MK6 now launched....

Depth-junkie · 2nd November 2007, 08:20

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

It should spell as... "POS Cis"...

Sorry sir, spelling was never my forte or for our american freinds "for-tay". See there you go it's a never ending spiral of spelling doom

ATB
Gareth

ahp · 2nd November 2007, 09:30

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

It should spell as... "POS Cis"...

he he....

An upgrade from "Cis sy Lunar" to "Pos cis" can't be all bad

gibbogeo · 2nd November 2007, 09:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

Guys, all that waffling about voodoo gases and dive history doesn't apply.

First off, the people who did the talking then had no clue about nitrox, trimix etc.

Most people here have 1st hand rebreather experience, so an idea of what they're talking about.

They have experience on "actual" rig and the actual way of using them.

Not on the "sport diver rig" or the way it is intended to be used.

Quote:

Second, there wasn't much history to proof any of their ridiculous claims.

Maybe you are right, but this same argument was used for all the improvement i have seen in a lot of fields. Some improvement failed, other were slowly adopted by everyone. I think that, with the right machines, this new philosophy of CCR will rules from now to 5 years.

Quote:

Last but not least, do you think the single stage regs, nitrox etc had been as successful if their bodycount was as bad as ours is?

As i have said, it is not "our bodycount".

It is the bodycount of the Draeger Ray and Dolphin used in _sport diving_.

Quote:

You better make sure those rigs work 150%, 150"% of the time.

Yes, obviously i fully agree. But the industry can afford a series o complete test to verify it. Because it should have the sale number that permit them do spend money in checking. The artisan maker of our jewels can't afford a serious testing (most of them would be very happy to sell 100 pieces of their models a year). So we have redundancy, safety procedure, bailout bottles and the scare of what the machine can do to us if we leave it unattended and we don't check it every now and then.

But this is a complete different way of thinking.

***Beanie*** · 2nd November 2007, 17:55

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sten)

A frend working with procurment of automotive plastic parts had a look at this Rebreather at the Gothenburg preview. His opinion was that some of the parts were from production tooling and some from prototype tooling. So a production model will probably have a different finish, and in some areas different resins.

The scrubber housing is an aluminum tube with plastic ends.

/Sten

we were told it was polycarbonate

fredrik · 2nd November 2007, 21:00

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

Guys, all that waffling about voodoo gases and dive history doesn't apply.

First off, the people who did the talking then had no clue about nitrox, trimix etc.

Most people here have 1st hand rebreather experience, so an idea of what they're talking about.

Second, there wasn't much history to proof any of their ridiculous claims.
Look at the history of electronic failures of any kind, there are plenty.
Now look at the score sheet of of electronics and power supplies in an UW environment, more bad history.

Last but not least, do you think the single stage regs, nitrox etc had been as successful
if their bodycount was as bad as ours is?

You better make sure those rigs work 150%, 150"% of the time.
Cause if the divers have been trained to ignore pO2 and anything goes wrong it could well set an end to Rebreather diving, at least in heavily governed areas. Not to mention the grief that comes with loosing family, friends ... .

Maybe the the best way to get rebreathers to common sportdivers could have been if a comapany like Poseidon, or equal, should have relised the Sport Kiss?

***caveseeker7*** · 2nd November 2007, 22:30

Nothing wrong with Jetsam making the Sport Kiss, nor any of the other manufacturers making their manually controlled units. Jetsam has been meeting demand, has managed customer service very well, has made improvements to their units, has a competent instructor base all over the globe, I doubt the unit would have been much more successful if an established SCUBA manufacturer would have market it.

While the Sport Kiss was designed recreational depth they're not designed for your average recreational diver. Like all CCRs, you have to stay on top of your unit, unlike eCCRs there is no setpoint controller if you don't.

They're not the unit you wanna forget everything you know about pO2!

Leewenhooke · 3rd November 2007, 07:48

Well, like I said, when horseless carriages, aeroplanes, AC electricity, etc. first came out, it took a high degree of competency to operate the equipment and you took your life in your hands every time you used it.

When a seasoned tech diver buys a custom mixed-gas CCR, he knows this going in and prepares accordingly.

I haven't examined the MK VI yet, but Poseidon may very well have made a unit that's THAT easy to use. (or getting there) In the past 20 years, we've seen technology that enables rec divers to virtually "forget about DCS". When the little magic bar in their dive computer moves into the yellow zone, they end their dive. When it falls back into the green zone, they dive again. I know no one in this forum dives like that, but have you been on a recreational dive boat lately? That’s how they roll these days. 30 years ago, that would have seemed preposterous. Maybe that's what CCR divers will think about PPO2 awareness and manual setpoints 20 years from now.

The more people who involved in Rebreather diving, the merrier. It will bring costs down and open up more locations. I just hope the manufacturing and training sectors of the industry don't get greedy and regulate themselves. If not, the lawyers will be happy to do it for us; for a small fee.

Hk101gr · 3rd November 2007, 08:27

Quote: (Originally Posted by fredrik)

Maybe the the best way to get rebreathers to common sportdivers could have been if a comapany like Poseidon, or equal, should have relised the Sport Kiss?

Get the rebreathers to sport divers for what in the first place? Rebreathers cost a lot of $$$ to buy and run, definetely more than oc diving. So why give them to sport divers? Just for the hype? Rebreathers are kewl so every gear crazy AOW diver should get one? Will the rebreather actually change their bottom times and dives? (btw the dolphin tried to do the same thing a decade ago)

henckell · 3rd November 2007, 08:33

Quote: (Originally Posted by Hk101gr)

Get the rebreathers to sport divers for what in the first place?

We heard the reasons at the preview a few weeks ago. I expect Poseidon/Bill Stone will explain again on DEMA.

The first reason was "superior safety" compared to OC...

diverklondike · 3rd November 2007, 11:25

I spent a fair amount of time looking at the Cis yesterday.

For the most part I think it's a very well thought out unit.

It's targeted at a very different market that those that are on this list.

They are "also" working on a tech rig. I did not get a timeline on that unit.

Dive Safe...

Mark

2nd November 2007, 08:20	#81 (permalink)
Depth-junkie 10/52 Psycho Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Wrexham Posts: 298	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) It should spell as... "POS Cis"... Sorry sir, spelling was never my forte or for our american freinds "for-tay". See there you go it's a never ending spiral of spelling doom ATB Gareth __________________ Alpine low rider of the P.D.D.T
(Offline)

2nd November 2007, 09:30	#82 (permalink)
ahp New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Denmark Posts: 13	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) It should spell as... "POS Cis"... he he.... An upgrade from "Cis sy Lunar" to "Pos cis" can't be all bad __________________ /ahp http://ovdk.se
(Offline)

2nd November 2007, 09:47	#83 (permalink)
gibbogeo Gilberto Bonaga, Italy Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: italy Posts: 315	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) Guys, all that waffling about voodoo gases and dive history doesn't apply. First off, the people who did the talking then had no clue about nitrox, trimix etc. Most people here have 1st hand rebreather experience, so an idea of what they're talking about. They have experience on "actual" rig and the actual way of using them. Not on the "sport diver rig" or the way it is intended to be used. Quote: Second, there wasn't much history to proof any of their ridiculous claims. Maybe you are right, but this same argument was used for all the improvement i have seen in a lot of fields. Some improvement failed, other were slowly adopted by everyone. I think that, with the right machines, this new philosophy of CCR will rules from now to 5 years. Quote: Last but not least, do you think the single stage regs, nitrox etc had been as successful if their bodycount was as bad as ours is? As i have said, it is not "our bodycount". It is the bodycount of the Draeger Ray and Dolphin used in _sport diving_. Quote: You better make sure those rigs work 150%, 150"% of the time. Yes, obviously i fully agree. But the industry can afford a series o complete test to verify it. Because it should have the sale number that permit them do spend money in checking. The artisan maker of our jewels can't afford a serious testing (most of them would be very happy to sell 100 pieces of their models a year). So we have redundancy, safety procedure, bailout bottles and the scare of what the machine can do to us if we leave it unattended and we don't check it every now and then. But this is a complete different way of thinking.
(Offline)

2nd November 2007, 17:55	#84 (permalink)
*Beanie* give a man an inch....... Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: In da house! yeah baby! Posts: 3,177	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by Sten) A frend working with procurment of automotive plastic parts had a look at this Rebreather at the Gothenburg preview. His opinion was that some of the parts were from production tooling and some from prototype tooling. So a production model will probably have a different finish, and in some areas different resins. The scrubber housing is an aluminum tube with plastic ends. /Sten we were told it was polycarbonate __________________ Beanie Gallery Admin & Library Assistant. www.outlawdivers.org.uk www.beandiving.co.uk www.beanengineering.co.uk
(Offline)

2nd November 2007, 21:00	#85 (permalink)
fredrik Rekodeko. Sweden Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 184	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) Guys, all that waffling about voodoo gases and dive history doesn't apply. First off, the people who did the talking then had no clue about nitrox, trimix etc. Most people here have 1st hand rebreather experience, so an idea of what they're talking about. Second, there wasn't much history to proof any of their ridiculous claims. Look at the history of electronic failures of any kind, there are plenty. Now look at the score sheet of of electronics and power supplies in an UW environment, more bad history. Last but not least, do you think the single stage regs, nitrox etc had been as successful if their bodycount was as bad as ours is? You better make sure those rigs work 150%, 150"% of the time. Cause if the divers have been trained to ignore pO2 and anything goes wrong it could well set an end to Rebreather diving, at least in heavily governed areas. Not to mention the grief that comes with loosing family, friends ... . Maybe the the best way to get rebreathers to common sportdivers could have been if a comapany like Poseidon, or equal, should have relised the Sport Kiss? __________________ Fredrik Rekodeko, Sweden http://www.rekodeko.se
(Offline)

2nd November 2007, 22:30	#86 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,456	Re: MK6 now launched.... Nothing wrong with Jetsam making the Sport Kiss, nor any of the other manufacturers making their manually controlled units. Jetsam has been meeting demand, has managed customer service very well, has made improvements to their units, has a competent instructor base all over the globe, I doubt the unit would have been much more successful if an established SCUBA manufacturer would have market it. While the Sport Kiss was designed recreational depth they're not designed for your average recreational diver. Like all CCRs, you have to stay on top of your unit, unlike eCCRs there is no setpoint controller if you don't. They're not the unit you wanna forget everything you know about pO2! __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.!"
(Offline)

3rd November 2007, 07:48	#87 (permalink)
Leewenhooke New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Savannah, GA Posts: 9	Re: MK6 now launched.... Well, like I said, when horseless carriages, aeroplanes, AC electricity, etc. first came out, it took a high degree of competency to operate the equipment and you took your life in your hands every time you used it. When a seasoned tech diver buys a custom mixed-gas CCR, he knows this going in and prepares accordingly. I haven't examined the MK VI yet, but Poseidon may very well have made a unit that's THAT easy to use. (or getting there) In the past 20 years, we've seen technology that enables rec divers to virtually "forget about DCS". When the little magic bar in their dive computer moves into the yellow zone, they end their dive. When it falls back into the green zone, they dive again. I know no one in this forum dives like that, but have you been on a recreational dive boat lately? That’s how they roll these days. 30 years ago, that would have seemed preposterous. Maybe that's what CCR divers will think about PPO2 awareness and manual setpoints 20 years from now. The more people who involved in Rebreather diving, the merrier. It will bring costs down and open up more locations. I just hope the manufacturing and training sectors of the industry don't get greedy and regulate themselves. If not, the lawyers will be happy to do it for us; for a small fee.
(Offline)

3rd November 2007, 08:27	#88 (permalink)
Hk101gr New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Patras,Greece Posts: 95	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by fredrik) Maybe the the best way to get rebreathers to common sportdivers could have been if a comapany like Poseidon, or equal, should have relised the Sport Kiss? Get the rebreathers to sport divers for what in the first place? Rebreathers cost a lot of $$$ to buy and run, definetely more than oc diving. So why give them to sport divers? Just for the hype? Rebreathers are kewl so every gear crazy AOW diver should get one? Will the rebreather actually change their bottom times and dives? (btw the dolphin tried to do the same thing a decade ago)
(Offline)

3rd November 2007, 08:33	#89 (permalink)
henckell New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 90	Re: MK6 now launched.... Quote: (Originally Posted by Hk101gr) Get the rebreathers to sport divers for what in the first place? We heard the reasons at the preview a few weeks ago. I expect Poseidon/Bill Stone will explain again on DEMA. The first reason was "superior safety" compared to OC... __________________ http://www.rekodeko.se
(Offline)

3rd November 2007, 11:25	#90 (permalink)
diverklondike Just one of the Peasants Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delaware, USA Posts: 1,614	Re: MK6 now launched.... I spent a fair amount of time looking at the Cis yesterday. For the most part I think it's a very well thought out unit. It's targeted at a very different market that those that are on this list. They are "also" working on a tech rig. I did not get a timeline on that unit. Dive Safe... Mark
(Offline)

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode