Bail Out - On or Off

botle maker · 13th April 2007, 15:27

I always dive with a 7 on the left with valve on ready to go this contains a gas I can use at max depth of dive if not using He, this also feeds my suit,on gas dives I run the suit on a seperate bottle Any cylinder on the right is a rich deco gas turned off until its needed.(periodically turned on and off through dive) if I am not happy with the box I go off loop and onto left cylinder first regardless of depth this needs to be a reaction not something you have to think about.

**Freef** · 13th April 2007, 15:44

Bailout is for bailing out and should be available at all times and depths.

A friend had a bad CO2 and she struggled to get onto the bailout, let alone worrying about turnign tanks on.

As for the worry of gas leaking, a quick detune could solve the problem, as could monitoring your gas throughout the dive.

***Decodiver*** · 13th April 2007, 15:48

Both on with shutoff on the rich mix.

In any case I run my wing from the lean and my drysuit from the rich.

Cheers,

Dave Cooper.

**Freef** · 13th April 2007, 16:02

Quote: (Originally Posted by Decodiver)

...and my drysuit from the rich.

If you are using 80%, don't have a curry the night before in case your underkit generates static and a spark...

**nigelh** · 13th April 2007, 16:08

Bailouts are off but the BOV is on the DIL.
Darn it the bailouts get filled when they come back from test and that's it.
They get pressurised to check they are full but that's it.

I've seen too many stages freeflow when you hit the water and since I can get instant gas via a quarter turn of the thing in my mouth that will do while I decide what to do next.

Joe · 13th April 2007, 16:11

Most of the time pressurized, off with 2nd stage shutoff valve closed (and OPV on 1st stage). Sometimes with tank valve slightly opened and with 2nd stage shutoff closed.

In any event, I have long ago pattern trained myself to instinctively go to the tank valve, tug on the 2nd stage shut off and tap the purge button as I place the reg in my mouth when going to a stage, deco bottle etc.

The method I use is to remove reg with right hand while turning valve and steadying tank with my left hand. Then I place reg in my mouth with right hand while tracing the hose and tugging on the shut off with my left and tapping purge with my right. It is done in a single fluid motion and adds no time to the process.

My logic is that a tank turned on can accidently empty on you plus it can inadvertantly be off when you think it is on so it is better to treat *every* tank as though the valve is closed until you *know* otherwise. That way you never get a surprise.

The reason for the shutoff is not only to prevent loss of gas, but IMO, more importantly, to prevent a depressurized second stage from loosening and not delivering gas when you need it.

Sutty · 13th April 2007, 16:46

I was taught to have bailout on, I have wondered about the wisdom of this occasionally but never had a problem, then a minor event on a liveaboard trip convinced me it was the only way to go :

Kitted up for 2nd dive of day, clipped on my bailout (11l ali rental tank), went to turn it on, knob just turned without opening the valve (after very slight resistance initially). What had happened was that I had left the tank on after the 1st dive and the square hole in the knob which fits over the valve stem was partially rounded off, trying to turn on a valve that was already on was enough to finish rounding off the hole so the knob could just spin. If it had been in a similar state but "off" underwater when I went to bail out things could have been interesting!

Neil

rdmmdr · 13th April 2007, 17:32

bov on dil, bailout on scond stage off
rick

NEwreckdiver · 13th April 2007, 18:21

Quote: (Originally Posted by Joe)

Most of the time pressurized, off with 2nd stage shutoff valve closed (and OPV on 1st stage). Sometimes with tank valve slightly opened and with 2nd stage shutoff closed.

The reason for the shutoff is not only to prevent loss of gas, but IMO, more importantly, to prevent a depressurized second stage from loosening and not delivering gas when you need it.

Hi Joe,
Are you using a slider valve type shut off like this?
Isolation Valve Ridged Grips

I have some, but have not yet installed them because I considered it another failure pt and 1 more thing for me to do/check. I go back and forth on whether I want the gas on or off. When diving OC I always dive with tanks off but regs pressurized - but there's a different need (that admittedly doesn't necessarily justify a different method) OC vs. CCR ... so for CCR I generally leave the tank on, which can be a problem with FFs when scootering if the reg gets in the flow. I don't have a BOV.

Cheers,
Heather Knowles

***ScubaDadMiami*** · 13th April 2007, 18:31

I did have a shut off valve on the second stage at one point in the past. In one instance, although I had discussed this with my buddy beforehand, when we were on a cave dive and my instructor called a drill, it caused some confusion and delay when passing off the regulator to him. I have since concluded that until everyone starts using the shut offs as a standard practice, I will keep mine off of the second stage, using the valve only to stop the flow leading to it.

I did leave the cut off valve on the hose that I can plug in for offboard gas. It is not such a critical thing if it takes a few seconds to turn it on while plugging-in to the manual ad.

View Poll Results: How do you have your bailout tank?
Bailout tank turned on	93	69.40%
Bailout tank turned off	26	19.40%
Bailout tank off but I use BOV or Airsource for bailout	14	10.45%
Bailout tanks are for wuses I am an alpinist	1	0.75%
Voters: 134. You may not vote on this poll

13th April 2007, 15:27	#11 (permalink)
botle maker New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: bletchley bucks uk Posts: 22	Re: Bail Out - On or Off I always dive with a 7 on the left with valve on ready to go this contains a gas I can use at max depth of dive if not using He, this also feeds my suit,on gas dives I run the suit on a seperate bottle Any cylinder on the right is a rich deco gas turned off until its needed.(periodically turned on and off through dive) if I am not happy with the box I go off loop and onto left cylinder first regardless of depth this needs to be a reaction not something you have to think about.
(Offline)

13th April 2007, 15:44	#12 (permalink)
Freef Custom Title Disallowed! Current Rebreather/s: Dolphin Other Rebreather/s: Dolphin Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Land of the Freef, UK. Posts: 1,425	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Bailout is for bailing out and should be available at all times and depths. A friend had a bad CO2 and she struggled to get onto the bailout, let alone worrying about turnign tanks on. As for the worry of gas leaking, a quick detune could solve the problem, as could monitoring your gas throughout the dive. __________________ David. Diving the mahogany rebreather.
(Online)

13th April 2007, 15:48	#13 (permalink)
*Decodiver* Administrator Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Geneva Posts: 2,194	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Both on with shutoff on the rich mix. In any case I run my wing from the lean and my drysuit from the rich. Cheers, Dave Cooper. __________________ CCR/OC Trimix Instructor Trainer CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on Megalodon/COPIS-Megalodon/KISS/Sport KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel www.zerogravitydiving.com Rebreather World Terms & Conditions
(Offline)

13th April 2007, 16:02	#14 (permalink)
Freef Custom Title Disallowed! Current Rebreather/s: Dolphin Other Rebreather/s: Dolphin Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Land of the Freef, UK. Posts: 1,425	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Quote: (Originally Posted by Decodiver) ...and my drysuit from the rich. If you are using 80%, don't have a curry the night before in case your underkit generates static and a spark... __________________ David. Diving the mahogany rebreather.
(Online)

13th April 2007, 16:08	#15 (permalink)
nigelh New member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Brighton, Sussex, UK Posts: 883	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Bailouts are off but the BOV is on the DIL. Darn it the bailouts get filled when they come back from test and that's it. They get pressurised to check they are full but that's it. I've seen too many stages freeflow when you hit the water and since I can get instant gas via a quarter turn of the thing in my mouth that will do while I decide what to do next. __________________ nigelh
(Online)

13th April 2007, 16:11	#16 (permalink)
Joe RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 321	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Most of the time pressurized, off with 2nd stage shutoff valve closed (and OPV on 1st stage). Sometimes with tank valve slightly opened and with 2nd stage shutoff closed. In any event, I have long ago pattern trained myself to instinctively go to the tank valve, tug on the 2nd stage shut off and tap the purge button as I place the reg in my mouth when going to a stage, deco bottle etc. The method I use is to remove reg with right hand while turning valve and steadying tank with my left hand. Then I place reg in my mouth with right hand while tracing the hose and tugging on the shut off with my left and tapping purge with my right. It is done in a single fluid motion and adds no time to the process. My logic is that a tank turned on can accidently empty on you plus it can inadvertantly be off when you think it is on so it is better to treat every tank as though the valve is closed until you know otherwise. That way you never get a surprise. The reason for the shutoff is not only to prevent loss of gas, but IMO, more importantly, to prevent a depressurized second stage from loosening and not delivering gas when you need it.
(Online)

13th April 2007, 16:46	#17 (permalink)
Sutty Classic Kiss diver Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Glossop, Derbyshire, UK Posts: 834	Re: Bail Out - On or Off I was taught to have bailout on, I have wondered about the wisdom of this occasionally but never had a problem, then a minor event on a liveaboard trip convinced me it was the only way to go : Kitted up for 2nd dive of day, clipped on my bailout (11l ali rental tank), went to turn it on, knob just turned without opening the valve (after very slight resistance initially). What had happened was that I had left the tank on after the 1st dive and the square hole in the knob which fits over the valve stem was partially rounded off, trying to turn on a valve that was already on was enough to finish rounding off the hole so the knob could just spin. If it had been in a similar state but "off" underwater when I went to bail out things could have been interesting! Neil __________________ Never forget that life is a finite resource.
(Offline)

13th April 2007, 17:32	#18 (permalink)
rdmmdr designer of death Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: kerman,california Posts: 372	Re: Bail Out - On or Off bov on dil, bailout on scond stage off rick
(Offline)

13th April 2007, 18:21	#19 (permalink)
NEwreckdiver RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Boston MA Posts: 72	Re: Bail Out - On or Off Quote: (Originally Posted by Joe) Most of the time pressurized, off with 2nd stage shutoff valve closed (and OPV on 1st stage). Sometimes with tank valve slightly opened and with 2nd stage shutoff closed. The reason for the shutoff is not only to prevent loss of gas, but IMO, more importantly, to prevent a depressurized second stage from loosening and not delivering gas when you need it. Hi Joe, Are you using a slider valve type shut off like this? Isolation Valve Ridged Grips I have some, but have not yet installed them because I considered it another failure pt and 1 more thing for me to do/check. I go back and forth on whether I want the gas on or off. When diving OC I always dive with tanks off but regs pressurized - but there's a different need (that admittedly doesn't necessarily justify a different method) OC vs. CCR ... so for CCR I generally leave the tank on, which can be a problem with FFs when scootering if the reg gets in the flow. I don't have a BOV. Cheers, Heather Knowles Last edited by NEwreckdiver : 13th April 2007 at 18:24.
(Offline)

13th April 2007, 18:31	#20 (permalink)
*ScubaDadMiami* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 2,215	Re: Bail Out - On or Off I did have a shut off valve on the second stage at one point in the past. In one instance, although I had discussed this with my buddy beforehand, when we were on a cave dive and my instructor called a drill, it caused some confusion and delay when passing off the regulator to him. I have since concluded that until everyone starts using the shut offs as a standard practice, I will keep mine off of the second stage, using the valve only to stop the flow leading to it. I did leave the cut off valve on the hose that I can plug in for offboard gas. It is not such a critical thing if it takes a few seconds to turn it on while plugging-in to the manual ad. __________________ Howard Packer IANTD CCR Instructor Miami Beach, Florida CCRDiveTraining.com
(Offline)

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode