How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers?

Drmike · 18th October 2007, 12:11

Quote: (Originally Posted by Paul G)

I was away recently on an expedition with a corrosion expert. He said that the exotic metal that Iconel spheres are made from is the same exotic metal that 5, 10, 20 and 50 cent coins are made from in Australia. I was very disappointed to hear that they weren't exotic at all! 70% copper and 30% nickel from memory.

Cheers,
Paul

Arent Iconel spheres made from....Inconel?

same thing diff spelling. Its nickel based superalloy with some cool properties (no copper)

Ni, Cr and x ( x depending on prop req.)

Im bored so checked - Australian coins are made from Cu Ni alloy....not Inconel.

the pedantic will inherit the earth!

PS, Hi Paul, did you let Dave A know?

Cheers
M

bambang · 18th October 2007, 15:39

Hi guys..

Is it true that Inconel is non magnetic? Is that why military rebreather use them? Are they expensive metal? How much more expensive to manufacture Inconel cylinder than steel cylinder for example?

tks,

BB

***caveseeker7*** · 18th October 2007, 17:18

Tavco in CA, manufacturer of the Inconel flasks used in military rebreathers, requires a minimum order of 50 units.
Prices fluctuate (as metals go), but are usually $1000+ each.

Jimmer · 18th October 2007, 17:20

Yes Inconel is non magnetic. It's very pricey because it is a HUGE pain to work with. Forging, machining, and welding are all very very difficult on Inconel. I worked at a machine shop that cut Inconel from time to time, and it was a mess. A good friend of mine learned to weld Inconel when he was in welding school, and said the hassle was barely worth the reward. But then again when it comes to the military, they don't care what things cost. Same reason F1 cars have Inconel exhaust headers, that are used for one race then scrapped...price is no object.

Paul G · 18th October 2007, 20:26

For us the more relevant property of inconel is that it doesn't corrode, unlike steel and aluminium.

Yes Mike. Have let Dave know and we're both disappointed!

Cheers,
Paul

chunter · 18th October 2007, 22:49

Quote: (Originally Posted by teksimple)

Take my word for it, these rigs are crap. Especially the Mk 15.5. But for some reason certain individuals are hoarding the rather terrible but scarce parts and making it appear as if these rigs are more valuable than they actually are. Why, just the other day I heard someone in my neighborhood had more than a half dozen Inconel spheres. Those "space-age" containers are junk. I wouldn't pay more than...fifty bucks for one of those things.

These aren't the rebreathers you're looking for. You can go about your business. Move along.

Come on...seven is just barely more than half a dozen.

I do agree though...15.5s are total crap.

Drmike · 19th October 2007, 03:01

Quote: (Originally Posted by Paul G)

Yes Mike. Have let Dave know and we're both disappointed!

alas, so many caves - so little time

DZLHED · 26th October 2007, 11:52

My favorite part of working on my MK 15 is calling Hawaii fluid systems (my Swagelok) dealer and ordering parts that are delivered promptly and cheaply. Oh... and ribbing chunter because he teased me for diving a dinosaur not but a year and a half ago. He swore by Inspo at the time. Now of course his 15.5 is new (old stock) and all, but I still don't have a lexan dome to crack... and as for Inconel and it's magical properties... May be tough to work with but the end result is lovely regardless it's molecular makeup. An omlettte is just egg but have you had one prepared properly?

chunter · 26th October 2007, 16:42

Quote: (Originally Posted by DZLHED)

Oh... and ribbing chunter because he teased me for diving a dinosaur not but a year and a half ago. He swore by Inspo at the time. Now of course his 15.5 is new (old stock) and all, but I still don't have a lexan dome to crack

You do dive a dinosaur

As my primary rig, I wouldn't dive a 15. I don't like the rubberband seals or filling it through a hole. The 15.5 is a totally different machine. Fortunately I have a spare dome...and canister...and center section, so I don't need to worry too much about parts.

I do agree with you on the bulletproofedness (nice word eh?) of the 15, and am considering one as a travel rig.

I still think the inspo that I had was a good rig (hammerhead version). After I upgraded to the Vision, I got frustrated with the electronics problems that I had and decided that I wanted a unit that I could fully service myself. For most of the rebreather population (guys that dive a couple of times a month), the Inspiration is a pretty good unit. I just didn't want to be stuck without a primary rig for 2 months again and thought I'd give something else a try.

18th October 2007, 12:11	#11 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,162	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Quote: (Originally Posted by Paul G) I was away recently on an expedition with a corrosion expert. He said that the exotic metal that Iconel spheres are made from is the same exotic metal that 5, 10, 20 and 50 cent coins are made from in Australia. I was very disappointed to hear that they weren't exotic at all! 70% copper and 30% nickel from memory. Cheers, Paul Arent Iconel spheres made from....Inconel? same thing diff spelling. Its nickel based superalloy with some cool properties (no copper) Ni, Cr and x ( x depending on prop req.) Im bored so checked - Australian coins are made from Cu Ni alloy....not Inconel. the pedantic will inherit the earth! PS, Hi Paul, did you let Dave A know? Cheers M __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment Last edited by Drmike : 18th October 2007 at 12:27.
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18th October 2007, 15:39	#12 (permalink)
bambang New Member Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Jakarta Posts: 47	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Hi guys.. Is it true that Inconel is non magnetic? Is that why military rebreather use them? Are they expensive metal? How much more expensive to manufacture Inconel cylinder than steel cylinder for example? tks, BB
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18th October 2007, 17:18	#13 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,435	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Tavco in CA, manufacturer of the Inconel flasks used in military rebreathers, requires a minimum order of 50 units. Prices fluctuate (as metals go), but are usually $1000+ each. __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.'!"
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18th October 2007, 17:20	#14 (permalink)
Jimmer New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 58	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Yes Inconel is non magnetic. It's very pricey because it is a HUGE pain to work with. Forging, machining, and welding are all very very difficult on Inconel. I worked at a machine shop that cut Inconel from time to time, and it was a mess. A good friend of mine learned to weld Inconel when he was in welding school, and said the hassle was barely worth the reward. But then again when it comes to the military, they don't care what things cost. Same reason F1 cars have Inconel exhaust headers, that are used for one race then scrapped...price is no object.
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18th October 2007, 20:26	#15 (permalink)
Paul G New Member Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 27	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? For us the more relevant property of inconel is that it doesn't corrode, unlike steel and aluminium. Yes Mike. Have let Dave know and we're both disappointed! Cheers, Paul __________________ www.sydneyproject.com
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18th October 2007, 22:49	#16 (permalink)
chunter I like diving Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Classic Kiss Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Honolulu Posts: 473	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Quote: (Originally Posted by teksimple) Take my word for it, these rigs are crap. Especially the Mk 15.5. But for some reason certain individuals are hoarding the rather terrible but scarce parts and making it appear as if these rigs are more valuable than they actually are. Why, just the other day I heard someone in my neighborhood had more than a half dozen Inconel spheres. Those "space-age" containers are junk. I wouldn't pay more than...fifty bucks for one of those things. These aren't the rebreathers you're looking for. You can go about your business. Move along. Come on...seven is just barely more than half a dozen. I do agree though...15.5s are total crap. __________________ "Foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Emerson "Hobgoblin is a cool word." - Charlie
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19th October 2007, 03:01	#17 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,162	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Quote: (Originally Posted by Paul G) Yes Mike. Have let Dave know and we're both disappointed! alas, so many caves - so little time __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
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26th October 2007, 11:52	#18 (permalink)
DZLHED Swimmin' upstream Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Maui County, Hawaii Posts: 101	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? My favorite part of working on my MK 15 is calling Hawaii fluid systems (my Swagelok) dealer and ordering parts that are delivered promptly and cheaply. Oh... and ribbing chunter because he teased me for diving a dinosaur not but a year and a half ago. He swore by Inspo at the time. Now of course his 15.5 is new (old stock) and all, but I still don't have a lexan dome to crack... and as for Inconel and it's magical properties... May be tough to work with but the end result is lovely regardless it's molecular makeup. An omlettte is just egg but have you had one prepared properly? __________________ Aloha, Dieselhead To err is Human... to ccr, Divine. www.NorthShoreExplorers.com
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26th October 2007, 16:42	#19 (permalink)
chunter I like diving Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Classic Kiss Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Honolulu Posts: 473	Re: How do Mk15/15.5/16's compare to "modern" rebreathers? Quote: (Originally Posted by DZLHED) Oh... and ribbing chunter because he teased me for diving a dinosaur not but a year and a half ago. He swore by Inspo at the time. Now of course his 15.5 is new (old stock) and all, but I still don't have a lexan dome to crack You do dive a dinosaur As my primary rig, I wouldn't dive a 15. I don't like the rubberband seals or filling it through a hole. The 15.5 is a totally different machine. Fortunately I have a spare dome...and canister...and center section, so I don't need to worry too much about parts. I do agree with you on the bulletproofedness (nice word eh?) of the 15, and am considering one as a travel rig. I still think the inspo that I had was a good rig (hammerhead version). After I upgraded to the Vision, I got frustrated with the electronics problems that I had and decided that I wanted a unit that I could fully service myself. For most of the rebreather population (guys that dive a couple of times a month), the Inspiration is a pretty good unit. I just didn't want to be stuck without a primary rig for 2 months again and thought I'd give something else a try. __________________ "Foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Emerson "Hobgoblin is a cool word." - Charlie
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