 04:37.

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    RBW Member bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma's Avatar
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    Re: Flight 1549

    I'm hardly the seasoned pilot that he is, but it seems to me (at least from the audio clip) that atc didn't really understand that the plane was going down in the river. He kept trying to push the flight to a runway.

    We run into this at my work all the time. When someone calls for help on the radio and it sounds like they're scared out of their mind, EVERYONE drops what they're doing and rushes in to help. Sometimes if you're too calm on the radio it's like people don't even hear what you're saying. You can say, "Yeah, there's this guy with a gun and a bomb, he said something about blowing everybody up" and only a few people will respond. If all I hear is a screech my heart skips a beat and I come running.

    Maybe this is atc's problem. Maintaining your cool in a crisis is absolutely mandatory. It took another pilot saying, "I think he said he was going down in the Hudson."

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    RBW Member hamrhed42 is an unknown quantity at this point hamrhed42's Avatar
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    Re: Flight 1549

    I agree, you can clearly hear him say that he lost all thrust form both engines but ATC could really care less by the tone in there voice. results may of been much worse had he lost his calm.

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    Re: Flight 1549

    1549 "yeah, we lost both engines and we're going down in the river."

    atc "what's that? what engine did you lose? let me send you to this other airport since you can't make it back to the one you just left from."

    1549 "i said we're going down in the river."

    atc "hello? you still there?"

    other pilot "i think he said he's going down in the Hudson..."

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    RBW Member bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma will become famous soon enough bad_karma's Avatar
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    Re: Flight 1549

    I just saw a special on the incident on Discovery. There was more audio from the atc tapes, and gps flight path info from the flight data recorder (black box). It's amazing to see how far the country, as well as the NYC area, has come since the attacks of September 11th, and to see the response from so many agencies, including the ferries is moving to say the least. And when I say that the pilots, flight crew, atc and those involved with the rescue effort are heroes I feel it is a drastic understatement.

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    Re: Flight 1549

    Quote Originally Posted by bad_karma  View Original Post
    I'm hardly the seasoned pilot that he is, but it seems to me (at least from the audio clip) that atc didn't really understand that the plane was going down in the river. He kept trying to push the flight to a runway.

    We run into this at my work all the time. When someone calls for help on the radio and it sounds like they're scared out of their mind, EVERYONE drops what they're doing and rushes in to help. Sometimes if you're too calm on the radio it's like people don't even hear what you're saying. You can say, "Yeah, there's this guy with a gun and a bomb, he said something about blowing everybody up" and only a few people will respond. If all I hear is a screech my heart skips a beat and I come running.
    Dude, maybe I am missing the point of what you are saying, but I heard the transcripts and I think the controller did a fantastic job. The Captain reports he needs to go back to LGA, and the controller responds with a heading in about half a second. The controller is not in the plane - he has no idea what the hell is going on. And pushing towards a runway? What should he have done? Given them a heading out to sea? To central park? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe an airliner has the highest chance of survival when landing on the nearest runway. Water landings are almost always a disaster. The controller has no idea of the plane's physical status, and perhaps under slightly different circumstances, the plane might have made it to Teterboro or even back to LGA.

    I'd be interested to hear SWAdiver's opinion here.

    Captain Sully is completely proper in maintaining a calm even demeanor on the air. I worked in public safety for over 13 years, and have been involved in all sorts of life-threatening situations over two-way radio. When someone screams in a radio, it might get your attention, but no one knows what the hell you are saying.

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    Re: Flight 1549

    Is it me, or did you get flashbacks when those geese hit.....?


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    Re: Flight 1549

    Quote Originally Posted by hamrhed42  View Original Post
    ATC: "Cactus 1549 what runway do you want?"
    Cactus 1549: "Were going to be in the Hudson"

    Alot of us on the board fly, myself included. Can't understand how he fought off the panic.
    I can. I’m not overly fond of “talking shop” on what for me is a site I frequent to take my mind off of work, but in this case I think there’s a very useful- likely lifesaving- attribute involved for members here to aspire to.

    Like the Captain of this flight, I, too, was a military pilot in my younger days before the commercial flying I do now. One of the requirements for currency was that once every few years we had to go to “physiological refresher”. The 2 day course consisted of a review of hypobaric physiology, pure O2 physiology, street level psychology for pilots, and a ride in the altitude chamber to refresh us with how our personal hypoxia symptoms had changed with time/ age.

    One refresher lesson that’s stuck with me for a long time is a study that found successful military pilots have a much higher than normal ability to ‘compartmentalize’. What this means: They have the ability to acknowledge a problem and act on it while shutting it into just a corner of their conscious mind. They then devote most of their decision making ability to analyzing and solving the problem at hand without letting panic set in. Simply put, you see clearly what needs to be done and do it- w/o letting the problem scare you into inaction.

    Whether this trait is innate or learned is way beyond me, but I can say that years and years of dealing with emergencies in VERY realistic aircraft simulators (another currency requirement for both military and civilian commercial pilots) does reinforce this ability.

    By now I’ll bet most folks can see how this ability to compartmentalize can be life saving for technical divers- both OC & CCR. Boom scenario, loop gas problem, entanglement, whatever: Acknowledge the problem, shrink it into a corner of your consciousness, and move on to competently correcting it- skipping the panic part. Since you’ve kept your emergency skills current with practice (right?) you begin by choosing the right solution from your mental toolbox and proceed to putting it into use. Cut and dried, no panic.

    Hope this helps-

    Ken

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    Re: Flight 1549

    i dont do the flying thing but i do something where composure is key while speaking on the radio< i dont like to advertise but there is a hint in my sig..>

    anyways in most of the more active areas of brooklyn you can tell whats going on by how flat and droll the voices are on the radio. normally there is a melody to how guys speak but if a guy says in a dead quiet calm voice that he just needs one or two cars maybe, he will get everybody asap. the screaming guy is just noise at first , he gets the attention but it takes a while to figure out where he is,no point in driving away from the gunfight. even better is when they scream while running, good luck with that guy.

    another point when everybody is yelling speaking quietly is the best way to focus their attention especially if they are emotionally disturbed.

    third i totally get the put it on the shelf and keep going so you dont die. I think this is right up there with the ooda loop concept. (ooda loop- observe orient decide act-its how humans react to gunfights)
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    Re: Flight 1549

    I saw the entire event unfold, it was something I cant put into words, but that pilot is a "keeper".

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