HH We shall see

Mark Chase · 28th June 2006, 13:27

Well i am now the proud owner of the worlds smallest syringe of pure silver conducting grease, a can of contact cleaner and a set of HH battery screws with burred threads to bit into the case. Still cant find 3.6v lithium AA batteries but Id rather see how I get on with AA alkaline anyway and just throw them away after two dives. (dives will be 120 -180mins)

After much soul searching and deliberation I have decided to risk a dive with it on Monday with these mods and see how we get along.

The HUD still only shows red so if anyone has an idea how this is wired up inside and thinks it might be worth a look let me know.

I am on a promise from Kevin for replacement outer hand sets so lets hope this time next week after dives on Mon Tus and Wed we can have some positive reviews.

ATB

Mark Chase

Juz · 28th June 2006, 13:41

Hi Mark,

We got ours from http://www.smallbattery.company.org.uk/

But Maplins are now selling them too:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtempla....6V+LITHIUM+AA

Juz

Padowan · 28th June 2006, 14:04

I'll keep an eye on you on Mon, Tue and Wed!

***ScubaDadMiami*** · 28th June 2006, 15:41

We feel your pain, and we are routing for you!

Two days ago (in preparation for my trip this coming weekend to North Carolina for diving historic WWI and WWII shipwrecks), I cleaned my cap, spring, case threads and positive contact using ProGold, and then I applied the carbon based conductive lubricant.

I removed a fair amount of material that had deposited on the threads inside the battery case. Even the positive contact for the battery had some deposits (which I am guessing is some kind of oxidation). After this cleaning, the cap and spring got very shiney. So, I am guessing that this worked.

The conductive lubricant wants to get all over everything. So, be careful when applying.

Tecdiverfl · 28th June 2006, 15:51

Mark

Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them.

Marty

Mark Chase · 28th June 2006, 16:06

Quote: (Originally Posted by Padowan)

I'll keep an eye on you on Mon, Tue and Wed!

Thats one of the reasions I am risking it

PS your laying the line on the first dive

ATB

Mark Chase

Mark Chase · 28th June 2006, 16:08

Quote: (Originally Posted by Juz)

Hi Mark,

We got ours from http://www.smallbattery.company.org.uk/

But Maplins are now selling them too:
http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtempla....6V+LITHIUM+AA

Juz

Went to Maplin yesterday but they only do the 1.5V AA lithium. The decay curve on these is a bit sudden so they dont recomend them. It has to be the 3.6V.

ATB

Mark Chase

Mark Chase · 28th June 2006, 16:10

Quote: (Originally Posted by Tecdiverfl)

Mark

Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them.

Marty

OH great

My old Classic head is packed as well

ATB

Mark Chase

***jradomski*** · 28th June 2006, 17:15

Quote: (Originally Posted by Tecdiverfl)

Mark

Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them.

Marty

The original cases used a SS battery cap and contact was made with a BRASS ring.. brass is highly conductive even when it starts to get tarnished.. Nikel is better than bare al, but will tarnish to some extent.. There are tradoffs to being able to use an of the shelf battery instead of a plug in power source..

The Grease has 2 purposes, it fills in any voids if they develop but just as importantly it coats the surface of the socket in the handset with some protection.. It takes very little grease to protect the threads.. The reason for applying it VERY SPARINGLY on the cap is to help prevent grease ending up in the bottom of the socket which would short out the battery compartment, On the next revision of handsets KJ is going to prevent the ring right below the Oring on the base from being annodized.. This will add an additional conductive surface as well.. If a person wanted they could do the same to their units...

ALUMINUM oxidizes as soon as it is exposed to oxygen.. There is no way around it.. Al oxide is a normal process for the surface of any aluminum.. (that is why anything that has to be annodized is supposed to be put in an acid bath immediately before its annodized). If you want to dive it without the grease, I suggest you flatten out the threads like was suggested in the other post (this forces the cap to bite into the aluminum) AND more importantly clean the socket the cap sits in EACH time you change the battery (at a minimum).. AL oxide is an insulator.. If the socket is not shiny, there is an al oxide layer..

The cap is SS so it doesnt really tarnish that much.. The phosphur bronze spring could use a but of cleaning but thats not where the real problem is..

Tecdiverfl · 28th June 2006, 17:37

Joe

That is fine. But it does not explain why my unit shut down and reboot 29 minutes into my dive. I had a fresh battery and threads had a coat of grease on them. I also had grease on both side of the battery. I did another 10 minutes of deco and it worked fine firing the solenoid. If I had a low battery I would assume it would have rebooted again while I was on Deco. Atleast the DIVA worked well and alerted me the problem.

Marty

28th June 2006, 13:27	#1 (permalink)
Mark Chase RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,854	HH We shall see Well i am now the proud owner of the worlds smallest syringe of pure silver conducting grease, a can of contact cleaner and a set of HH battery screws with burred threads to bit into the case. Still cant find 3.6v lithium AA batteries but Id rather see how I get on with AA alkaline anyway and just throw them away after two dives. (dives will be 120 -180mins) After much soul searching and deliberation I have decided to risk a dive with it on Monday with these mods and see how we get along. The HUD still only shows red so if anyone has an idea how this is wired up inside and thinks it might be worth a look let me know. I am on a promise from Kevin for replacement outer hand sets so lets hope this time next week after dives on Mon Tus and Wed we can have some positive reviews. ATB Mark Chase __________________ See my "Doing It Chasey" video where I'm locked into a padded room, naked, with two ball bearings and within an Hour, I manage to lose one and break the other!!! Kevin Juergensen 16/11/08 [/quote]
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 13:41	#2 (permalink)
Juz Team Kinky Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: London UK Posts: 147	Re: HH We shall see Hi Mark, We got ours from http://www.smallbattery.company.org.uk/ But Maplins are now selling them too: http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtempla....6V+LITHIUM+AA Juz __________________ ~KINKY DIVERS~ Because going down is fun We are all prompted by the same motives, all deceived by the same fallacies, all animated by hope, obstructed by danger, entangled by desire and seduced by pleasure. Welcome to Kinky Divers!
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 14:04	#3 (permalink)
Padowan RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Exeter, UK. Posts: 526	Re: HH We shall see I'll keep an eye on you on Mon, Tue and Wed! __________________ Padowan The future's bright, the future's Yellow .....for now padowan.net - Latest Video: Scapa Flow Rebreather Diving
(Online)

28th June 2006, 15:41	#4 (permalink)
*ScubaDadMiami* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 2,215	Re: HH We shall see We feel your pain, and we are routing for you! Two days ago (in preparation for my trip this coming weekend to North Carolina for diving historic WWI and WWII shipwrecks), I cleaned my cap, spring, case threads and positive contact using ProGold, and then I applied the carbon based conductive lubricant. I removed a fair amount of material that had deposited on the threads inside the battery case. Even the positive contact for the battery had some deposits (which I am guessing is some kind of oxidation). After this cleaning, the cap and spring got very shiney. So, I am guessing that this worked. The conductive lubricant wants to get all over everything. So, be careful when applying. __________________ Howard Packer IANTD CCR Instructor Miami Beach, Florida CCRDiveTraining.com
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 15:51	#5 (permalink)
Tecdiverfl New Member Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delray Beach, FL Posts: 70	Re: HH We shall see Mark Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them. Marty
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 16:06	#6 (permalink)
Mark Chase RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,854	Re: HH We shall see Quote: (Originally Posted by Padowan) I'll keep an eye on you on Mon, Tue and Wed! Thats one of the reasions I am risking it PS your laying the line on the first dive ATB Mark Chase __________________ See my "Doing It Chasey" video where I'm locked into a padded room, naked, with two ball bearings and within an Hour, I manage to lose one and break the other!!! Kevin Juergensen 16/11/08 [/quote]
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 16:08	#7 (permalink)
Mark Chase RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,854	Re: HH We shall see Quote: (Originally Posted by Juz) Hi Mark, We got ours from http://www.smallbattery.company.org.uk/ But Maplins are now selling them too: http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtempla....6V+LITHIUM+AA Juz Went to Maplin yesterday but they only do the 1.5V AA lithium. The decay curve on these is a bit sudden so they dont recomend them. It has to be the 3.6V. ATB Mark Chase __________________ See my "Doing It Chasey" video where I'm locked into a padded room, naked, with two ball bearings and within an Hour, I manage to lose one and break the other!!! Kevin Juergensen 16/11/08 [/quote]
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 16:10	#8 (permalink)
Mark Chase RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,854	Re: HH We shall see Quote: (Originally Posted by Tecdiverfl) Mark Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them. Marty OH great My old Classic head is packed as well ATB Mark Chase __________________ See my "Doing It Chasey" video where I'm locked into a padded room, naked, with two ball bearings and within an Hour, I manage to lose one and break the other!!! Kevin Juergensen 16/11/08 [/quote]
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 17:15	#9 (permalink)
*jradomski* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Optima rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: "Da" Bronx Posts: 3,113	Re: HH We shall see Quote: (Originally Posted by Tecdiverfl) Mark Mine did the same thing as yours last weekend. It is on it way back to Jurgenson again. I had fresh batterys and plently of grease on the battery and threads. I will not dive mine until the problem is corrected. It seems using the grease and other cleaners is a way to make a design problem in the cap or battery case divable. I never had this problem with my old cases and never used any grease or cleaners with over 20 dives on them. Marty The original cases used a SS battery cap and contact was made with a BRASS ring.. brass is highly conductive even when it starts to get tarnished.. Nikel is better than bare al, but will tarnish to some extent.. There are tradoffs to being able to use an of the shelf battery instead of a plug in power source.. The Grease has 2 purposes, it fills in any voids if they develop but just as importantly it coats the surface of the socket in the handset with some protection.. It takes very little grease to protect the threads.. The reason for applying it VERY SPARINGLY on the cap is to help prevent grease ending up in the bottom of the socket which would short out the battery compartment, On the next revision of handsets KJ is going to prevent the ring right below the Oring on the base from being annodized.. This will add an additional conductive surface as well.. If a person wanted they could do the same to their units... ALUMINUM oxidizes as soon as it is exposed to oxygen.. There is no way around it.. Al oxide is a normal process for the surface of any aluminum.. (that is why anything that has to be annodized is supposed to be put in an acid bath immediately before its annodized). If you want to dive it without the grease, I suggest you flatten out the threads like was suggested in the other post (this forces the cap to bite into the aluminum) AND more importantly clean the socket the cap sits in EACH time you change the battery (at a minimum).. AL oxide is an insulator.. If the socket is not shiny, there is an al oxide layer.. The cap is SS so it doesnt really tarnish that much.. The phosphur bronze spring could use a but of cleaning but thats not where the real problem is.. __________________ Joe Radomski CCR Trimix Instructor Trainer ANDI Instructor Trainer Director #10 All posts are personal opinions and DO NOT reflect any affiliated agency unless specifically stated. Last edited by jradomski : 28th June 2006 at 17:19.
(Offline)

28th June 2006, 17:37	#10 (permalink)
Tecdiverfl New Member Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delray Beach, FL Posts: 70	Re: HH We shall see Joe That is fine. But it does not explain why my unit shut down and reboot 29 minutes into my dive. I had a fresh battery and threads had a coat of grease on them. I also had grease on both side of the battery. I did another 10 minutes of deco and it worked fine firing the solenoid. If I had a low battery I would assume it would have rebooted again while I was on Deco. Atleast the DIVA worked well and alerted me the problem. Marty
(Offline)

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode