Hal 9000

SkubaJim · 9th March 2008, 23:39

The battery died on the primary handset while on a training dive at 40 feet. I looked at that dead hammerhead, then at my instructor and gave him the abort dive sign, time to go. He said no. (can they do that?) So, I took out the secondary and ran the thing manually for the rest of the shallow dive. He also had me shoot a lift bag, hand off the BO bottle reg to him, restow the liftbag, etc, etc while watching the PO2 and keeping myself within parameters. Afterwards he told me to think of my rebreather as the HAL 9000 in 2001-A Space Odyssey. It is trying to help but sometimes it gets confused and will try to kill you instead. You just have to take over. Sounds reasonable to me, I asked him what his computers name was..... he said "Chucky."
.

**Dsix36** · 9th March 2008, 23:52

It still amazes me that I spent all that money to buy a Rebreather, get trained on it, and all the additional parts and supplies when I knew full good and well that it would try to kill me every chance that it got.

It seems like a bullet would be cheaper, quicker and less painful.

What, and miss out on all the excitement?

Mine was named Kevorkian until I found that another user had that name. Now I call it Dr. Death instead.

Dr. Death demands respect and my undivided attention.

jkaterenchuk · 10th March 2008, 00:56

Why not? Some other CCRs only have one display. Take the Classic Kiss for example. One display reading all three cell. Only manual control. From my perspective what he did give you great experience in the following areas:

1) You now have a feel for how fast or slowly the PO2 changes at depth when running manual.
2) you now have a feel for how long to hold down the O2 manual injector for a given change in PO2.
3) You now have a sense for how fast the PO2 changes when under stess or workload.
4) All the above should give you more confidence that you can run the CCR instead of the CCR running you.

A valuable lesson.

John

Quote: (Originally Posted by SkubaJim)

The battery died on the primary handset while on a training dive at 40 feet. I looked at that dead hammerhead, then at my instructor and gave him the abort dive sign, time to go. He said no. (can they do that?) So, I took out the secondary and ran the thing manually for the rest of the shallow dive. He also had me shoot a lift bag, hand off the BO bottle reg to him, restow the liftbag, etc, etc while watching the PO2 and keeping myself within parameters. Afterwards he told me to think of my rebreather as the HAL 9000 in 2001-A Space Odyssey. It is trying to help but sometimes it gets confused and will try to kill you instead. You just have to take over. Sounds reasonable to me, I asked him what his computers name was..... he said "Chucky."
.

SkubaJim · 10th March 2008, 01:03

That is exactly what my instructor said to me after the dive. It was shallow, we had plenty of time to run different drills. I got some great practice time in.

jkaterenchuk · 10th March 2008, 01:20

I would make the suggestion that you read this thread so that you understand the issues with CCR in shallow water. Its much more complicated and potentially fatal than OC so worth some of your time to understand the dynamics.

http://www.rebreatherworld.com/rebre...your-ppo2.html

John

PCDiver · 10th March 2008, 03:10

Hi Jim,

Having two independent handsets with separate batteries is one of the features I really liked on the HH. Running the unit manually from the secondary with no primary, is a great excercise and it is pretty safe as well.
The HUD will alert you if you fail to manage the PPO2 correctly.

***caveseeker7*** · 10th March 2008, 05:17

Quote: (Originally Posted by jkaterenchuk)

Why not? Some other CCRs only have one display. Take the Classic Kiss for example. One display reading all three cell.

You get 3 displays each one reading one cell for less.

Dove a PRISM during part of my training where the electronics didn't work.

Manual setpoint control the entire dive monitoring the analog gauge.

Hey, at least that thing was borrowed. Gotta suck worse when your own Rebreather craps out during training already.

Bought a KISS instead, less hassle to maintain setpoint and more redundancy for monitoring.

Downtime · 10th March 2008, 11:01

Hey that just happened to me today. In fact it was my own fault, I put a dodgy battery in the Primary (Which I thought was OK, but I wasn't entirely sure). It worked well for the pre-breath, but when I hit the water, it did the dreaded reboot. Every time it went to fire the solenoid, the Primary HH would reboot.

So I flew it manual off the secondary and completed the dive (37M for 58 minutes, deco, as well as task loading with a camera).

One thing I do have to say about the Optima and the Hammers, is that they could not have been easier to maintain the setpoint. I found myself being overly cautious (which of course is not a bad thing), looking at the PPO2 readings every few seconds, but when I got the feel of my O2 consumption rate, I got into the rhythm. I know this is second nature for you MCCR pilots out there, but it was something I practised for a few fleeting moments at a time, not a whole dive, so was comparatively new to me.

It wasn't that scary. My hats off to you Lamar and Kevin. Great Unit.

Cheers,
Michael

jkaterenchuk · 10th March 2008, 11:13

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

You get 3 displays each one reading one cell for less.

opps, guess I technically should have said: one display Console containing 3 interlocking display units each one providing a PO reading form a single cell.

jhaaja · 10th March 2008, 11:27

And I think taht running thr Rebreather manually is a part of every MOD1 course anyway

JH

9th March 2008, 23:39	#1 (permalink)
SkubaJim New Member Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 10	Hal 9000 The battery died on the primary handset while on a training dive at 40 feet. I looked at that dead hammerhead, then at my instructor and gave him the abort dive sign, time to go. He said no. (can they do that?) So, I took out the secondary and ran the thing manually for the rest of the shallow dive. He also had me shoot a lift bag, hand off the BO bottle reg to him, restow the liftbag, etc, etc while watching the PO2 and keeping myself within parameters. Afterwards he told me to think of my rebreather as the HAL 9000 in 2001-A Space Odyssey. It is trying to help but sometimes it gets confused and will try to kill you instead. You just have to take over. Sounds reasonable to me, I asked him what his computers name was..... he said "Chucky." . __________________ SkubaJim http://www.cafepress.com/addhelium (My brother created these designs)
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9th March 2008, 23:52	#2 (permalink)
Dsix36 Going Down? Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Deerfield Beach, Florida Posts: 1,053	Re: Hal 9000 It still amazes me that I spent all that money to buy a Rebreather, get trained on it, and all the additional parts and supplies when I knew full good and well that it would try to kill me every chance that it got. It seems like a bullet would be cheaper, quicker and less painful. What, and miss out on all the excitement? Mine was named Kevorkian until I found that another user had that name. Now I call it Dr. Death instead. Dr. Death demands respect and my undivided attention. __________________ THE MORE THAT I LEARN, THE MORE THAT I STILL NEED TO LEARN!!!!!!
(Offline)

10th March 2008, 00:56	#3 (permalink)
jkaterenchuk . Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2006 Location: Lititz, PA Posts: 812	Re: Hal 9000 Why not? Some other CCRs only have one display. Take the Classic Kiss for example. One display reading all three cell. Only manual control. From my perspective what he did give you great experience in the following areas: 1) You now have a feel for how fast or slowly the PO2 changes at depth when running manual. 2) you now have a feel for how long to hold down the O2 manual injector for a given change in PO2. 3) You now have a sense for how fast the PO2 changes when under stess or workload. 4) All the above should give you more confidence that you can run the CCR instead of the CCR running you. A valuable lesson. John Quote: (Originally Posted by SkubaJim) The battery died on the primary handset while on a training dive at 40 feet. I looked at that dead hammerhead, then at my instructor and gave him the abort dive sign, time to go. He said no. (can they do that?) So, I took out the secondary and ran the thing manually for the rest of the shallow dive. He also had me shoot a lift bag, hand off the BO bottle reg to him, restow the liftbag, etc, etc while watching the PO2 and keeping myself within parameters. Afterwards he told me to think of my rebreather as the HAL 9000 in 2001-A Space Odyssey. It is trying to help but sometimes it gets confused and will try to kill you instead. You just have to take over. Sounds reasonable to me, I asked him what his computers name was..... he said "Chucky." .
(Offline)

10th March 2008, 01:03	#4 (permalink)
SkubaJim New Member Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 10	Re: Hal 9000 That is exactly what my instructor said to me after the dive. It was shallow, we had plenty of time to run different drills. I got some great practice time in. __________________ SkubaJim http://www.cafepress.com/addhelium (My brother created these designs)
(Offline)

10th March 2008, 01:20	#5 (permalink)
jkaterenchuk . Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2006 Location: Lititz, PA Posts: 812	Re: Hal 9000 I would make the suggestion that you read this thread so that you understand the issues with CCR in shallow water. Its much more complicated and potentially fatal than OC so worth some of your time to understand the dynamics. http://www.rebreatherworld.com/rebre...your-ppo2.html John
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10th March 2008, 03:10	#6 (permalink)
PCDiver Submerge Productions Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 962	Re: Hal 9000 Hi Jim, Having two independent handsets with separate batteries is one of the features I really liked on the HH. Running the unit manually from the secondary with no primary, is a great excercise and it is pretty safe as well. The HUD will alert you if you fail to manage the PPO2 correctly. __________________ >>>>> www.submergeproductions.com dedicated to promoting technical diving >>>>> Check out our dive show video interviews and Wreck dive videos >>>>> Now also on iTunes and Zune
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10th March 2008, 05:17	#7 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,496	Re: Hal 9000 Quote: (Originally Posted by jkaterenchuk) Why not? Some other CCRs only have one display. Take the Classic Kiss for example. One display reading all three cell. You get 3 displays each one reading one cell for less. Dove a PRISM during part of my training where the electronics didn't work. Manual setpoint control the entire dive monitoring the analog gauge. Hey, at least that thing was borrowed. Gotta suck worse when your own Rebreather craps out during training already. Bought a KISS instead, less hassle to maintain setpoint and more redundancy for monitoring. __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.!"
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10th March 2008, 11:01	#8 (permalink)
Downtime New Member Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Melbourne Posts: 39	Re: Hal 9000 Hey that just happened to me today. In fact it was my own fault, I put a dodgy battery in the Primary (Which I thought was OK, but I wasn't entirely sure). It worked well for the pre-breath, but when I hit the water, it did the dreaded reboot. Every time it went to fire the solenoid, the Primary HH would reboot. So I flew it manual off the secondary and completed the dive (37M for 58 minutes, deco, as well as task loading with a camera). One thing I do have to say about the Optima and the Hammers, is that they could not have been easier to maintain the setpoint. I found myself being overly cautious (which of course is not a bad thing), looking at the PPO2 readings every few seconds, but when I got the feel of my O2 consumption rate, I got into the rhythm. I know this is second nature for you MCCR pilots out there, but it was something I practised for a few fleeting moments at a time, not a whole dive, so was comparatively new to me. It wasn't that scary. My hats off to you Lamar and Kevin. Great Unit. Cheers, Michael
(Offline)

10th March 2008, 11:13	#9 (permalink)
jkaterenchuk . Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2006 Location: Lititz, PA Posts: 812	Re: Hal 9000 Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) You get 3 displays each one reading one cell for less. opps, guess I technically should have said: one display Console containing 3 interlocking display units each one providing a PO reading form a single cell.
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10th March 2008, 11:27	#10 (permalink)
jhaaja Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 884	Re: Hal 9000 And I think taht running thr Rebreather manually is a part of every MOD1 course anyway JH
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