CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where?

Phil · 11th September 2006, 11:09

Hi Guys,

After 5 years of CCR, I think it is time for a new challenge "CCR Cave Diving". Any recommendation where I could find a good training facility in Europe (language French or English)?

Thanks,

lizardland · 11th September 2006, 11:12

Probably Phil Short or Martin Robson are the two that spring to mind, both in the UK but teach in Europe.

I'm not sure what the standards are but I'd definitely recommend doing OC cave first.

Phil · 11th September 2006, 11:20

Quote: (Originally Posted by lizardland)

Probably Phil Short or Martin Robson are the two that spring to mind, both in the UK but teach in Europe.

I'm not sure what the standards are but I'd definitely recommend doing OC cave first.

Yep, I know Phil I did my Boris training with him, not sure on his planning will have to give him a call, like to do the training still this year! Concerning OC

, I have not dived on OC for the last 5 years except from time to time when I practice my bailout... This is definetly a BIG NO it is CCR or nothing!

decoweenie · 11th September 2006, 11:35

IANTD also has a CCR cave program that you don't have to go thru OC first.

lizardland · 11th September 2006, 12:03

A few reasons I suggested doing OC first. Number one, you bail out then you are an OC cave diver. That might be a very long way in and it is quite stressful bailing to OC long/deep in a cave. Getting task loaded and generally battered for a week on OC is well worth it.

Second, and the biggie for me, there are probably more caves that aren't suited to CCR than caves which are. In fact, most of my favourite caves would be either harder or impossible on a rebreather than they are OC. You are eliminating a huge amount of very good cave diving. A lot of the caves in the Jura or Doubs are much better OC dives due to either depth (shallow) or size (holes that appear quite big on OC become surprisingly small on a rebreather). I think it's easier to go from an OC cave background to CC than it is the other way round.

diverklondike · 11th September 2006, 12:54

Couple thoughts here....

1) Here is another vote for Martin Robson - info@eau2.com (FYI... His web site is down at the moment.) He is in the US most of this month doing some CCR Cave Training in Northern Florida. I know that there are quite a few others on the list that were CCR Cave trained by him. I think Dr Mike. Martin will kick your ARSE but you will come away knowing your stuff!

2) Personally I think it's fine to make your first experiance/training with caving diving CCR. After 5 years of diving only CCR it would have been very painful to have taken my cave training OC first only later to only have to redo it CCR.

Just my 2 cents....

Mark

decoweenie · 11th September 2006, 13:02

Quote: (Originally Posted by diverklondike)

...to have taken my cave training OC first only later to only have to redo it CCR.

Mark,

Why would it be necessary to re-take the course in CCR ?

diverklondike · 11th September 2006, 13:53

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

Mark,

Why would it be necessary to re-take the course in CCR ?

Phi,

It's my understanding that if you have your full "OC" cave that you would need to / should do a "CCR" cross-over to go cave diving via CCR. I am pretty certain that Ginnie will not allow an OC Cave certified diver to us a CCR in one of their caves.

I may be wrong but...

Dive Safe

Mark

lizardland · 11th September 2006, 14:17

I must admit, I never did a CCR cave course before I took my KISS into caves but then I don't dive anywhere that asks for certs (or have any plans to). I wouldn't dream of doing a CC specific cave course just to take my Rebreather underground. But then I never did sidemount, scooter or trimix cave courses either.

Like I said, my big argument for doing a cave course OC is that it is giving you a much more flexible skill set. You can apply everything you learn to CC quite easily without further training.

Personally, for caves <15m, narrow caves or anything with a bit of walking between sumps then I tend to dive them on OC. If I'd done a pure CCR cave course then I'd be buggered for this type of diving.

gibbogeo · 11th September 2006, 14:31

Quote: (Originally Posted by Phil)

Hi Guys,

After 5 years of CCR, I think it is time for a new challenge "CCR Cave Diving". Any recommendation where I could find a good training facility in Europe

I did my OC cave course with Protec Sardinia, in Orosei gulf, Sardinia.

I believe they can arrange with "mattmexico" (Andreas W. Matthes) a

course with a CCR.

ProTec Sardinia - tp

11th September 2006, 11:09	#1 (permalink)
Phil Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Ouroboros rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon rEvo Other CCR Join Date: May 2005 Location: Geneva-Switzerland Posts: 172	CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Hi Guys, After 5 years of CCR, I think it is time for a new challenge "CCR Cave Diving". Any recommendation where I could find a good training facility in Europe (language French or English)? Thanks, __________________ Phil __________________ CCR/OC Instructor CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on Megalodon/KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel www.zerogravitydiving.com
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11th September 2006, 11:12	#2 (permalink)
lizardland Yak Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: North... Posts: 1,303	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Probably Phil Short or Martin Robson are the two that spring to mind, both in the UK but teach in Europe. I'm not sure what the standards are but I'd definitely recommend doing OC cave first. __________________ Can you imagine drifting along in the sea with your mouth open and a load of f***ing plankton going in? You'd like it, would you? www.westons-cider.co.uk Azerbaijani Association of Technical Divers Publicity Officer and Goat Wrangler
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11th September 2006, 11:20	#3 (permalink)
Phil Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Ouroboros rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon rEvo Other CCR Join Date: May 2005 Location: Geneva-Switzerland Posts: 172	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Quote: (Originally Posted by lizardland) Probably Phil Short or Martin Robson are the two that spring to mind, both in the UK but teach in Europe. I'm not sure what the standards are but I'd definitely recommend doing OC cave first. Yep, I know Phil I did my Boris training with him, not sure on his planning will have to give him a call, like to do the training still this year! Concerning OC , I have not dived on OC for the last 5 years except from time to time when I practice my bailout... This is definetly a BIG NO it is CCR or nothing! __________________ Phil __________________ CCR/OC Instructor CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on Megalodon/KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel www.zerogravitydiving.com
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11th September 2006, 11:35	#4 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? IANTD also has a CCR cave program that you don't have to go thru OC first. __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
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11th September 2006, 12:03	#5 (permalink)
lizardland Yak Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: North... Posts: 1,303	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? A few reasons I suggested doing OC first. Number one, you bail out then you are an OC cave diver. That might be a very long way in and it is quite stressful bailing to OC long/deep in a cave. Getting task loaded and generally battered for a week on OC is well worth it. Second, and the biggie for me, there are probably more caves that aren't suited to CCR than caves which are. In fact, most of my favourite caves would be either harder or impossible on a rebreather than they are OC. You are eliminating a huge amount of very good cave diving. A lot of the caves in the Jura or Doubs are much better OC dives due to either depth (shallow) or size (holes that appear quite big on OC become surprisingly small on a rebreather). I think it's easier to go from an OC cave background to CC than it is the other way round. __________________ Can you imagine drifting along in the sea with your mouth open and a load of f**ing plankton going in? You'd like it, would you? www.westons-cider.co.uk Azerbaijani Association of Technical Divers Publicity Officer and Goat Wrangler Last edited by lizardland : 11th September 2006 at 12:05.*
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11th September 2006, 12:54	#6 (permalink)
diverklondike Just one of the Peasants Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delaware, USA Posts: 1,608	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Couple thoughts here.... 1) Here is another vote for Martin Robson - info@eau2.com (FYI... His web site is down at the moment.) He is in the US most of this month doing some CCR Cave Training in Northern Florida. I know that there are quite a few others on the list that were CCR Cave trained by him. I think Dr Mike. Martin will kick your ARSE but you will come away knowing your stuff! 2) Personally I think it's fine to make your first experiance/training with caving diving CCR. After 5 years of diving only CCR it would have been very painful to have taken my cave training OC first only later to only have to redo it CCR. Just my 2 cents.... Mark
(Online)

11th September 2006, 13:02	#7 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Quote: (Originally Posted by diverklondike) ...to have taken my cave training OC first only later to only have to redo it CCR. Mark, Why would it be necessary to re-take the course in CCR ? __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
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11th September 2006, 13:53	#8 (permalink)
diverklondike Just one of the Peasants Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delaware, USA Posts: 1,608	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) Mark, Why would it be necessary to re-take the course in CCR ? Phi, It's my understanding that if you have your full "OC" cave that you would need to / should do a "CCR" cross-over to go cave diving via CCR. I am pretty certain that Ginnie will not allow an OC Cave certified diver to us a CCR in one of their caves. I may be wrong but... Dive Safe Mark
(Online)

11th September 2006, 14:17	#9 (permalink)
lizardland Yak Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: North... Posts: 1,303	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? I must admit, I never did a CCR cave course before I took my KISS into caves but then I don't dive anywhere that asks for certs (or have any plans to). I wouldn't dream of doing a CC specific cave course just to take my Rebreather underground. But then I never did sidemount, scooter or trimix cave courses either. Like I said, my big argument for doing a cave course OC is that it is giving you a much more flexible skill set. You can apply everything you learn to CC quite easily without further training. Personally, for caves <15m, narrow caves or anything with a bit of walking between sumps then I tend to dive them on OC. If I'd done a pure CCR cave course then I'd be buggered for this type of diving. __________________ Can you imagine drifting along in the sea with your mouth open and a load of f**ing plankton going in? You'd like it, would you? www.westons-cider.co.uk Azerbaijani Association of Technical Divers Publicity Officer and Goat Wrangler Last edited by lizardland : 11th September 2006 at 14:20.*
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11th September 2006, 14:31	#10 (permalink)
gibbogeo Gilberto Bonaga, Italy Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: italy Posts: 318	Re: CCR Cave Diving Training in EU - Where? Quote: (Originally Posted by Phil) Hi Guys, After 5 years of CCR, I think it is time for a new challenge "CCR Cave Diving". Any recommendation where I could find a good training facility in Europe I did my OC cave course with Protec Sardinia, in Orosei gulf, Sardinia. I believe they can arrange with "mattmexico" (Andreas W. Matthes) a course with a CCR. ProTec Sardinia - tp
(Offline)

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