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Thread: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

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    New Member jch1211 is an unknown quantity at this point jch1211's Avatar
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    cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Hello,

    I am new to this site. I have been reading/hearing things about a few upcoming rebreathers and was wondering if anyone out there has any information about them.

    First, I saw that DP Scandinavia has picked up poseidon and Cis-Lunar...does anyone know anything more than that?? Such as, when the new Cis may be available or what it will be compared to the mk5p?

    Also...whats going on with oceanic?? I keep hearing buzz about this thing that is supposed to be light years beyond whats available but nothing concrete.

    any information or links would be useful

    Thanks

    joe

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by jch1211  View Original Post
    Hello,
    First, I saw that DP Scandinavia has picked up poseidon and Cis-Lunar...does anyone know anything more than that?? Such as, when the new Cis may be available or what it will be compared to the mk5p?
    Straight onto the rumor-mill from an undisclosed 4th-hand source

    Teh Cis-Lunar has nothing to do with the original, except the name.
    There is supposedly an recreational version, wich is based upon EAC, with all kinds of bells and whistles. I was told that its only rated for 50m.
    Original pricerange was 4000€

    It sounds as if deeplife.co.dk with AlexDeas et. al, work has come to fruition, but no one knows or will confirm this (probably NDA's etc)!

    It was supposed to have been shown in prototype-state at Copenhagen Diveshow earlier this year, but FAILED to make an appearance.

    --------

    So if AD_WARD9 reads this, could he comment his designs IN GENERAL cencerning limits for recreational/eploration/proffesional use as possiblities for his clients?

    And are anyone going to make it to market with their pricetarget, or has he become to exspensive?

    Will the promised CO2-monitor be standard, or addon for the designs, his clients are developing?

    Regards Nicolai
    Nicolai

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanssing  View Original Post
    Straight onto the rumor-mill from an undisclosed 4th-hand source

    Teh Cis-Lunar has nothing to do with the original, except the name.
    There is supposedly an recreational version, wich is based upon EAC, with all kinds of bells and whistles. I was told that its only rated for 50m.
    Original pricerange was 4000€

    It sounds as if deeplife.co.dk with AlexDeas et. al, work has come to fruition, but no one knows or will confirm this (probably NDA's etc)!

    It was supposed to have been shown in prototype-state at Copenhagen Diveshow earlier this year, but FAILED to make an appearance.

    --------

    So if AD_WARD9 reads this, could he comment his designs IN GENERAL cencerning limits for recreational/eploration/proffesional use as possiblities for his clients?

    And are anyone going to make it to market with their pricetarget, or has he become to exspensive?

    Will the promised CO2-monitor be standard, or addon for the designs, his clients are developing?

    Regards Nicolai
    Nicolai
    From sources that have been in contact with Poseidon I have been able to gather this:
    The MK6 does not just have the name in common with MK5 / CIS Lunar. The CIS-Lunar patents have ben made to use as have Bill Stone been part of the development team. There are a set of units now in diving tests. The machine is to be launched in October as per plan and is currently in CE approval phase. The machine will initially be an sport type of machine with no multigas capability. The system is said to be upgradeable later on. The obvious reason would be the CE approval requirement that would be significantly more difficult with an more open envelope. The system uses back mounted CL and is using an cartridge type scrubber (although this is the first time I hear that it would actually be the EAC) One of Poseidons primary objective is to have an machine significantly cheaper than what is on the market now. Thats where it will differ from the MK5, being an machine of maximum performance rather than affordability. EAC does seem as bit strange knowing the cost of the cartridges, the speculation being that it could be a pre-packed lime/d-sorb cartridge. Target price is said to be set below 4000 €

    How sure are you that it actually is the EAC and not something else ?

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by P02  View Original Post
    One of Poseidons primary objective is to have an machine significantly cheaper than what is on the market now.

    Now.................where have I heard THAT before?????????

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by P02  View Original Post
    ....
    The machine will initially be an sport type of machine with no multigas capability.
    ....
    The system uses back mounted CL and is using an cartridge type scrubber (although this is the first time I hear that it would actually be the EAC)
    .....
    EAC does seem as bit strange knowing the cost of the cartridges, the speculation being that it could be a pre-packed lime/d-sorb cartridge.
    .....
    Target price is said to be set below 4000 €
    ....
    How sure are you that it actually is the EAC and not something else ?
    Not so sure at all about EAC - just automatically assumed that it was EAC.

    How about the depth-limit of 50m - is this consistent with what you have heard? It sort of agrees with the term Sports-rb.

    AS I from the rumors automatically associated it with Deeplife, I have probably been seeing things :o BMCL does NOT fit with the open-revolution design.

    AFAIK it is available as SCR and CCR right?
    Does ANYONE have a prototype picture ?

    Nicolai

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanssing  View Original Post
    Not so sure at all about EAC - just automatically assumed that it was EAC.

    How about the depth-limit of 50m - is this consistent with what you have heard? It sort of agrees with the term Sports-rb.

    AS I from the rumors automatically associated it with Deeplife, I have probably been seeing things :o BMCL does NOT fit with the open-revolution design.

    AFAIK it is available as SCR and CCR right?
    Does ANYONE have a prototype picture ?

    Nicolai

    Yes - there is some type of depth limit to the system in the original version - have not heard it would be 50 meters or how they would do that (supposedly with software). The purpose would be to achieve the CE certification, there are no other reason why to limit the machine. The machine was apparently suggested by the designer of Mk5 to have an plastic type battery (used in aerospace products with almost infinte life) which was rejected by posiedon out of product cost concerns. Poseidon is very limited with information on the unit apparently out of Intelectual Property / Patent concerns. There are supposedly several patents pending approval that togheter with the CE will determine the actual date of launch. From what i have heard there are plans for a instructor course during summer / fall on an liveabord in the red sea.

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by DepthCharge  View Original Post
    Now.................where have I heard THAT before?????????
    How many manufacturers of RB's are making good money out of them ?
    Im not talking of 2-6 people businesses working from some garage - but real companies with an distribution network. Do you think a well established company with a leading profile in the industry would accuire the CIS Lunar designs and patents and then spend 2 years of development only to start competing on a market where you sell 50 machines per year ? To me its pretty clear that there is an business case in there that says it will create a new market attracting more than the tech freaks and out compete the Inspirations, being the only ones that have been succsessfull so far. Whatever comes out of this will be different to what is out there from an business perspective, or it will be a failure

    Btw - Im not buying one - Im going for an Optima Fx

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanssing  View Original Post
    Not so sure at all about EAC - just automatically assumed that it was EAC.

    How about the depth-limit of 50m - is this consistent with what you have heard? It sort of agrees with the term Sports-rb.

    AS I from the rumors automatically associated it with Deeplife, I have probably been seeing things :o BMCL does NOT fit with the open-revolution design.

    AFAIK it is available as SCR and CCR right?
    Does ANYONE have a prototype picture ?

    Nicolai
    No - its an pure eCCR, One off my sources have seen one - compact, BMCL, standard side mounted tanks ( several tanks options possible) and a hard casing

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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by P02  View Original Post
    How many manufacturers of RB's are making good money out of them ?
    - but real companies with an distribution network. Do you think a well established company with a leading profile in the industry would accuire the CIS Lunar designs and patents and then spend 2 years of development only to start competing on a market where you sell 50 machines per year ?
    uhhh....there have been ALOT of larger mfg failures in this arena...try Oceanic with the Phibian, Cochran, Olympic Submarine with the CCR2000, US Divers with the Draeger lineup...all reputable mfg's with potential, distribution networks, sales force, etc...it's not about having this infrastructure, its about the fact that rebreathers are not for the masses (yet). We still have A LOOOOOONG way to go to standardize safety and design principles across brands/machines and likewise with training. That will open up the market. Rebreathers will need to be fool-proof enough to take a resort-course with it. Their capabilities far exceed the average recreational diver, which is the largest market in the dive industry. CCRs are all mission-specific, and meet a very VERY niche market, most of which is part of this forum. THE guys selling 50-100 units per year are where its at, and that is not going to change until the entire industry changes in a big way...pricepoint is a seperate issue.

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    New Member DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge is a jewel in the rough DepthCharge's Avatar
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    Re: cis-lunar mk6 and oceanic rebreathers

    Quote Originally Posted by P02  View Original Post
    How many manufacturers of RB's are making good money out of them ?
    Im not talking of 2-6 people businesses working from some garage - but real companies with an distribution network. Do you think a well established company with a leading profile in the industry would accuire the CIS Lunar designs and patents and then spend 2 years of development only to start competing on a market where you sell 50 machines per year ? To me its pretty clear that there is an business case in there that says it will create a new market attracting more than the tech freaks and out compete the Inspirations, being the only ones that have been succsessfull so far. Whatever comes out of this will be different to what is out there from an business perspective, or it will be a failure

    Btw - Im not buying one - Im going for an Optima Fx
    Just saying that several times this has been announced, and when production finally happens, the price is up. Dive-Rite tried it, and I consider their organization more than a "garage operation" and they couldn't pull it off.
    Don't get me wrong, I certainly hope that they can pull it off, but somehow I don't think a sub $6000 USD (even let alone a sub 5K) will happen.

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