First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open......

Mixaddict · 27th September 2006, 13:54

Several months ago, I experienced a "wake up" call when my Inspo solenoid stuck at 300 feet upon reaching depth. I heard an enormous sreeching sound that went on for several seconds. Went through my dill flush, and the po2 went screaming back up again. I closed my tank valve off, breathed for awhile, opened it back up - same thing happened, screechng sound again, followed by rising po2. This happened 5 times, until finally the screeching sound stopped and all returned to normal. The only thing I can think of is that some foreign matter was stuck in the solenoid. I had rented tanks that week and can't vouch for the cleanliness of them. I am assuming there was a particle of rust or other matter that made it's way into my system and caused the solenoid to stick making the awful sound and then eventually making it's way out and releasing the jammed solenoid.

When your solenoid sticks at 300 feet, it certainly gets your attention very quickly!

Gilles · 1st October 2006, 03:16

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gibbon)

Ron Micjan said in another post that it was due to disconnecting the swagelock underwater... and that quite a few people have been suffering from it recently, myself included.

I've disconnected several times in salt water (never as a necessity), and never had an issue with solenoid performance. Flooded my loop once (during rescue training with you Jon), and didn't quite rinse out as good as I should have. Bit of surface corrosion on solenoid, nothing else.

Manual inflator, now that's another thing. Several stuck open experiences.

Joe · 1st October 2006, 04:41

I had the same problem.

Fixed it once (disassemble, inspect, clean, reassemble.)

Worked for a week and failed again. This time I sent it back and Leon changed (upgraded) the solenoid to the newest one.

Worked a week or two then failed.

Disassembled valve cleaned and reassembled. Failed within a week

In all of the failures corrossion was the culprit. I found minor rust sludge preventing the valve from closing.

I never disconnected the QD under water and am very cognizant of cleaning the reqs etc. with pressure in the system so water cant get in. All tanks, regulators and hoses used were new.

After the last failure I completely removed the solenoid and *all* of the associated plumbing including the fitting that passes through the bulkhead, the female QD, the solenoid valve and tubing that feeds it. I then replaced *all* of the hardware, including the hose, male QD, female QD and disassembled, cleaned and reassembled the solenoid valve. It has been working fine for about 6 months now. I am also extremely carefull to not get water inside or on any of the mating surfaces of the QD when connecting.

Also, Leon was most helpful with all of this and as the unit was new, provided all of the parts etc. under warranty.

Gilles · 1st October 2006, 08:09

Quote: (Originally Posted by Joe)

I had the same problem.

Fixed it once (disassemble, inspect, clean, reassemble.)

Worked for a week and failed again. This time I sent it back and Leon changed (upgraded) the solenoid to the newest one.

Worked a week or two then failed.

Disassembled valve cleaned and reassembled. Failed within a week

In all of the failures corrossion was the culprit. I found minor rust sludge preventing the valve from closing.

I never disconnected the QD under water and am very cognizant of cleaning the reqs etc. with pressure in the system so water cant get in. All tanks, regulators and hoses used were new.

After the last failure I completely removed the solenoid and *all* of the associated plumbing including the fitting that passes through the bulkhead, the female QD, the solenoid valve and tubing that feeds it. I then replaced *all* of the hardware, including the hose, male QD, female QD and disassembled, cleaned and reassembled the solenoid valve. It has been working fine for about 6 months now. I am also extremely carefull to not get water inside or on any of the mating surfaces of the QD when connecting.

Also, Leon was most helpful with all of this and as the unit was new, provided all of the parts etc. under warranty.

Quite interesting

. I wonder if there might be something else going on? Have you taken your 1st stage apart, and maybe viz-inspect your O2 tank.

I'm more reluctant to disconnect the QD now. I've taken my solenoid apart twice but nice and clean on the insides.

We should all maybe alter our pre-dive. Pre-Breathe @ SP=0.4. Let solenoid cycle a few times. Close the O2 valve and let sit a couple to see if there's a leak (or solenoid stuck open)

.

AndyMumford · 1st October 2006, 08:43

Hi All,
Thier is a filter system you can get to stop any bits of crap getting into the solenoid, I to had the solenoid jam open.

I think if you give Leon a call you should be able to get one sent over.

JonnyB · 1st October 2006, 08:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

Hummmmmm this is a bit chicken and egg because you only remove the hose after the solenoid has jammed?

Hi Mark, what happends usually is that the instructors disconnect it during training, so the first time the solenoid is exposed to salt water then. And what happends is that he also connects it back again in water, so you actually get water pushed in the solenoid.

/Jonny

diverklondike · 1st October 2006, 14:29

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

I am curious to know if this is the cause of the issue as it doesn't happen often on the HH or the Insp. I have never met a diver who has had a stuck solenoid on a HH or a Insp.

ATB

Mark Chase

I have had mine stick open once on my HH. A tear down and cleaning did the trick. There was some s#%*&^* here and there that was causing the problem.

Dive Safe

Mark

O.C.Diver · 1st October 2006, 14:52

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mixaddict)

Several months ago, I experienced a "wake up" call when my Inspo solenoid stuck at 300 feet upon reaching depth. I heard an enormous sreeching sound that went on for several seconds.

When your solenoid sticks at 300 feet, it certainly gets your attention very quickly!

I need more excitement in my life. I'm going to add one of those solenoid things to my home built rebreather.

Ted

Diver Den · 1st October 2006, 15:21

Andy
The filters are still in the UK I am taking them out on Sat. I will be taking some to the dive show and giving them to people competent enough to fit them. I will fit them over the weekend so if anyone wants one fitting give me a call +447736548148, the bits cost £5, fitting is FOC. Leon has a stand in the rebreather section (1741).

Dennis Vessey

Joe · 2nd October 2006, 00:13

Quote: (Originally Posted by sabgia)

Quite interesting

. I wonder if there might be something else going on? Have you taken your 1st stage apart, and maybe viz-inspect your O2 tank.

Yes. Checked the reg, inspected the condition of the scintered (sp?) filter and visualed the tanks even though all were new.

I have no idea what part was defective but once I changed everything the problem went away.

27th September 2006, 13:54	#11 (permalink)
Mixaddict RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Draper, Utah USA Posts: 523	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Several months ago, I experienced a "wake up" call when my Inspo solenoid stuck at 300 feet upon reaching depth. I heard an enormous sreeching sound that went on for several seconds. Went through my dill flush, and the po2 went screaming back up again. I closed my tank valve off, breathed for awhile, opened it back up - same thing happened, screechng sound again, followed by rising po2. This happened 5 times, until finally the screeching sound stopped and all returned to normal. The only thing I can think of is that some foreign matter was stuck in the solenoid. I had rented tanks that week and can't vouch for the cleanliness of them. I am assuming there was a particle of rust or other matter that made it's way into my system and caused the solenoid to stick making the awful sound and then eventually making it's way out and releasing the jammed solenoid. When your solenoid sticks at 300 feet, it certainly gets your attention very quickly! __________________ Randy Thornton (MixAddict) Inspiration, Evolution, Hammerhead & Sentinel CCR Instructor
(Online)

1st October 2006, 03:16	#12 (permalink)
Gilles Worship the feminine Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Den Haag (Netherlands) Posts: 762	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by Gibbon) Ron Micjan said in another post that it was due to disconnecting the swagelock underwater... and that quite a few people have been suffering from it recently, myself included. I've disconnected several times in salt water (never as a necessity), and never had an issue with solenoid performance. Flooded my loop once (during rescue training with you Jon), and didn't quite rinse out as good as I should have. Bit of surface corrosion on solenoid, nothing else. Manual inflator, now that's another thing. Several stuck open experiences. __________________ Gilles http://www.dirrebreather.com
(Offline)

1st October 2006, 04:41	#13 (permalink)
Joe RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 321	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... I had the same problem. Fixed it once (disassemble, inspect, clean, reassemble.) Worked for a week and failed again. This time I sent it back and Leon changed (upgraded) the solenoid to the newest one. Worked a week or two then failed. Disassembled valve cleaned and reassembled. Failed within a week In all of the failures corrossion was the culprit. I found minor rust sludge preventing the valve from closing. I never disconnected the QD under water and am very cognizant of cleaning the reqs etc. with pressure in the system so water cant get in. All tanks, regulators and hoses used were new. After the last failure I completely removed the solenoid and all of the associated plumbing including the fitting that passes through the bulkhead, the female QD, the solenoid valve and tubing that feeds it. I then replaced all of the hardware, including the hose, male QD, female QD and disassembled, cleaned and reassembled the solenoid valve. It has been working fine for about 6 months now. I am also extremely carefull to not get water inside or on any of the mating surfaces of the QD when connecting. Also, Leon was most helpful with all of this and as the unit was new, provided all of the parts etc. under warranty.
(Offline)

1st October 2006, 08:09	#14 (permalink)
Gilles Worship the feminine Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Den Haag (Netherlands) Posts: 762	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by Joe) I had the same problem. Fixed it once (disassemble, inspect, clean, reassemble.) Worked for a week and failed again. This time I sent it back and Leon changed (upgraded) the solenoid to the newest one. Worked a week or two then failed. Disassembled valve cleaned and reassembled. Failed within a week In all of the failures corrossion was the culprit. I found minor rust sludge preventing the valve from closing. I never disconnected the QD under water and am very cognizant of cleaning the reqs etc. with pressure in the system so water cant get in. All tanks, regulators and hoses used were new. After the last failure I completely removed the solenoid and all of the associated plumbing including the fitting that passes through the bulkhead, the female QD, the solenoid valve and tubing that feeds it. I then replaced all of the hardware, including the hose, male QD, female QD and disassembled, cleaned and reassembled the solenoid valve. It has been working fine for about 6 months now. I am also extremely carefull to not get water inside or on any of the mating surfaces of the QD when connecting. Also, Leon was most helpful with all of this and as the unit was new, provided all of the parts etc. under warranty. Quite interesting. I wonder if there might be something else going on? Have you taken your 1st stage apart, and maybe viz-inspect your O2 tank. I'm more reluctant to disconnect the QD now. I've taken my solenoid apart twice but nice and clean on the insides. We should all maybe alter our pre-dive. Pre-Breathe @ SP=0.4. Let solenoid cycle a few times. Close the O2 valve and let sit a couple to see if there's a leak (or solenoid stuck open). __________________ Gilles http://www.dirrebreather.com
(Offline)

1st October 2006, 08:47	#16 (permalink)
JonnyB Johnny The Hatch Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Titan Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Megalodon Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Sweden (Stockholm)/Cyprus(Ayia Napa) Posts: 991	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) Hummmmmm this is a bit chicken and egg because you only remove the hose after the solenoid has jammed? Hi Mark, what happends usually is that the instructors disconnect it during training, so the first time the solenoid is exposed to salt water then. And what happends is that he also connects it back again in water, so you actually get water pushed in the solenoid. /Jonny __________________ A quote from Crazyduck - In remembering our own Rob Davies. "Outbound flight 777 heavy you are cleared for flight Due west into that warm red Texas sunset You have angels on your wings and divers memories on your six." Rest In Peace http://www.divetekcyprus.com http://www.diveccr.com
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1st October 2006, 14:29	#17 (permalink)
diverklondike RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Delaware, USA Posts: 1,714	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) I am curious to know if this is the cause of the issue as it doesn't happen often on the HH or the Insp. I have never met a diver who has had a stuck solenoid on a HH or a Insp. ATB Mark Chase I have had mine stick open once on my HH. A tear down and cleaning did the trick. There was some s#%&^ here and there that was causing the problem. Dive Safe Mark
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1st October 2006, 14:52	#18 (permalink)
O.C.Diver Helium Addict Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Salisbury MD USA Summers; Wandering Florida Winters Posts: 244	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by Mixaddict) Several months ago, I experienced a "wake up" call when my Inspo solenoid stuck at 300 feet upon reaching depth. I heard an enormous sreeching sound that went on for several seconds. When your solenoid sticks at 300 feet, it certainly gets your attention very quickly! I need more excitement in my life. I'm going to add one of those solenoid things to my home built rebreather. Ted __________________ Consider this my opinion.......sometimes I'm even right, but remember.........YMMV. Ted Green Charter Boat "OC Diver" http://www.ocdiver.com
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1st October 2006, 15:21	#19 (permalink)
Diver Den New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2005 Location: lincolnshire uk Posts: 22	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Andy The filters are still in the UK I am taking them out on Sat. I will be taking some to the dive show and giving them to people competent enough to fit them. I will fit them over the weekend so if anyone wants one fitting give me a call +447736548148, the bits cost £5, fitting is FOC. Leon has a stand in the rebreather section (1741). Dennis Vessey
(Offline)

2nd October 2006, 00:13	#20 (permalink)
Joe RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 321	Re: First solenoid stuck shut, yesterday stuck open...... Quote: (Originally Posted by sabgia) Quite interesting. I wonder if there might be something else going on? Have you taken your 1st stage apart, and maybe viz-inspect your O2 tank. Yes. Checked the reg, inspected the condition of the scintered (sp?) filter and visualed the tanks even though all were new. I have no idea what part was defective but once I changed everything the problem went away.
(Offline)

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