Drysuit inflation

Hanssing · 9th April 2008, 18:46

Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski)

I guess it is how you were taught to use a drysuit.. I find exactly the opposite.. The wing is used mostly for buoyancy, and gas is only added to the drysuit to eliminate squeeze..

I NEVER use the ds for buoyancy.. too big a gas bubble to move around and too much of a risk should you go head up and the gas burps out your neck seal..

Well... no I'm autodidact in that regard

But since we dont change boyancy during the dive as we are on rebreather you dont really need a big bubble at depth. That is unless you want to be able to be negative with empty bailout, and/or i diving a thick neoprene DS.
Id ditch the BO-bottles or if its really bad flood the loop a little, if I got to positive during bailout.

I find that managing two bubbles (Loop + DS) is enough, adding the third in the wing is not my thing. Anyway thats offcouse a personal preference.

Regards
Nicolai - BTW there will be offboard pluging :-)

Dutchy · 9th April 2008, 19:50

Same here (and drysuit autodidact)... I like my profile with deflated wing better and get better insulation as a bonus. One of the distinct advantages of a rebreather is the little shift in weight (compared to OC) as not much gas is used and if the brown thing hits the fan I'm quite sure my buddy will hand me a kilo. Flooding would be the last resort but still a valid option after putting the drysuit in squeeeeeeze mode.

snicks · 9th April 2008, 20:17

You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you?

Maximum Respect!

Hanssing · 9th April 2008, 20:24

Quote: (Originally Posted by snicks)

You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you?
Maximum Respect!

No!
LAST ditch resort too avoid becomming too light is to partially flood a completely compromised loop.
There's two main-reasons for a complete OC-bailout:
Flood (in wich case is moot), and failing scrubber.
The last could perhaps be used for shallow deco so its really last ditch.
Just releasing all gas would hopefully be enough.

Nicolai

Dutchy · 9th April 2008, 21:21

Quote: (Originally Posted by snicks)

You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you?

Maximum Respect!

Yes and No. Usually the water is still a comfortable 6°C

so that's the 'NO' part. The yes part is based on a series of unfortunate experiences with a completely flooded drysuit (my LDS couldn't find the problem a zipper that failed every now and then). I have a few 60 minute dives logged with a wet drysuit. The undersuit did a great job in still keeping me relatively warm. (My hands were the weakest link) If we're talking about skipping deco combined with an uncontrolled ascent (that's effectively what we're talking about when underweighted) then yes I'd do that. It's not that I like it and I know it's a 'favourable' condition for DSC but I'd prefer it over an uncontrolled ascent and I'd prefer it over flooding my loop. My loop is life (assuming it can be used in the shallows). When it's gone and I'm on OC there's no more safety net. My wet drysuit and natural protective layer (bioprene) can withstand some cold...

***Decodiver*** · 10th April 2008, 08:21

Personally I run my buoyancy on my drysuit, as Nicolai says, I keep a small amount of gas in there to compensate for crushing and suck my wing negative before the dive.

On the rEvo my wing is plugged into the diluent (as I never got around to removing the stock inflation hose) and on my other units I run my wing and drysuit from offboards.

I have moved away from running my suit off my rich bailout, the thought of a heated vest in 50-80% worries me.

Cheers,

Dave Cooper.

grazie42 · 11th April 2008, 08:26

I´m more new, than new at this (I finished my course on Monday, I´ll put up a course-report soon too) but one thing I think everyone on the course found counter-intuitive was "going back" to using the DS for bouyancy.

I don´t see myself doing this for much longer. I think I´ll be running both wing and DS from a small "DS-bottle" and only using other gas-sources when I have to...

I don´t feel comfortable using diluent for bouyancy but of course ymmv...

Sune Jorgensen · 11th April 2008, 12:58

Quote: (Originally Posted by grazie42)

I´m more new, than new at this (I finished my course on Monday, I´ll put up a course-report soon too) but one thing I think everyone on the course found counter-intuitive was "going back" to using the DS for bouyancy.

Yes thats true, and I look forward to the report

Sad you lost your uv-camera on our last dive

Quote:

I don´t see myself doing this for much longer. I think I´ll be running both wing and DS from a small "DS-bottle" and only using other gas-sources when I have to...

For the shallow air dives I can do now, I will use the onboard Dil.
When I go over to trimix, I will use my 1.5 liter argon bottle for wing and DS.
Beside I don't like to be tethered to my bailout/deco bottle.
Also I will enjoy my shallow shore and habour dives below 6-7 meters even more without any extra bottles

Philippe GERIN · 11th April 2008, 20:28

[quote=Decodiver;180683]Personally I run my buoyancy on my drysuit./quote]
I do to even though I don't intend to. That is I found that on my rigs and the way I place ballast on them with the tanks, BP... just inflating my suit for insulation/comfort more or less (but pretty close) gives me the buoyancy control I need. Hence I rarely use my wing except at the surface.
I'd talk about the importance of having a balanced rig but that's been:

Best
Philippe

**hoppyinca** · 12th April 2008, 00:08

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy)

...natural protective layer (bioprene)...

bioprene, I like it!

while I do not dive an rEvo, I thought I would weight in...

I use off board gas for all bouyancy control; wing as primary BC only enough gas in the DS to keep off the squeeze.

the off board I use is a butt mounted bottle which will also be my bailout for shallower dives when no "stage bottles" are needed.

I look at all on-board gas as being dedicated to life support only! I have OC bailout to on-brd DIL, that's it.

At the risk of starting the Ar discussion; I like keeping the bouyancy gas breathable... that way all gas I am carrying can be used in a pinch, if absolutely necessary...

my 2 cents.

hoppy

9th April 2008, 18:46	#11 (permalink)
Hanssing flap-flop ..... flap-flop Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Denmark Posts: 347	Re: Drysuit inflation Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski) I guess it is how you were taught to use a drysuit.. I find exactly the opposite.. The wing is used mostly for buoyancy, and gas is only added to the drysuit to eliminate squeeze.. I NEVER use the ds for buoyancy.. too big a gas bubble to move around and too much of a risk should you go head up and the gas burps out your neck seal.. Well... no I'm autodidact in that regard But since we dont change boyancy during the dive as we are on rebreather you dont really need a big bubble at depth. That is unless you want to be able to be negative with empty bailout, and/or i diving a thick neoprene DS. Id ditch the BO-bottles or if its really bad flood the loop a little, if I got to positive during bailout. I find that managing two bubbles (Loop + DS) is enough, adding the third in the wing is not my thing. Anyway thats offcouse a personal preference. Regards Nicolai - BTW there will be offboard pluging :-) __________________ Woohooo - I can change my rEvo! Its going to be bitchin' tricked out piece of gear
(Online)

9th April 2008, 19:50	#12 (permalink)
Dutchy SK#007 Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Nieuwegein (The Netherlands) Posts: 699	Re: Drysuit inflation Same here (and drysuit autodidact)... I like my profile with deflated wing better and get better insulation as a bonus. One of the distinct advantages of a rebreather is the little shift in weight (compared to OC) as not much gas is used and if the brown thing hits the fan I'm quite sure my buddy will hand me a kilo. Flooding would be the last resort but still a valid option after putting the drysuit in squeeeeeeze mode. __________________ = This post is environmentally friendly. It is composed of 100% recycled electrons only. = SK #007
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9th April 2008, 20:17	#13 (permalink)
snicks New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 26	Re: Drysuit inflation You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you? Maximum Respect! __________________ Weltmacht mit drei Buchstaben? ICH!
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9th April 2008, 20:24	#14 (permalink)
Hanssing flap-flop ..... flap-flop Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Denmark Posts: 347	Re: Drysuit inflation Quote: (Originally Posted by snicks) You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you? Maximum Respect! No! LAST ditch resort too avoid becomming too light is to partially flood a completely compromised loop. There's two main-reasons for a complete OC-bailout: Flood (in wich case is moot), and failing scrubber. The last could perhaps be used for shallow deco so its really last ditch. Just releasing all gas would hopefully be enough. Nicolai __________________ Woohooo - I can change my rEvo! Its going to be bitchin' tricked out piece of gear
(Online)

9th April 2008, 21:21	#15 (permalink)
Dutchy SK#007 Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Nieuwegein (The Netherlands) Posts: 699	Re: Drysuit inflation Quote: (Originally Posted by snicks) You flood your DS in 4°C water with deco ahead of you? Maximum Respect! Yes and No. Usually the water is still a comfortable 6°C so that's the 'NO' part. The yes part is based on a series of unfortunate experiences with a completely flooded drysuit (my LDS couldn't find the problem a zipper that failed every now and then). I have a few 60 minute dives logged with a wet drysuit. The undersuit did a great job in still keeping me relatively warm. (My hands were the weakest link) If we're talking about skipping deco combined with an uncontrolled ascent (that's effectively what we're talking about when underweighted) then yes I'd do that. It's not that I like it and I know it's a 'favourable' condition for DSC but I'd prefer it over an uncontrolled ascent and I'd prefer it over flooding my loop. My loop is life (assuming it can be used in the shallows). When it's gone and I'm on OC there's no more safety net. My wet drysuit and natural protective layer (bioprene) can withstand some cold... __________________ = This post is environmentally friendly. It is composed of 100% recycled electrons only. = SK #007 Last edited by Dutchy : 9th April 2008 at 21:25.
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10th April 2008, 08:21	#16 (permalink)
*Decodiver* Administrator Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Ouroboros rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Sport Kiss Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Geneva Posts: 2,168	Re: Drysuit inflation Personally I run my buoyancy on my drysuit, as Nicolai says, I keep a small amount of gas in there to compensate for crushing and suck my wing negative before the dive. On the rEvo my wing is plugged into the diluent (as I never got around to removing the stock inflation hose) and on my other units I run my wing and drysuit from offboards. I have moved away from running my suit off my rich bailout, the thought of a heated vest in 50-80% worries me. Cheers, Dave Cooper. __________________ CCR/OC Trimix Instructor Trainer CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on Megalodon/COPIS-Megalodon/KISS/Sport KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel www.zerogravitydiving.com Rebreather World Terms & Conditions
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11th April 2008, 08:26	#17 (permalink)
grazie42 Eager Newbie! Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 29	Re: Drysuit inflation I´m more new, than new at this (I finished my course on Monday, I´ll put up a course-report soon too) but one thing I think everyone on the course found counter-intuitive was "going back" to using the DS for bouyancy. I don´t see myself doing this for much longer. I think I´ll be running both wing and DS from a small "DS-bottle" and only using other gas-sources when I have to... I don´t feel comfortable using diluent for bouyancy but of course ymmv...
(Online)

11th April 2008, 12:58	#18 (permalink)
Sune Jorgensen New Member Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Denmark Posts: 12	Re: Drysuit inflation Quote: (Originally Posted by grazie42) I´m more new, than new at this (I finished my course on Monday, I´ll put up a course-report soon too) but one thing I think everyone on the course found counter-intuitive was "going back" to using the DS for bouyancy. Yes thats true, and I look forward to the report Sad you lost your uv-camera on our last dive Quote: I don´t see myself doing this for much longer. I think I´ll be running both wing and DS from a small "DS-bottle" and only using other gas-sources when I have to... For the shallow air dives I can do now, I will use the onboard Dil. When I go over to trimix, I will use my 1.5 liter argon bottle for wing and DS. Beside I don't like to be tethered to my bailout/deco bottle. Also I will enjoy my shallow shore and habour dives below 6-7 meters even more without any extra bottles __________________ /Sune rEvo by choice
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11th April 2008, 20:28	#19 (permalink)
Philippe GERIN ccr apprentice Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2005 Location: Strasbourg, France Posts: 626	Re: Drysuit inflation [quote=Decodiver;180683]Personally I run my buoyancy on my drysuit./quote] I do to even though I don't intend to. That is I found that on my rigs and the way I place ballast on them with the tanks, BP... just inflating my suit for insulation/comfort more or less (but pretty close) gives me the buoyancy control I need. Hence I rarely use my wing except at the surface. I'd talk about the importance of having a balanced rig but that's been: Best Philippe
(Online)

12th April 2008, 00:08	#20 (permalink)
hoppyinca New Member Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Laguna Niguel, CA USA Posts: 250	Re: Drysuit inflation Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy) ...natural protective layer (bioprene)... bioprene, I like it! while I do not dive an rEvo, I thought I would weight in... I use off board gas for all bouyancy control; wing as primary BC only enough gas in the DS to keep off the squeeze. the off board I use is a butt mounted bottle which will also be my bailout for shallower dives when no "stage bottles" are needed. I look at all on-board gas as being dedicated to life support only! I have OC bailout to on-brd DIL, that's it. At the risk of starting the Ar discussion; I like keeping the bouyancy gas breathable... that way all gas I am carrying can be used in a pinch, if absolutely necessary... my 2 cents. hoppy __________________ "The government is merely a servant... merely a temporary servant; it cannot be its prerogative to determine what is right and what is wrong, and decide who is a patriot and who isn't. Its function is to obey orders, not originate them..." - Mark Twain
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