ordering a new meg...how?

quickean · 12th August 2006, 19:09

That must be an old price list. I think they upped their prices. On the list I received a couple of months ago it listed the complete Meg at $8153 and the stripped at $7708. That's the price listed on Going Under Dive Center's website I believe too.

**woody** · 12th August 2006, 19:22

Does anyone know if Leon now accepts credit card payments for the Meg and does anyone have an upto date price list they can post?

Thanks.

R

Mike

TordoffR · 12th August 2006, 20:28

Quote: (Originally Posted by woody)

Does anyone know if Leon now accepts credit card payments for the Meg and does anyone have an upto date price list they can post?

Thanks.

R

Mike

This might be a good deal for you...
http://www.rebreatherworld.com/rebre...-meg-sale.html

**wedivebc** · 13th August 2006, 07:00

Quote: (Originally Posted by Scuba_Vixen)

I wonder now if he had a "Do Over", if he'd choose the meg instead?

Darlene

From reading subsequent posts he hasn't had the best luck with his unit for sure.

Gillenvy, comments????

**Gill Envy** · 14th August 2006, 08:39

Quote: (Originally Posted by Scuba_Vixen)

I wonder now if he had a "Do Over", if he'd choose the meg instead?

Darlene

Quote: (Originally Posted by wedivebc)

From reading subsequent posts he hasn't had the best luck with his unit for sure.

Gillenvy, comments????

well, i imagine anyone who's been paying attention to the progression of my posts would have to wonder wouldn't they? At the risk of going horribly off topic to this thread I’ll try and respond and still try to bring it back to topic. I’ll apologize in advance, brevity is not one of my strong points.

The long and short of it is that i/we are going through a phase of disappointment with rebreathers in general. As recreational divers, our search for the perfect rebreather was focussed on finding the most user friendly of them. At this point I have come to the realization that there is not one on the market yet...they all have their weak points and areas where each design shines. We still think they are amazing, we can't imagine going back, but our experience has turned off even the most interested of our OC friends and the skeptics in our midst are feeling vindicated, or should I say even worried for us.

While none of the problems we've had have been imminently life threatening, they have shaken our confidence and trust. My unit has been pretty much trouble free, minus a dilluent leak issue that scared the crap out of me but which was arguably an issue of not checking all the connections pre dive. But for my wife it’s another story, her issues include a blown solenoid that left her high and dry on our first big dive trip since making the switch (extremely rare from what we can gather, but extremely dissapointing). To add jitters to her first scare, she got a full blown %100 OTU warning, buzzer, red lights and all, all be it, only on one dive but with the most recent software update but it was only 80 minutes into our first dive of the day, with a day in between dives (this was on a barrowed head). She is very disappointed with the purchase, has even muttered that maybe we should sell both and wait for the Apex III to come out on the meg. It’s hard, well nearly impossible, to know how much this kind of stuff comes with the territory and how much of it is related to our specific brand of rebreather. Unfortunately it’s very difficult to get a meaningful first hand comparison without getting dual trained and somehow rent a meg for an extended period.

Has our experience shaken our confidence enough to switch brands or give up rebreather diving all together? Not yet, though my wife is very much on the fence, mostly just needing to get back on the horse and have some good experiences. we will likely keep diving our evo’s and assume that our issues so far have been mostly a matter of bad luck… time will tell. I suppose if it takes much longer to get my wife’s lid back from the AP mother ship, that might be another story (5 weeks and counting- 10% of the warranty has expired in that time).

If our experience is indicative, AP is going to have to start certifying repair facilities in north America (as leon is rumored to be preparing to do post CE in europe), station loaner electronics in more remote hubs, and/or make their rebreathers and their policies with the inevitability of field servicing more in mind.

I think tec divers are more tolerant in dealing with complications while pursuing pioneering ventures, recreational divers are likely to be less tolerant of dealing with lots of complications when they mostly just want extended range in terms of time without having to wear doubles. If AP really wants to break out into the recreational dive market, where most of the expansion is yet to come, it’s just not going to fly with folks to have even one vacation ruined because of a lack of access to spare parts and service. Even false alarms significantly undermine one’s confidence… as my wife has put it, if the OTU warning was wrong, what else is it miscalculating?

The only other rebreather i would consider is the meg but i am still sufficiently leery of it’s oxygen controlling system and I really want integrated deco and i really like the temp stick on the evo. A vision meg fusion would be my pick at this point… modularity, rugged build and state of the art electronics would be my dream machine, but I could get much of that by adding one of the travel frames on the market to what I already have. As strange as it may sound, the electronics were and still are of higher priority to me than build quality. For us, the vision electronics still have the lead, even with their quirks. It’s more like the whole market is not as far along as we had thought.

In any case, with respect to the meg vs evo/vision inspo the horse race is closer at this point, and will get even closer with the eventual release of Apex III (integrated deco and it’s more continuious o2 injection system) and the scale just may tip if we continue to have issues with our evolutions. Certainly for the beating that our rebreathers will get over time as they get dragged from kayak to jagged rocky perch in the pacific north west, a meg is designed more to take it, no doubt. As I said, time will tell.

As for ordering a meg, the true topic of this thread, I would have to say that making the process more straight forward for the first time rebreather buyer would be a good thing. To this day, I don’t know how much all the bits would have cost or which configuration would have best suited my needs and would i have had to take an extra course to figure out how to put my custom configuration together? The number of options was too mind boggling for me, emailing through the website resulted in no response, and my calls in to the company were not answered and there was no information on the answering machine as to a good time to call back, with the changes I see on their web site, perhaps that has changed too. I have gotten the impression from talking to others, that ironically, the customer service with ISC is quite good.

On the other hand I don’t get the impression that the meg is marketed to first time rebreather buyers such as myself but instead marketed to the hard core tec diver who is more likely to be persistant and more versed in what their configuration preference would be, so losing business to people like me is probably of little concern to ISC. Maybe down the line, once I have some more experience, the process will seem less daunting to me…for now, I’m keeping my fingers crossed that we will get in a good groove with our current units and return to being happy evo owners. In any case, i'll always have a thing for the meg.

Onwards and downwards,

Scuba_Vixen · 14th August 2006, 14:21

Thanks a Million!

For taking the time and soul searching to respond with so much thought and detail.

I think you hit the proverbial nail on the head with the thoughts about whether rebreathers, as they are at this point in sophistication, are even well suited to the recreational diver's mindset. While some small percentage may be ready to step up to the added complexity and responsibility of Rebreather diving, most are not ready , willing, or probably able, to do so. No amout of sophisticated electronics can take the place of diver capability.

Thanks again so much for sharing your experiences.

Darlene

***EBT*** · 14th August 2006, 14:33

Good post Gill, thanks.

One thing that I think is VERY valid is knowing the expected limits of your dive. Whether that be for OC divers with VR3's, or rebreather divers with loop integrated electronics. This way when the unit bugs out (eg high OTU alarms, or failled depth sensors), you know exactly what to expect and what you can safely ignore.

I have to agree with you though, that once a unit starts displaying funky readings, your trust in its other functions has to be questioned.

To me, theres an argument for separate control functions for the set point maintenance vs deco displays. After all, one is life support, the other is a "nice to have".

/Zak

**wedivebc** · 14th August 2006, 14:34

Nice post Gillenvy. Have a blob man.

Now back to our regularly schedueled thread.

**Gill Envy** · 15th August 2006, 01:45

Quote: (Originally Posted by EBT)

Good post Gill, thanks.

To me, theres an argument for separate control functions for the set point maintenance vs deco displays. After all, one is life support, the other is a "nice to have".

/Zak

More and more i'm seeing the wisdom in this thinking, i was originally hoping to keep it simple with one less computer screen.

Steve · 15th August 2006, 01:52

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gillenvy)

More and more i'm seeing the wisdom in this thinking,.

Yes, for a man with no gorm he comes out with some surprisingly clever things

12th August 2006, 19:09	#21 (permalink)
quickean RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 140	Re: ordering a new meg...how? That must be an old price list. I think they upped their prices. On the list I received a couple of months ago it listed the complete Meg at $8153 and the stripped at $7708. That's the price listed on Going Under Dive Center's website I believe too.
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12th August 2006, 19:22	#22 (permalink)
woody Not a euphemism! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Sport Kiss Other CCR Join Date: May 2005 Location: Wiltshire UK Posts: 208	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Does anyone know if Leon now accepts credit card payments for the Meg and does anyone have an upto date price list they can post? Thanks. R Mike __________________ Never been known to use a word that might send a reader to the dictionary! Last edited by woody : 12th August 2006 at 19:33.
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12th August 2006, 20:28	#23 (permalink)
TordoffR Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Upstate NY Posts: 115	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Quote: (Originally Posted by woody) Does anyone know if Leon now accepts credit card payments for the Meg and does anyone have an upto date price list they can post? Thanks. R Mike This might be a good deal for you... http://www.rebreatherworld.com/rebre...-meg-sale.html __________________ Rich "It's better to burn out, than to fade away."
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13th August 2006, 07:00	#24 (permalink)
wedivebc Dave Tomblin Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 1,508	Re: The Meg Quote: (Originally Posted by Scuba_Vixen) I wonder now if he had a "Do Over", if he'd choose the meg instead? Darlene From reading subsequent posts he hasn't had the best luck with his unit for sure. Gillenvy, comments???? __________________ Cheers, Dave.... Man is the only animal burdened with the knowledge he will eventually die
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14th August 2006, 08:39	#25 (permalink)
Gill Envy Shearwater Copis Divers Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Other CCR Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: seattle Posts: 1,347	Re: The Meg Quote: (Originally Posted by Scuba_Vixen) I wonder now if he had a "Do Over", if he'd choose the meg instead? Darlene Quote: (Originally Posted by wedivebc) From reading subsequent posts he hasn't had the best luck with his unit for sure. Gillenvy, comments???? well, i imagine anyone who's been paying attention to the progression of my posts would have to wonder wouldn't they? At the risk of going horribly off topic to this thread I’ll try and respond and still try to bring it back to topic. I’ll apologize in advance, brevity is not one of my strong points. The long and short of it is that i/we are going through a phase of disappointment with rebreathers in general. As recreational divers, our search for the perfect rebreather was focussed on finding the most user friendly of them. At this point I have come to the realization that there is not one on the market yet...they all have their weak points and areas where each design shines. We still think they are amazing, we can't imagine going back, but our experience has turned off even the most interested of our OC friends and the skeptics in our midst are feeling vindicated, or should I say even worried for us. While none of the problems we've had have been imminently life threatening, they have shaken our confidence and trust. My unit has been pretty much trouble free, minus a dilluent leak issue that scared the crap out of me but which was arguably an issue of not checking all the connections pre dive. But for my wife it’s another story, her issues include a blown solenoid that left her high and dry on our first big dive trip since making the switch (extremely rare from what we can gather, but extremely dissapointing). To add jitters to her first scare, she got a full blown %100 OTU warning, buzzer, red lights and all, all be it, only on one dive but with the most recent software update but it was only 80 minutes into our first dive of the day, with a day in between dives (this was on a barrowed head). She is very disappointed with the purchase, has even muttered that maybe we should sell both and wait for the Apex III to come out on the meg. It’s hard, well nearly impossible, to know how much this kind of stuff comes with the territory and how much of it is related to our specific brand of rebreather. Unfortunately it’s very difficult to get a meaningful first hand comparison without getting dual trained and somehow rent a meg for an extended period. Has our experience shaken our confidence enough to switch brands or give up rebreather diving all together? Not yet, though my wife is very much on the fence, mostly just needing to get back on the horse and have some good experiences. we will likely keep diving our evo’s and assume that our issues so far have been mostly a matter of bad luck… time will tell. I suppose if it takes much longer to get my wife’s lid back from the AP mother ship, that might be another story (5 weeks and counting- 10% of the warranty has expired in that time). If our experience is indicative, AP is going to have to start certifying repair facilities in north America (as leon is rumored to be preparing to do post CE in europe), station loaner electronics in more remote hubs, and/or make their rebreathers and their policies with the inevitability of field servicing more in mind. I think tec divers are more tolerant in dealing with complications while pursuing pioneering ventures, recreational divers are likely to be less tolerant of dealing with lots of complications when they mostly just want extended range in terms of time without having to wear doubles. If AP really wants to break out into the recreational dive market, where most of the expansion is yet to come, it’s just not going to fly with folks to have even one vacation ruined because of a lack of access to spare parts and service. Even false alarms significantly undermine one’s confidence… as my wife has put it, if the OTU warning was wrong, what else is it miscalculating? The only other rebreather i would consider is the meg but i am still sufficiently leery of it’s oxygen controlling system and I really want integrated deco and i really like the temp stick on the evo. A vision meg fusion would be my pick at this point… modularity, rugged build and state of the art electronics would be my dream machine, but I could get much of that by adding one of the travel frames on the market to what I already have. As strange as it may sound, the electronics were and still are of higher priority to me than build quality. For us, the vision electronics still have the lead, even with their quirks. It’s more like the whole market is not as far along as we had thought. In any case, with respect to the meg vs evo/vision inspo the horse race is closer at this point, and will get even closer with the eventual release of Apex III (integrated deco and it’s more continuious o2 injection system) and the scale just may tip if we continue to have issues with our evolutions. Certainly for the beating that our rebreathers will get over time as they get dragged from kayak to jagged rocky perch in the pacific north west, a meg is designed more to take it, no doubt. As I said, time will tell. As for ordering a meg, the true topic of this thread, I would have to say that making the process more straight forward for the first time rebreather buyer would be a good thing. To this day, I don’t know how much all the bits would have cost or which configuration would have best suited my needs and would i have had to take an extra course to figure out how to put my custom configuration together? The number of options was too mind boggling for me, emailing through the website resulted in no response, and my calls in to the company were not answered and there was no information on the answering machine as to a good time to call back, with the changes I see on their web site, perhaps that has changed too. I have gotten the impression from talking to others, that ironically, the customer service with ISC is quite good. On the other hand I don’t get the impression that the meg is marketed to first time rebreather buyers such as myself but instead marketed to the hard core tec diver who is more likely to be persistant and more versed in what their configuration preference would be, so losing business to people like me is probably of little concern to ISC. Maybe down the line, once I have some more experience, the process will seem less daunting to me…for now, I’m keeping my fingers crossed that we will get in a good groove with our current units and return to being happy evo owners. In any case, i'll always have a thing for the meg. Onwards and downwards, __________________ Gill Envy ...Because I wasn't born with gills! ><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>
(Offline)

14th August 2006, 14:21	#26 (permalink)
Scuba_Vixen e/mCCR Dolphin Pilot Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: St. Croix USVI Posts: 557	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Thanks a Million! For taking the time and soul searching to respond with so much thought and detail. I think you hit the proverbial nail on the head with the thoughts about whether rebreathers, as they are at this point in sophistication, are even well suited to the recreational diver's mindset. While some small percentage may be ready to step up to the added complexity and responsibility of Rebreather diving, most are not ready , willing, or probably able, to do so. No amout of sophisticated electronics can take the place of diver capability. Thanks again so much for sharing your experiences. Darlene
(Offline)

14th August 2006, 14:33	#27 (permalink)
*EBT* Apprentice Luddite Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK, Brighton Posts: 2,111	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Good post Gill, thanks. One thing that I think is VERY valid is knowing the expected limits of your dive. Whether that be for OC divers with VR3's, or rebreather divers with loop integrated electronics. This way when the unit bugs out (eg high OTU alarms, or failled depth sensors), you know exactly what to expect and what you can safely ignore. I have to agree with you though, that once a unit starts displaying funky readings, your trust in its other functions has to be questioned. To me, theres an argument for separate control functions for the set point maintenance vs deco displays. After all, one is life support, the other is a "nice to have". /Zak __________________ Eagles May Soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! RBW Terms of service Last edited by EBT : 14th August 2006 at 14:36.
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14th August 2006, 14:34	#28 (permalink)
wedivebc Dave Tomblin Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 1,508	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Nice post Gillenvy. Have a blob man. Now back to our regularly schedueled thread. __________________ Cheers, Dave.... Man is the only animal burdened with the knowledge he will eventually die
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15th August 2006, 01:45	#29 (permalink)
Gill Envy Shearwater Copis Divers Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Other CCR Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: seattle Posts: 1,347	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Quote: (Originally Posted by EBT) Good post Gill, thanks. To me, theres an argument for separate control functions for the set point maintenance vs deco displays. After all, one is life support, the other is a "nice to have". /Zak More and more i'm seeing the wisdom in this thinking, i was originally hoping to keep it simple with one less computer screen. __________________ Gill Envy ...Because I wasn't born with gills! ><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>
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15th August 2006, 01:52	#30 (permalink)
Steve Ladies bring a plate Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Classic Kiss MK 15.X Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Perth - Australia Posts: 1,126	Re: ordering a new meg...how? Quote: (Originally Posted by Gillenvy) More and more i'm seeing the wisdom in this thinking,. Yes, for a man with no gorm he comes out with some surprisingly clever things __________________ WARNING: I contain occasional coarse language, extreme sexual references, nudity, and adult themes, which may offend some people - Usually churchy types. Last edited by Steve : 15th August 2006 at 02:34.
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