Spheres

Dave Sutton

Uhhh...... no, actually we're talking about a Learjet... . if it were a *Falcon* I'd agree.... (only kidding, I flew Lears for years and still fly an old 23 for a friend now and then.)

Seriously, aerospace components are rarely selected for cost, they are selected for benefit. The sphere is located in the unpressurized nose cone area, wedged in under the RADAR antenna and squeezed in between a myriad of other hydraulic and pneumaic components. The spherical shape is for form-factor. Why inconel? Corrosion resistance would be my guess.... that area can get wet (tire water being slung off during takeoff and landing). As far as temperature, it gets cold soaked to as low as -50 at FL510 (!), the certified ceiling of the Lear 25 (what I saw the sphere installled on).


OK, so to segue into the Mark-15/CCR-1000/Aerospace/NASA/TAVCO sphere connections...


Mark-15/CCR-1000 trivia: Little known (unknown) information?

The CCR-1000 was not originally designed only for diving, but was originally fabricated (at least in a quantity of two) as a small life support system for dry environment survival for the Johnson Sea-Link submersible. This is not based on speculation, it's based on my PERSONAL observations at Harbor Branch, as well as some hardware that's in my collection (see below). Sadly, the system was tried in anger, and it failed due to cold soaked scrubbers that did not work after the vehicle was trapped on the bottom in a well known accident in 1973. Ed Link's son was lost in the accident, described in a short version here:

"A tragic accident near Key West, Florida in 1973 took the lives of E C Link and A Stover. The men, along with scientists A Menzies and R Meek who survived, where aboard the Johnson-Sea-Link submersible when it became trapped in the wreckage of a scuttled destroyer 360 ft underwater. An anti-snag framework had been added to the submersible and apparently this became clipped into a snap hook on a fishing net snagged in the shipwreck. Strong currents thwarted efforts of divers in freeing the sub. The water temperature was 40F and this contributed to the accident by impeding the action of Baralyme in absorbing carbon dioxide from the air. The divers were in a separate, colder compartment from the scientists and although they added fresh oxygen the two men eventually lost conciousness and died of carbon dioxide poisoning."

See also:

Entanglement of the Submersible Johnson Sea Link with Submerged Wreckage off Key West, Florida on or About 17 June 1973 with Loss of Life.


And Google "Johnson Sea-Link Accident".

In any case: I am completely convinced that the CCR-1000 as an *underwater* system was a spin-off from a very similar design used in the JSL submersible as a dry survival system. Here's the evidence: I have a set of parkerized spheres here from Tavco from the *exact* system installed in the JSL (as well as the center section of that system) that have smaller than standard threads, are marked "Receiver, Hydraulic", and which came from CCR-1000 scrubber and pneumatics system that was *dry mounted* on the bulkhead of the Johnson Sea Link II sub (in the diver lockout chamber) for use as a dry habitat survival life support system sometime in 1969 (based on the date on the sticker on the spheres). The sphere valves have gauges tapped into where the blowout discs would be, the gauges are dry-gauges (not suitable for underwater use), and the center section, although being a CCR-1000 "similar" one has totally different hose connections and is set so that the hose connections stick out at a 90 degree angle so that the hoses would work when the center section was hard mounted on the bulkhead of the submarine. This is *definately* the oldest piece of CCR-1000 hardware that I have ever seen (1969 at latest). The scrubber is hand-made, you can see that it was filed to fit, and it is obviously not a production item (but is *absolutely* a CCR-1000 scrubber). The system was installed in the JSL *prior to the accident described above*, as it is THE EXACT HARDWARE from the SAME SYSTEM that failed due to cold soaked scrubbers and resulted in the death of the two divers in the lockout system. I obtained the hardware from Dr. Dave Youngblood (who co-authored the in water recompression paper with Rich Pyle that we reference continuously), and he obtained it after the accident investigation was concluded (he was a party to the investigation as a hyperbaric physician). The hardware ended up in the hands of Phil Nyutten, and he sent it to Dave Youngblood out of his shed of crap about 8 years ago when I asked Dave to try to get me some Mark-15 stuff from Phil's junk piles. There is *zero* doubt as to the provinence of the hardware: It's right out of the JSL submersible.

The following is *pure speculation*, but it makes sense: We KNOW that a CCR-1000 "look alike" was installed in the JSL around 1969. I speculate that the *diving* CCR-1000 was a spin-off of this, not the other way around. Here's why I think that: First, the oldest known CCR-1000 "type" hardware that I have ever seen is the stuff I describe above. Second, the JSL submersibles contain other spheres for gas supplies, in varying sizes. Most seem to have come from NASA supplies up at Cape Canaveral, which is only about 40 miles north of where the JSL's were constructed *at about the same time frame*. The two *oldest* CCR-1000's (diving version) that I ever saw were the two that we played with in 1978 or 79 (need to look at my logs) at Harbor Branch as students at Florida Institute of Technology (Underwater Technology Program). These were *definately* prototype CCR-1000's. Tim Askew, then the Chief Diver at Harbor Branch, told us that they were "Designed specially for the JSL Program" and that these were "One of a kind hardware that we had designed for the subs". At that time, there were 4 CCR-1000s in use at Harbor Branch for diver lockout, two for each sub, and the emergency scrubber systems had already been removed after the accident.

Here's my speculation: The CCR-1000 was built up as a dual-purpose system for wet/dry use, driven by the needs of Harbor Branch. The selection of spheres was driven by their earlier use aboard the JSL's, which were built by a group of guys that overlapped between NASA and Harbor Branch. At the very least the two systems were built "in parallel". If anyone can date a "diving" CCR-1000 to prior to 1969, let me know. Otherwise the baseline so far is "1969" and "Dry Hyperbaric Life Support System" as the earliest CCR-1000 based on *hardware in hand* as opposed to "stories to tell". I'd love to talk to Mike Iswalt about this, if anyone can locate him for me.

Just a last tie-in: Jim Woodberry, the Diving Officer for the Underwater Technology Program at the Florida Institute of Technology when I was a student there, was a prior NASA cryogenics engineer, who had earlier developed the Mako Cryogenic SCUBA that was marketed by Jordan Klein (google him too). The NASA / JSL / Aerospace / Florida Cape Canaveral community / CCR-1000 "networking" link is an interesting one, and if anyone ever does a real history of the CCR-1000, I bet that they would find this to be a key to the history.

I'll shoot photos of the stuff if anyone wants to see it.


But, bottom line: The spheres were off the shelf *aerospace* parts taken underwater, not the other way 'round. No surprise that it's in a Learjet dating from the 1960's.


Dave

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Professional Small Boy: Never Successfully Cubicled.

teksimple

Interesting, Dave.

An old Harbor Branch brochure shows what looks to be a CCR-1000 at depth with the caption:

Diver/Scientist at 500' with Closed Circuit Harbor Branch/Bio-Marine Rebreather and Modified Kirby-Morgan Helmet.

I wish I would have owned my Mk 15.5 back when I worked at Harbor Branch. Those guys were (are?) certainly pioneers of deep diving. They had a lot of cool stuff in the day. Now liability is so ridiculous no one is allowed to enter the water from a research vessel without a ream of paperwork. Tim Askew was in charge of operations (including sub ops) at HBOI when I left, and according to HBOI's web site, still is. Anyone talk to him recently about the CCR-1000 origins? Gene Melton from HS Eng would probably know something about that, too.

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Dave Sutton

And there's the key phrase I was looking for" "Harbor Branch/Biomarine Rebreather", with the inherant statement that Harbor Branch was part and parcel of the design team. That fits perfectly with what I speculated was true. I'll dig up photos later, I have pics of the helmet and rig combination from 1978 when we first got to play with them.

When were you there? Jeez... Tim must be an old bugger now, as I knew him there as early as 1978. Did you know my classmate Steve Hall? He was a sub pilot there in the early 80's. Jim Goldsby? Another classmate who was a sub tech there (electronics guy). FIT/Jensen Beach and HBOI were pretty closely linked when I went to school, we were up there fairly regularly for field trips, workshops, and "hands on the hardware" days. They hired a load of our graduates right out of school.


Ed Link was THE man for starting deep diving in the USA. That inflatable habitat that he built was WAY ahead of it's time. The early mini-sat systems were cutting edge. The RV Johnson with the sat system under the deck and the JSL able to lock the diver lockout chamber to the sat chamber was a magic carpet ride for the reseaqrch diver: What fabuous capability, now all removed.. I remember walking around the RVJ in awe. Is she even still afloat, or has the Seward J fuly replaced her?


Dave

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"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others"


Professional Small Boy: Never Successfully Cubicled.

koputai

Not really Dave. I have a book with pictures of a CCR-1000 and it's written up as being developed by Innerspace Systems. Of course all Innerspace did was buy CCR-1000's from Biomarine, whack their stickers and an Aquadyne helmet on it and called it their own. Maybe Harbor Branch did something similar?
Don't you remember Kevin J's write up on the 'History of Biomarine'? I couldn't get it out of the old NWDesigns archive, but found a copy here:
http://www.therebreathersite.nl/04_L...0BioMarine.pdf
From what Kevin said, no one but Biomarine was involved.

Cheers,
Jason.

Jimmer

It said in that article, that Carleton is making Mk16's for other navies. Anyone know which ones? I assume the Canadian navy, since I believe the Mk16's are built here at Carleton's Canadian office.

stumpy's widgets

By chance give Martin at Tecme a try you never know he is a really good source of things and a even better person!! just a thought.

Drmike

why dont you tell us the source?

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Get a girlfriend you sad twat - a Rebreather is an unfaithful mistress - dont blind yourself to her faults just because she goes down on you

Crazyduck

mfg search engine- thomasnet.com

This was interesting
ThomasNet® - Category Search Results: Product/Service

search resulted in four companies one was-
Applied Companies, The - Valencia, CA
Manufacturer
Applied Companies - Valencia

This was even better-
http://www.appliedcompanies.net/pressure_vessels.pdf
please refer to pg 6 and 7

Andrew

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Rob Davie April 2005-

Presently in a state of transition from Open Circuit to Closed Circuit.

"You will not be punished for your anger; you will be punished by it." - Buddha.

diverrob

I know this is not what the post is about but I thought I would give you a answer to your question. Carleton does not make the MK16 for the Canadian Navy and they are not made in Canada. In fact the Canadian division of Carleton (Fullerton Sherwood) has moved down to the US a few months ago. Canada does get their Rebreather from Carleton but we use the SIVA and SIVA+ (CCDA and CUMA to us).

Rob

HMP

I read an article about the Canadian navies SIVA, its semi closed isnt it? But it does use the same spheres.
The Royal Navy uses the MK16 currently and there are endless rumors of its replacement. I believe AP, Delta P and Divex all tendered for it.
Due to strict rules on decommissioned life support items, all the Mk16's will sadly be destroyed when they are retired.