Megaladon Versus Optima Fx

diverreb · 22nd January 2008, 15:38

Quote: (Originally Posted by Barfab)

You don't know how the scrubber works: there's the reaction zone!

I believe it's true that usage times are underrated, to some degree, by both the Sorb & EAC manufacturers for liability purposes, but just how much is anyones guess.

Regarding EAC's, you make a very valid point, backed up by Micropore.

As far as measuring the used and unused portion of a an EAC be aware that it is only a guide and not to be considered accurate.

Comments from Micropore at DEMA were very cautionary about using the hard vs soft test. The reasoning was, as Fabio has shown, that you can't tell exactly where the reaction front is, in addition to differing conditions & workloads, coupled with the fact that once you get to a certain level of usage it's basically spent. That may happen with 3/4 of the material showing solid and 1/4 still apparently flexible.

Most EAC users are doing 4 hours in warm water and 3 in cooler water. Anything past that and you are pushing the envelope. Five or six hours may work for you 95% of the time.... But it's the 5% that will come back & bite you.

Dive Safe.....

Richie

**SeaBass** · 22nd January 2008, 16:09

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

A little hint: The 905 dry suit, black and rear entry, sells for about $1600, plus whatever the local sales tax in FL is, so probably around $1750 including tax, right?

The same suit costs about €2,400 including tax!

That's almost $3,500!!!

How many of you in the US would pay that much for that suit?

Anyone yelling "Here!" put the money where your mouth is and transfer the difference to my account.

Looks like it is time to take a vacation to Florida... and buy a drysuit while your at it.

Thom

Tienuts · 22nd January 2008, 16:27

Quote: (Originally Posted by Hanssing)

I really would adwise against using this postdive analysis as a singular mean of gauging the amount used, and especially the time left unless you feel certain that:
a) You know how far the reactionfront exstends when hitting maximum SAC/workrate at depth.
b) You are sure that what you are separating the used from the completely unused part of the EAC, when taking it apart.

Please be aware, a post-dive analysis is certianly not the only means of scrubber usage that I go by. I track O2 usage carefully on a log which also notes the duration in minutes, along with the temperature, and conditions. Those of you who know me, know how meticulous and careful I am.

For those of you who don't know, an EAC can be unrolled, and the start of the reaction front can be determined very easily for the entire cross-section of the scrubber. I should clarify, I realize the downfalls of the hard/soft test, so I add to it. I should also clarify, that I do not regularly put 6 hours on an EAC, I just know that if I do, in warm water, on recreational depths - I will probably be OK.

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

But you could also turn that statement around to...

...it seems the ones who speak loudest for the EAC are the ones who know little about granular sorb...

And yes, my argument can certianly about those knowing little about EAC can certianly be turned against me. Although I have packed a Meg cannister (for my own curiosity,) I have not actually dove it.

However, for those of you who do not know me, I happen to work at, (and run) a very popular rebreather supplier who shall remain nameless. Rebreather divers and instructors from all over the world come through our doors. Working here, I have the opportunity to meet, and pick the brains of many. Not only that, but I have hands-on on 3 of the most popular units here in the US, and mostly I deal with the vendors of these units when problems arise. While I understand, this is no substitute for the years of practical experience many of you have, I am not the idiot that you assume.

Thank you. Love you all.

Tienuts - out.

decoweenie · 22nd January 2008, 16:34

Quote: (Originally Posted by Tienuts)

...However, for those of you who do not know me, I happen to work at, (and run) a very popular rebreather supplier who shall remain nameless...

Probably not very difficult to guess which one... I am also not the idiot that you think I am...

Barfab · 22nd January 2008, 17:03

Quote: (Originally Posted by jiseson)

u unroll it and u can see what was used and what was n't-u can see if it is shaped ...

Once unrolled you can squeeze it and use indefinitely!

Tienuts · 22nd January 2008, 22:24

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

Probably not very difficult to guess which one... I am also not the idiot that you think I am...

It's not a secret. I'm just not allowed to post it.

jiseson · 22nd January 2008, 23:16

Quote: (Originally Posted by Barfab)

Once unrolled you can squeeze it and use indefinitely!

all i know is-it can and does handle any deep cold dive that i care to do. anything else get's tossed out anyway. it stands water better,cold, and will never channel. to each their own. I do know about reaction zones...we can go on for ever-i am bored of this -cheers

Barfab · 22nd January 2008, 23:57

Quote: (Originally Posted by jiseson)

all i know is-it can and does handle any deep cold dive that i care to do. anything else get's tossed out anyway. it stands water better,cold, and will never channel. to each their own. I do know about reaction zones...we can go on for ever-i am bored of this -cheers

You havent' speak about reaction zone, furthermore I don't understand what you see unrolling the cartridge!
I can only see you are unrolling your slips!

Dsix36 · 23rd January 2008, 03:07

Come on guys!

The thread is Meg vs. Optima NOT Sorb vs. EAC

Lets move on to other aspects of each unit. I think the OP can figure out which scrubber to use by now.

Does this post qualify me as a mod?

.

***ScubaDadMiami*** · 23rd January 2008, 03:59

Be careful what you ask for.

22nd January 2008, 15:38	#91 (permalink)
diverreb DE/MD/NJ Wreck Diver Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Dover, DE Posts: 665	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by Barfab) You don't know how the scrubber works: there's the reaction zone! I believe it's true that usage times are underrated, to some degree, by both the Sorb & EAC manufacturers for liability purposes, but just how much is anyones guess. Regarding EAC's, you make a very valid point, backed up by Micropore. As far as measuring the used and unused portion of a an EAC be aware that it is only a guide and not to be considered accurate. Comments from Micropore at DEMA were very cautionary about using the hard vs soft test. The reasoning was, as Fabio has shown, that you can't tell exactly where the reaction front is, in addition to differing conditions & workloads, coupled with the fact that once you get to a certain level of usage it's basically spent. That may happen with 3/4 of the material showing solid and 1/4 still apparently flexible. Most EAC users are doing 4 hours in warm water and 3 in cooler water. Anything past that and you are pushing the envelope. Five or six hours may work for you 95% of the time.... But it's the 5% that will come back & bite you. Dive Safe..... Richie
(Online)

22nd January 2008, 16:09	#92 (permalink)
SeaBass Thom Susko Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Ray Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Ray Home Build Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: San Clemente, CA Posts: 246	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) A little hint: The 905 dry suit, black and rear entry, sells for about $1600, plus whatever the local sales tax in FL is, so probably around $1750 including tax, right? The same suit costs about €2,400 including tax! That's almost $3,500!!! How many of you in the US would pay that much for that suit? Anyone yelling "Here!" put the money where your mouth is and transfer the difference to my account. Looks like it is time to take a vacation to Florida... and buy a drysuit while your at it. Thom
(Offline)

22nd January 2008, 16:27	#93 (permalink)
Tienuts Chief Prankster Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fort Lauderdale Posts: 284	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by Hanssing) I really would adwise against using this postdive analysis as a singular mean of gauging the amount used, and especially the time left unless you feel certain that: a) You know how far the reactionfront exstends when hitting maximum SAC/workrate at depth. b) You are sure that what you are separating the used from the completely unused part of the EAC, when taking it apart. Please be aware, a post-dive analysis is certianly not the only means of scrubber usage that I go by. I track O2 usage carefully on a log which also notes the duration in minutes, along with the temperature, and conditions. Those of you who know me, know how meticulous and careful I am. For those of you who don't know, an EAC can be unrolled, and the start of the reaction front can be determined very easily for the entire cross-section of the scrubber. I should clarify, I realize the downfalls of the hard/soft test, so I add to it. I should also clarify, that I do not regularly put 6 hours on an EAC, I just know that if I do, in warm water, on recreational depths - I will probably be OK. Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) But you could also turn that statement around to... ...it seems the ones who speak loudest for the EAC are the ones who know little about granular sorb... And yes, my argument can certianly about those knowing little about EAC can certianly be turned against me. Although I have packed a Meg cannister (for my own curiosity,) I have not actually dove it. However, for those of you who do not know me, I happen to work at, (and run) a very popular rebreather supplier who shall remain nameless. Rebreather divers and instructors from all over the world come through our doors. Working here, I have the opportunity to meet, and pick the brains of many. Not only that, but I have hands-on on 3 of the most popular units here in the US, and mostly I deal with the vendors of these units when problems arise. While I understand, this is no substitute for the years of practical experience many of you have, I am not the idiot that you assume. Thank you. Love you all. Tienuts - out. Last edited by Tienuts : 22nd January 2008 at 16:38.
(Online)

22nd January 2008, 16:34	#94 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,487	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by Tienuts) ...However, for those of you who do not know me, I happen to work at, (and run) a very popular rebreather supplier who shall remain nameless... Probably not very difficult to guess which one... I am also not the idiot that you think I am... __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
(Offline)

22nd January 2008, 17:03	#95 (permalink)
Barfab New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Ouroboros Ray Azimuth Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Ray Azimuth Other SCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Italy Posts: 60	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by jiseson) u unroll it and u can see what was used and what was n't-u can see if it is shaped ... Once unrolled you can squeeze it and use indefinitely! __________________ World is a....Rebreather!
(Offline)

22nd January 2008, 22:24	#96 (permalink)
Tienuts Chief Prankster Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fort Lauderdale Posts: 284	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) Probably not very difficult to guess which one... I am also not the idiot that you think I am... It's not a secret. I'm just not allowed to post it.
(Online)

22nd January 2008, 23:16	#97 (permalink)
jiseson DSIX/O2PTIMA Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: long island,ny Posts: 615	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by Barfab) Once unrolled you can squeeze it and use indefinitely! all i know is-it can and does handle any deep cold dive that i care to do. anything else get's tossed out anyway. it stands water better,cold, and will never channel. to each their own. I do know about reaction zones...we can go on for ever-i am bored of this -cheers __________________ *Jonathan D Iseson*
(Online)

22nd January 2008, 23:57	#98 (permalink)
Barfab New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Ouroboros Ray Azimuth Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Ray Azimuth Other SCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Italy Posts: 60	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Quote: (Originally Posted by jiseson) all i know is-it can and does handle any deep cold dive that i care to do. anything else get's tossed out anyway. it stands water better,cold, and will never channel. to each their own. I do know about reaction zones...we can go on for ever-i am bored of this -cheers You havent' speak about reaction zone, furthermore I don't understand what you see unrolling the cartridge! I can only see you are unrolling your slips! __________________ World is a....Rebreather!
(Offline)

23rd January 2008, 03:07	#99 (permalink)
Dsix36 Going Down? Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Deerfield Beach, Florida Posts: 1,145	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Come on guys! The thread is Meg vs. Optima NOT Sorb vs. EAC Lets move on to other aspects of each unit. I think the OP can figure out which scrubber to use by now. Does this post qualify me as a mod? . __________________ THE MORE THAT I LEARN, THE MORE THAT I STILL NEED TO LEARN!!!!!!
(Online)

23rd January 2008, 03:59	#100 (permalink)
*ScubaDadMiami* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 2,213	Re: Megaladon Versus Optima Fx Be careful what you ask for. __________________ Howard Packer IANTD CCR Instructor Miami Beach, Florida CCRDiveTraining.com
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