just got back... and found the rEvo-battle

paulraymaekers

Hello all, I can't go away for a week or every-one is fighting...

first: I had a great week at pirates cove dive center: was there for the rebreather week, and now the wreck week is going on... wish I was still there!!!
the crew is simply super: thanks john, carolina, uwe, heiko (??), francis and all the others that simply make your week great!
met a lot of interesting people.. bruce and linn, ron and patty, mel and curt, bob and amy,
the manufacturors, kim, kevin and phil, mike,... and sorry cause I already know I forget names...
I'm in for next year, and not for one week!!!

and now for the last time, conc the rEvo in the states, and dave's position
I will not come back on it, please be satisfied with the info: If I make an agreement with someone, I keep on that agreement: everybody who knows me, can tell you.
I agreed with dave in 2006 that he would get a unit, for testing, playing, doing what he's good at: making conversions, finding out what else you can do with the rig etc etc. This was long before we set out the rule that anyone who wants to buy a unit, must first follow a course (just like the other beta's did not follow a recognised course at the start, because there was no...)
the reason why he got his unit later then the others, had to do with the terms and conditions, agreements between both of us.

when dave would go into training on the unit, just like any instructor he will pass by a recognised organisation, because this is a rule set out by... ME!

regards
paul

__________________
www.rEvo-rebreathers.com

.... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials...

schford

Thanks for clearing that up for us Paul. Makes perfect sense to me.

__________________
Bailout and Kit Management account for Murphy's Law

The only bad question is one you did not ask and later wish you had.

Use of Rebreather World is subject to the Rebreather World Terms & Conditions of Use

Dave Sutton

Says the guy who yesterday was giving me a hard time....

Thanks Paul. Can we get back to the (excellent) rig? Mark Harding and I will be diving this week with it, and I'll take some photos to share.


Best,


Dave

__________________
"Changes in Lattitudes, Changes in Attitudes, Nothing remains quite the same".... www.nobubblediving.com

moley

Thanks for clearing that up for us Paul. Makes perfect sense to me.

__________________
You think I know nothing.....and I do!!!

Steve

I'm still a bit confused as to how new instructors come on board.

I really don't want to contribute to the slanging match and I'm glad you are here now to set the record straight Paul. As there seems to have been some misinformation put forward in another thread. A few questions....

My main experience is with ISC, the Meg and Leon. Leon is an IT and the manufacturer. He trains all of the Meg instructors. This is what I'm referencing my questions to.

What is your process for introducing new instructors? ie

Do they need to do a users course and get the hours up before qualifying to teach? Or can they teach straight away with no experience on the unit?

Do they have to be endorsed by you?

Do you have any thoughts on the agencies? Preferences/exclusions.

Do your instructors get a free T-Shirt?

That ought to do for now. Cheers in advance

__________________
WARNING: I contain occasional coarse language, extreme sexual references, nudity, and adult themes, which may offend some people - Usually churchy types.

paulraymaekers

I'm still a bit confused as to how new instructors come on board.

rule n° 1: you can only become instructor when I approve it!

rule n° 2: to become an instructor you must own a unit and dive it!

rule n° 3: if you are already instructor CCR (mccr or eccr) you can become rEvo instructor trough an instructor cross-over, and after having done your hours on the unit

a) if trough ANDI, it can be done by me, or by the only other ANDI rEvo IT approved by me (pim van der horst in the netherlands) (as I already approved the ANDI course)

b) if trough another agency, that has not yet the course and material ready, it can only be done by the manufacturer, means ME, cause i have to approve the course the instructor is using
once course and material complete and approved by me, IT's of other agencies CAN be formed, when approved by ME

Do you have any thoughts on the agencies? Preferences/exclusions.

just ask me and I will consider

Do your instructors get a free T-Shirt?

no :-)

regards
paul

__________________
www.rEvo-rebreathers.com

.... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials...

Steve

Great to hear. Thanks

__________________
WARNING: I contain occasional coarse language, extreme sexual references, nudity, and adult themes, which may offend some people - Usually churchy types.

Decodiver

Steve raises some good questions that have been answered by Paul.

To demonstrate the actual process.

As an Instructor I have attended the factory initially to be trained by Paul, I have received my unit, which I paid for and completed over 30 hours on it.

I have written the PSA standards and exam that have been reviewed and agreed by Paul and also liaised with IANTD UK to get a course in motion from them.

I understand that Instructor representation is geographically based (like we do with ISC) and certainly looking at the European Instructors these are people who have long experience with numerous CCRs, all of the European Instructors that I know are also mCCR Instructor Trainers on other units, so Paul has done his homework in ensuring a solid foundation of mCCR and eCCR diving experience.

As for the t-shirt, well I am still waiting for one from APD, CCRB and Jetsam. I do have a number of baseball caps from ISC though .

Cheers,

Dave Cooper.

__________________
CCR/OC Trimix Instructor Trainer
CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on
Megalodon/COPIS-Megalodon/KISS/Sport KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel

www.zerogravitydiving.com

Rebreather World Terms & Conditions

schford

Dave,

What I was and am concerned about it that there is a fair open and transparant process to all in the community. Rebreather World is used as a mechanism to market new Rebreathers (as it should be) and I think as a result it is important we have that transparant process.

How a question on which Agencies certified you as an Instructor or IT is having a go I do not know - you could quite easily have said I am not an Instructor yet, but intend taking training to become one, as I am such a fan of this unit.

You did not but said to me you would be teaching the seed ITs in the states and that you had been assisting with the design for the last 5 years.

If that is the case and it is not all Pauls Baby? and you had told us that you had actually been part of the design team for 5 years, I would have viewed it differently although I still believe that to Instruct it is neccessary to have a background and formal training in provision of Rebreather training (both from a quality and litigation point of view) and the skillsets between a good designer and Instructor are different (not to say you can not have both eg Paul, Kevin gurr, Leon Scamahorn, Pete Ready etc etc)

I had 2 specific concerns both of which had been addressed by Paul.

1 - The fact that it appeared to be one rule for some in terms of training when you buy a unit and another for others - now I understand that Paul agreed to supply your unit before he made the rule we have clarity and consistancy.

2 - The impression that someone could jump straight to training Instructors comapred to the courses and time and effort other members put in - now I see that a process is being followed and you will be trained and certified by ANDI to teach users it makes sense to me, if not again we would have one rule for some and another for the rest of the instructors who are members of the community.

I am sorry you feel like I am having a go but I value, clarity, consistancy and honesty for all members of our community.

Stuart

__________________
Bailout and Kit Management account for Murphy's Law

The only bad question is one you did not ask and later wish you had.

Use of Rebreather World is subject to the Rebreather World Terms & Conditions of Use

divetheworld

Hope you and/or Dave can just add a bit to that for me.
Who produces the training material for instructors/IT/students?
Guessing, you produce the training material for instructors and deliver a factory course for them.
The instructor/s or agency produces a student course which you approve.
That about it?

Sounds simple enough.


Thanks,

Brent

__________________