+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 11 to 16 of 16

Thread: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

  1. #11
    New Member barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney is a splendid one to behold barney's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    St. Petersburg, FL
    Posts
    516

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    you definitely shot some great stuff - looking forward to seeing a compilation of it all! happy editing! ;)

    Quote Originally Posted by PacketSniffer  View Original Post
    Also, as far as documenting, I shot right at 120 minutes of some really cool High Definition video (3CCD cam) of the wrecks we dove. This includes some interesting penetration footage of the U-2513 sub. I gave Mike and Richie full permission yesterday to employ my top side pictures and underwater video for any purposes including commercial with no compensation whatsoever. I'd like nothing more than to see it all put to good use.

  2. #12
    swims in fishes toilets vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr is a glorious beacon of light vidodivr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Florida/Michigan
    Posts
    597

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    Quote Originally Posted by barney  View Original Post
    Hi Rob-
    As you noted, this debate has been going on for a long time. As with any issue, there is a wide variety of opinions, and there is unlikely to ever be any consensus where everyone is happy. I am not going to get in a long drawn out discussion on this, as I have done it too many times to count and likely won't change your or anyone else's mind.
    I agree, Just like the government, everything is backwards and it's too big to fix and it really could go either way.

    Quote Originally Posted by barney  View Original Post
    I am not going to validate what I do (or don't do) on my own time and on my own dime (important to note as archaeologists generally are paid by either taxpayers, private foundations, or the like; but mostly taxpayers when we are talking about government agencies). But obviously due to space and time limitations, I am only able to publish but a fraction either electronically or otherwise what information I gain from archival and underwater research. I have file cabinets and external hard drives full of stuff, as well as hours and hours of video footage.
    As I have noted, you have done more than most, thank you.

    Quote Originally Posted by barney  View Original Post
    To many of your other questions - if they really are important to you - I would suggest you go and actually dive the wrecks (e.g., to see what the 2004 hurricanes did) instead of trying to learn about them on the internet.
    I am still pretty young and finally becoming financially stable enough to go out on such trips. It's a simple matter of my time is just arriving.
    How would diving on a wreck today or 5 years from now tell me what it looked like in 2004?
    The only way to know that is through documentation from previous folks, if it's stripped clean and not documented only those people know and it's lost history.

    Quote Originally Posted by barney  View Original Post
    I am not trying to piss you off, but I have no patience for those that throw out comments like yours and moan about "lost opportunities" when in reality they are likely never going to visit these sites. And the only reason they even have the opportunity at all to know of these wrecks is from the efforts of wreck divers (not archaeologists).
    I'm too level headed to piss off, and I hope everyone else is as well.

    Oh, I have the goal of diving every wreck on this planet, I will appreciate what it is at the time with the info provided to me by the others that have explored before me, gather my own and hopefully provide some input.
    My point is just to outreach to wreck divers that are blessed to go to these wrecks where most archeologists can only dream of going and think a little more like an archaeologist instead of the artifact hungry wreck divers. If it's artifacts are gone, so is the historical data. Just document it, then take it, it's your right, finders keepers. (unless protected by law)
    Where that documentation goes....I know someone with file cabinets and hard drives!!

    Mike, we all had to start somewhere and I'm ramping up now.

    The Great Lakes are my main interest, which is another ball game altogether, but a wreck is a wreck regardless.

  3. #13
    RBW Member Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe is a glorious beacon of light Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Florida, USA
    Posts
    485
    Megaladon

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    Quote Originally Posted by vidodivr  View Original Post
    ....map and document it for the educational, federal and state agencies closest to the wrecks,
    FWIW we did that with the Queen of Nassau in the Keys. We got invited to participate with the government funded research team on the initial dives. We assisted in documenting the wreck, recovering artifacts, towed the cameramen with rigged harnesses using our scooters to make a photomosaic.

    Mike's input basically made the authorities aware that the wreck previously thought to be a junk pile of a freighter with a cargo of motorcycles was actually an historically significant wreck. (Also got to dive with a great bunch of guys, some of whom I am still friendly with and have a great admiration for.)

    This all came about courtesy of Mikes instincts, research and willingness to communicate and share information with the government archaeologists.

    AUE reaped some significant rewards for this.

    Like being falsely accused of taking artifacts from the wreck that were still on it. (Thats right, someone couldn't find an artifact so ASSumed we took it even though it was there and they apparently just didn't see it.)

    Or like when the time came to make the documentary film, AUE was excluded.

    Mike was the catsalyst that made this all happen and he got no recognition for it. To his credit, the Archaeologist in charge, Tane Casserly, did acknowledge Mikes contributions to the project but it fell on deaf ears, undoubtedly due to politics.

    When we did our first trips to the Rhine, Araby etc. etc. Billy Deans and a few others were the only ones who dived them and their locations were closely guarded secrets. Our first trips were on fishing boats with no amenities. Captains fished while we were in the water.

    In Canaveral and off SC, because there was no other ride to certain offshore wrecks, we have done trips off Sportfisherman where the only way back in the boat was through a tuna door. Ever try getting in a boat wearing 104's in pitching seas, no ladder, only a tuna door and have a big assed shark trying to get a taste as you leave the water? Typically these are the type of trips that are the predecessors to the MV Spree type trips.

    The artifacts in those pictures were the result of tireless digging in sand and muck. They were things that *no one* would ever see if these guys didn't find them. Does anyone really think some government funded, taxpayer dollar wasting beaureaucrat archaeologist is going to roll around in zero viz at 220' for 30 or 40 minutes to recover a chamber pot? Never happen, even if it had George Washingtons turd in it. And if it did happen, it would be locked away in a warehouse for future preservation and no one would ever see it again until it wound up as part of a lot on US Gov't Liquidators.

    If you could magically take the Rhine from drydock in perfect condition and sink it in its present location you'd be arrested for polluting the seas. But because it is there by the misfortune of war it is called Cultural Heritage. Same ship is both treasure and trash.

    I'm a diver, not an archaeologist or a politician. To be honest, if I found Noahs Ark tomorrow I would not share it. No one but my small inner circle of friends would *ever* hear about it because I would not want to deal with all of the crap that is dished out by people who have *NO* clue about the ground work it takes to figure out which are the worthwhile, diveable wrecks that result in enabling someone to put together recreational expeditions of this type. Do you think the Spree or the Ultimate Getaway acually went out and did these dives on their nickel to learn about them? Obviously not. They read about our and other peoples advenures and saw a business opportunity, which is fine because that is how we can share what we do with others.

    Rob, this is not intended as a personal attack. I respect your right to your opinion and agree with you when the wrecks are in a Great Lakes type situation where time will not ravage them. In the ocean these wrecks will be a pile of rubble in short time. When the Rhine collapses to the sand how many trips do you think there will be to it once they figure out that the dive is picking through a trash pile at 250?

    Not many I'm sure.

    Joe Citelli
    Last edited by Joe; 24th June 2008 at 00:46.

  4. #14
    Bill Reals breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals is just really nice breals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    351
    rEvo II Hybrid

    KISS Classic

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    Quote Originally Posted by PacketSniffer  View Original Post
    Visibility was for the most part excellent except for our last day trying to make a pass on the Wilkes Barre. Vis was so bad on the live boat drop that we weren't sure if we hit the wreck til we ran into rust. Even so, we weren't sure where we had landed. With that, we spent about 15 minutes at ~220fsw and decided to blow the bags.
    .
    Too bad about the Wilkes Barre having bad vis, it's an awesome wreck. My buddies and I used to do a 3 day trip out there every year to dive that boat. We loved it and always had amazing 100 foot vis. Next time we go out, I'm taking my rebreather, as filling doubles and deco bottles every dive got old real quick.

  5. #15
    RBW Member matthewbooth is an unknown quantity at this point matthewbooth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Austin TX
    Posts
    19
    Inspiration/Evolution

    Draeger

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    Here are my 2 cents for this trip. I agree with Richard and Mike that it was an excellent trip all around.

    I want to thank Mike and Richie for the great dive briefings that they gave us before we dove on each wreck. The briefings included the history of the wrecks and things that we would see on the dive. (For more information about the wrecks, you can read Mike's book) And, they also gave us a special presentation about their expedition to the Britannic (which can be seen on the History Channel).

    I also want to thank Frank and Melanie Wasson (the owners of the MV Spree) for putting on a fabulous trip. I'm looking forward to more tech diving from the Spree.

    In addition, I also want to give special thanks to the crew of the Spree: John Camp, Chris Parsons, Patti Davis-Landry, and Kelly Rockwood for taking care of us and feeding us for the week. Kudos also for Eric Keibler, the Dive Safety Officer, for the thankless job of trying to keep track of us diving. And, my special thanks to the two hardest working guys on the trip, Dave Snyder and Kenny Cruse, the gas blenders who made sure that we had the gas to do the dives.

    And yes, Richard had some awesome video of the diving.

  6. #16
    ~~~~~ #417 ~~~~~ PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer is a jewel in the rough PacketSniffer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    Houston
    Posts
    435

    Re: 2008 Dry Tortugas Technical Expedition (Deep Wrecks)

    Here is a sampling of video created by Chris Parsons (Spree Divemaster) taken from three HD cams. CLICK HERE FOR VIDEO

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts