BOV-less rEvo

Bech · 16th March 2008, 18:44

Untill recently, I was against the idea of the BOV. Then I had a small CO2 intoxication, and I realized at 300 m of the cave's exit that nobody can see you have a problem on the rebreather.

With the BOV doing BO is not a problem, try to do it at 300m from the exit and/or deep. This is a serious problem if you are hyperventilating...

The question is not if it will hapend but when it will.

I bought a Golem Gear BOV for my rEvo and I am happy with it

Raph

**kybrt** · 16th March 2008, 18:47

well i have a couple of cents for this discussion. i am currently pursuing a bov for my revo. this is why.

I did a dive in florida in january,diving siegel grove max 120fsw, second dive about 1.5 hrs on scrubber total, fresh fill, steel 19s onboard and al80 bail,wetsuit.i was alos kinda fat have since lost 30lbs and will lose more. toward the end of the second dive<abt another 90 min> i began to feel bad,tough to breathe, oxygen starved i felt, like i wanted out. i dil flushed a couple of times, and it didnt seem to correct things.almost ascended wrong mooring intentionally becasue i wanted out. thne my buddy insisted on right mooring, as we swam i thought the words bail out, then asked myself why, then thought *feck this*, and bailed to oc. two breathes abd my vision and head cleared, two more and i felt completely calm and fine. ascend w/o further incident, except i ran out of dil after i tried to go back on loop at 20fsw<doh!>i did close loop when i bailed, but somewhere while ascending i drained it for buoyancy and i think thats where i hammered the dil.

anyways maybe just be being a putz, but i think a bov would have made the decision easier. i got a golem and mounted it, but im not happy with size. i am purusing a pelegian right now b/c of the flapper issues and size. at some point i will have one or other up for sale, i need to figure it out first. i am also looking at panorama ffm for future,maybe?

i know it hammers the business model but i think a bov is the way to go, especially for the less experienced like me. maybe its using technology to solve a technique problem, but it seems reasonable.

i thank paul dave and joe for their emphasis on survival training in my mod1, espeically the no mask buddy breathing while swimming,that confidence came in handy.

paulraymaekers · 16th March 2008, 18:59

Quote: (Originally Posted by kybrt)

well i have a couple of cents for this discussion. i am currently pursuing a bov for my revo. this is why.

I did a dive in florida in january,diving siegel grove max 120fsw, second dive about 1.5 hrs on scrubber total, fresh fill, steel 19s onboard and al80 bail,wetsuit.i was alos kinda fat have since lost 30lbs and will lose more. toward the end of the second dive<abt another 90 min> i began to feel bad,tough to breathe, oxygen starved i felt, like i wanted out. i dil flushed a couple of times, and it didnt seem to correct things.almost ascended wrong mooring intentionally becasue i wanted out. thne my buddy insisted on right mooring, as we swam i thought the words bail out, then asked myself why, then thought *feck this*, and bailed to oc. two breathes abd my vision and head cleared, two more and i felt completely calm and fine. ascend w/o further incident, except i ran out of dil after i tried to go back on loop at 20fsw<doh!>i did close loop when i bailed, but somewhere while ascending i drained it for buoyancy and i think thats where i hammered the dil.

anyways maybe just be being a putz, but i think a bov would have made the decision easier. i got a golem and mounted it, but im not happy with size. i am purusing a pelegian right now b/c of the flapper issues and size. at some point i will have one or other up for sale, i need to figure it out first. i am also looking at panorama ffm for future,maybe?

i know it hammers the business model but i think a bov is the way to go, especially for the less experienced like me. maybe its using technology to solve a technique problem, but it seems reasonable.

i thank paul dave and joe for their emphasis on survival training in my mod1, espeically the no mask buddy breathing while swimming,that confidence came in handy.

hello al, can you please specify exactly how much time you got on your scrubber, and what cycles you did before the dive?
what sorb did you use

why I ask, we have NEVER, and I emphasise, NEVER heard of any issue with CO2 on a rEvo scrubber that had fresh fill and was then used for 3 hours, like prescribed.. this is very strange

can there be other influences involved??

paul

Ryan · 16th March 2008, 19:23

Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul?

Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard.

The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this.

paulraymaekers · 16th March 2008, 19:44

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ryan)

Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul?

Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard.

The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this.

back home Ryan ? :-)

did not have the opportunity to say decent goodbye in london

.. w'll meet again in cayman :-) (pink!!!!)

paul

**kybrt** · 16th March 2008, 21:01

hey paul,

first i dont discount that i may have done something else dumb that i dont even realize, it is possible. im not saying that its the machine,just tha a bov might make it better..

second i bought sorb from james of the us Rebreather World store, he was on the trip and a few guys were using that keg and no other reported problems so i think thats not it,

third it was first dive on that load, max depth 111fsw for 81 minute total run time, time in at 1026hrs then second dive at 1354hrs 114fsw for TRT of 93 min.both dives we dove from stern morings and swam to the bow.

i see here i had 21/35 as a dil, just remembered that. o2 also.the next day i had air and fresh sorb, from the same keg.

the other thing as im thinking about it now is i was a little pressed for time when i filled the cans, maybe i didnt smack them enuff?

and yes i know i need to build more time with the machine before i do stupid things with it,my bad.

Mark Chase · 16th March 2008, 21:40

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ryan)

Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul?

Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard.

The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this.

I often jump in to do a 70m dive with 150ish bar in my 3ltr. Like when i am on a livaboard and i am making three dill cylinders do a weeks diving.

Assuming a C02 hit at 70 and a RMV of 30 my 150bar of dill would last 1.8mins open loop then id loose dill and wing inflation.

On a good day with a nice 200bar fill I could get 2.5mins

People who have had C02 hits tell me they felt it impossible to hold their breath long enough to switch from the loop to OC bailout.

I have had a caustic cocktail and having breathed in the caustic material you breath out fast and start to retch. On a BOV you just turn a lever and your isolated from the caustic material and on breathable gas. On loop you have to bailout whilst breathing out, retching and with burned lips and tong.

I see turning a lever to go OC on to a large off board cylinder as simplifying things and not complicating them

ATB

Mark

Mark Chase · 16th March 2008, 21:41

Quote: (Originally Posted by paulraymaekers)

hello al, can you please specify exactly how much time you got on your scrubber, and what cycles you did before the dive?
what sorb did you use

why I ask, we have NEVER, and I emphasise, NEVER heard of any issue with CO2 on a rEvo scrubber that had fresh fill and was then used for 3 hours, like prescribed.. this is very strange

can there be other influences involved??

paul

Could have been a retained C02 hit and nothing to do with the scrubber??

ATB

Mark

**kybrt** · 16th March 2008, 22:28

i guess anything is possible. never had problems w/co2 before on oc, even w/ a fair amount of deep mix dives.

Gilles · 16th March 2008, 22:55

Quote: (Originally Posted by paulraymaekers)

you COULD be right :-),...
adding a BOV also complicates your setup a bit, the breathing hose is a bit less flexible, do you connect it to in- or outboard gas, do you switch the gas of your BOV when you go down with hypoxic gas or not..

...

You may connect it to both, with offboard IP set the same or a few psi less than your onboard. Dil supply controlled simply with a few twists of the onboard supply valve (see attached schematic that works on a Meg).

Put your hypox gas offboard, and a rich mix Inboard and close/open onboard when descending/ascending the appropriate depth. The dil flush approach has the same risks with hypox gas (nearly died from this once).

A well placed swivel mitigates hose flexibility.

A well executed flush works, especially when sane...for a minute or so. I just want to emphasize not under-estimating the incapacitation potential of CO2. I could imagine someone flushing away their whole onboard supply because they were to freaked out to verticalize their trim before doing so

. Really wish to see the good Revo record (and other mCCR's) maintained.

Strong contender for a 2nd Rebreather ya know

.

16th March 2008, 18:44	#11 (permalink)
Bech New Member Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 41	Re: BOV-less rEvo Untill recently, I was against the idea of the BOV. Then I had a small CO2 intoxication, and I realized at 300 m of the cave's exit that nobody can see you have a problem on the rebreather. With the BOV doing BO is not a problem, try to do it at 300m from the exit and/or deep. This is a serious problem if you are hyperventilating... The question is not if it will hapend but when it will. I bought a Golem Gear BOV for my rEvo and I am happy with it Raph
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 18:47	#12 (permalink)
kybrt too legit to quit Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Neuw Yawk Posts: 338	Re: BOV-less rEvo well i have a couple of cents for this discussion. i am currently pursuing a bov for my revo. this is why. I did a dive in florida in january,diving siegel grove max 120fsw, second dive about 1.5 hrs on scrubber total, fresh fill, steel 19s onboard and al80 bail,wetsuit.i was alos kinda fat have since lost 30lbs and will lose more. toward the end of the second dive<abt another 90 min> i began to feel bad,tough to breathe, oxygen starved i felt, like i wanted out. i dil flushed a couple of times, and it didnt seem to correct things.almost ascended wrong mooring intentionally becasue i wanted out. thne my buddy insisted on right mooring, as we swam i thought the words bail out, then asked myself why, then thought feck this, and bailed to oc. two breathes abd my vision and head cleared, two more and i felt completely calm and fine. ascend w/o further incident, except i ran out of dil after i tried to go back on loop at 20fsw<doh!>i did close loop when i bailed, but somewhere while ascending i drained it for buoyancy and i think thats where i hammered the dil. anyways maybe just be being a putz, but i think a bov would have made the decision easier. i got a golem and mounted it, but im not happy with size. i am purusing a pelegian right now b/c of the flapper issues and size. at some point i will have one or other up for sale, i need to figure it out first. i am also looking at panorama ffm for future,maybe? i know it hammers the business model but i think a bov is the way to go, especially for the less experienced like me. maybe its using technology to solve a technique problem, but it seems reasonable. i thank paul dave and joe for their emphasis on survival training in my mod1, espeically the no mask buddy breathing while swimming,that confidence came in handy. __________________ Marv Fidelis Ad Mortem www.diveboatkaren.com
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 18:59	#13 (permalink)
paulraymaekers rEvo's daddy Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: belgium Posts: 1,498	Re: BOV-less rEvo Quote: (Originally Posted by kybrt) well i have a couple of cents for this discussion. i am currently pursuing a bov for my revo. this is why. I did a dive in florida in january,diving siegel grove max 120fsw, second dive about 1.5 hrs on scrubber total, fresh fill, steel 19s onboard and al80 bail,wetsuit.i was alos kinda fat have since lost 30lbs and will lose more. toward the end of the second dive<abt another 90 min> i began to feel bad,tough to breathe, oxygen starved i felt, like i wanted out. i dil flushed a couple of times, and it didnt seem to correct things.almost ascended wrong mooring intentionally becasue i wanted out. thne my buddy insisted on right mooring, as we swam i thought the words bail out, then asked myself why, then thought feck this, and bailed to oc. two breathes abd my vision and head cleared, two more and i felt completely calm and fine. ascend w/o further incident, except i ran out of dil after i tried to go back on loop at 20fsw<doh!>i did close loop when i bailed, but somewhere while ascending i drained it for buoyancy and i think thats where i hammered the dil. anyways maybe just be being a putz, but i think a bov would have made the decision easier. i got a golem and mounted it, but im not happy with size. i am purusing a pelegian right now b/c of the flapper issues and size. at some point i will have one or other up for sale, i need to figure it out first. i am also looking at panorama ffm for future,maybe? i know it hammers the business model but i think a bov is the way to go, especially for the less experienced like me. maybe its using technology to solve a technique problem, but it seems reasonable. i thank paul dave and joe for their emphasis on survival training in my mod1, espeically the no mask buddy breathing while swimming,that confidence came in handy. hello al, can you please specify exactly how much time you got on your scrubber, and what cycles you did before the dive? what sorb did you use why I ask, we have NEVER, and I emphasise, NEVER heard of any issue with CO2 on a rEvo scrubber that had fresh fill and was then used for 3 hours, like prescribed.. this is very strange can there be other influences involved?? paul __________________ www.rEvo-rebreathers.com .... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials... Last edited by paulraymaekers : 16th March 2008 at 21:29.
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 19:23	#14 (permalink)
Ryan New Member Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Pelagian Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Classic Kiss rEvo Pelagian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: On the edge of the gulf stream! Posts: 74	Re: BOV-less rEvo Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul? Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard. The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this. __________________ www.ReefPhoto.com 877-453-8927 954-537-0644
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 19:44	#15 (permalink)
paulraymaekers rEvo's daddy Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: belgium Posts: 1,498	Re: BOV-less rEvo Quote: (Originally Posted by Ryan) Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul? Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard. The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this. back home Ryan ? :-) did not have the opportunity to say decent goodbye in london .. w'll meet again in cayman :-) (pink!!!!) paul __________________ www.rEvo-rebreathers.com .... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials...
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 21:01	#16 (permalink)
kybrt too legit to quit Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Neuw Yawk Posts: 338	Re: BOV-less rEvo hey paul, first i dont discount that i may have done something else dumb that i dont even realize, it is possible. im not saying that its the machine,just tha a bov might make it better.. second i bought sorb from james of the us Rebreather World store, he was on the trip and a few guys were using that keg and no other reported problems so i think thats not it, third it was first dive on that load, max depth 111fsw for 81 minute total run time, time in at 1026hrs then second dive at 1354hrs 114fsw for TRT of 93 min.both dives we dove from stern morings and swam to the bow. i see here i had 21/35 as a dil, just remembered that. o2 also.the next day i had air and fresh sorb, from the same keg. the other thing as im thinking about it now is i was a little pressed for time when i filled the cans, maybe i didnt smack them enuff? and yes i know i need to build more time with the machine before i do stupid things with it,my bad. __________________ Marv Fidelis Ad Mortem www.diveboatkaren.com
(Offline)

16th March 2008, 21:40	#17 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,693	Re: BOV-less rEvo Quote: (Originally Posted by Ryan) Why make things easy when you can have them difficult, right Paul? Personally, I have no need for a bov. I can go open loop just as easily as I can switch that switch, and that buys all the time I need to get to offboard. The smallest DSV available is a key feature for me, as I need as little between me and my viewfinders as is possible. BOV also complicate this. I often jump in to do a 70m dive with 150ish bar in my 3ltr. Like when i am on a livaboard and i am making three dill cylinders do a weeks diving. Assuming a C02 hit at 70 and a RMV of 30 my 150bar of dill would last 1.8mins open loop then id loose dill and wing inflation. On a good day with a nice 200bar fill I could get 2.5mins People who have had C02 hits tell me they felt it impossible to hold their breath long enough to switch from the loop to OC bailout. I have had a caustic cocktail and having breathed in the caustic material you breath out fast and start to retch. On a BOV you just turn a lever and your isolated from the caustic material and on breathable gas. On loop you have to bailout whilst breathing out, retching and with burned lips and tong. I see turning a lever to go OC on to a large off board cylinder as simplifying things and not complicating them ATB Mark __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System
(Online)

16th March 2008, 21:41	#18 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,693	Re: BOV-less rEvo Quote: (Originally Posted by paulraymaekers) hello al, can you please specify exactly how much time you got on your scrubber, and what cycles you did before the dive? what sorb did you use why I ask, we have NEVER, and I emphasise, NEVER heard of any issue with CO2 on a rEvo scrubber that had fresh fill and was then used for 3 hours, like prescribed.. this is very strange can there be other influences involved?? paul Could have been a retained C02 hit and nothing to do with the scrubber?? ATB Mark __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System
(Online)

16th March 2008, 22:28	#19 (permalink)
kybrt too legit to quit Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Neuw Yawk Posts: 338	Re: BOV-less rEvo i guess anything is possible. never had problems w/co2 before on oc, even w/ a fair amount of deep mix dives. __________________ Marv Fidelis Ad Mortem www.diveboatkaren.com
(Offline)

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

LinkBacks (?) LinkBack to this Thread: http://www.rebreatherworld.com/revo-rebreather/18012-bov-less-revo.html
Posted By	For	Type	Date
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	27th March 2008 10:45
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	21st March 2008 11:29
Montres de Plongée - recycleur... ça fait peur... (désolé lien en anglais)	This thread	Refback	18th March 2008 13:28
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	17th March 2008 18:37
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	17th March 2008 17:17
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	17th March 2008 16:45
Glandouille et Hypercapnie	This thread	Refback	17th March 2008 16:29