How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber?

grahamsp · 3rd January 2006, 23:02

I'd be interested to know to what extent Inspo/Evo divers push their scrubbers past the limits prescribed by APD. Assume for the sake of the poll a comfortable dive to 50 metres or less, low/moderate workload and water more than 15 degrees C.

0% means you don't exceed the limits set, ever. 50% means you are happy to go to 4.5 hours (Inspo) or 3 hours (Evo) under the conditions given above.

Graham

Drmike · 4th January 2006, 05:56

Quote: (Originally Posted by grahamsp)

I'd be interested to know to what extent Inspo/Evo divers push their scrubbers past the limits prescribed by APD. Assume for the sake of the poll a comfortable dive to 50 metres or less, low/moderate workload and water more than 15 degrees C.

0% means you don't exceed the limits set, ever. 50% means you are happy to go to 4.5 hours (Inspo) or 3 hours (Evo) under the conditions given above.

Graham

Based on this and your other thread Im wondering why you are in such a hurry to get yourself killed? If you can afford a Rebreather surely you can afford some lime?

Trust me its not worth it.

Drmike · 4th January 2006, 06:25

My advice if you really want to push your luck with scrubber usage would be not to listen to other peoples numbers.

You need to determine what your scrubber usage will be based on your diving and on your fitness/CO2 production rates ect ect.

Also im my experience the lifetimes people say they do and what they actually do is often quite different.

You could use your temp stick as a guide and also take a look at how much clumping youve got when you change your lime.

At the end of the day the Evo has a small scrubber.

CCR900 · 4th January 2006, 07:19

So far 75% of replies say they push their scrubber, that's scary.

F

dave t · 4th January 2006, 08:44

Graham Listen to Dr Mike his words are very wise!

the temp stick contrary to what some people tried to prove is a very useful and reliable toool but thats all it is a tool NOT a co2 moniter.

Dave

Nick uk. · 4th January 2006, 09:40

I would be prepared to go over on a long dive, for example a four hour dive because of deco, but wouldn't do two 2 hour dives without changing the lime between dives, why, because you can!!

Karlos · 4th January 2006, 10:13

Quote: (Originally Posted by CCR900)

So far 75% of replies say they push their scrubber, that's scary.

F

why???

Karlos · 4th January 2006, 10:29

Quote: (Originally Posted by dave t)

Graham Listen to Dr Mike his words are very wise!

the temp stick contrary to what some people tried to prove is a very useful and reliable toool but thats all it is a tool NOT a co2 moniter.

Dave

Lets look at an average typical weekend dive:

50m
BT 30 minutes
RT ~60-70 minutes

most of your dive time is decompressing in somewhere around 10m of water. Your CO2 production is no where near what the unit is rated for and what can be achieved with the scrubber.

An Inspiration has a rated scrubber duration of 3 hours - but over the past ~5 years almost every YBOD diver has dived over the rated scrubber duration. Now I'm not saying this is always good and you shouldn't be pushing it to the absolute maximum. Having done 5 hours on the scrubber and attempting a 80m dive is an "attempted" suicide as you will more than likely be able to pull it off and not die - But - you are not leaving yourself with much room to move in my opinion. In OC terms we always think of rules of thirds - now where does that fit into the picture with Rebreather diving. The scrubber has to fit into it. Taking a scrubber to the limit is not adhering to that limit.

The Evolution scrubber is capable of handling 4 hours in warm water according to APD - the Inspiration is capable of handling 5-6 hours in warm water. Its upto you whether you want to push the rule

Cheers,
Karl

Tom F. · 4th January 2006, 11:04

I did between 5 and 6 hours on the Classic Inspiration.

I just started to dive the Vision with the tempstick, so now it will be interesting to see how crazy 5-6 hours is accordingly to the scrubber monitor.

Tom F.

CCR900 · 4th January 2006, 11:15

Quote: (Originally Posted by Karlos)

why???

Call it a love for life and a desire to spend a few bucks/quid or euros on new lime. What we are talking about here is not the small percentage of users that regularly do single run times of over 180 minutes but people that get out of the water and knowingly return to it without changing their scrubber.

The guys that build these machines say X minutes and yet we decide we know better. That is a divers choice but, and I can only speak for myself, one accident or life lost not only ruins the victims family's lives but can mean CCR being banned altogther in places were their legality is already tenious.

Is it really that tough changing one's scrubber between dives.

F

View Poll Results: How Far Do You Push Your Inspo/Evo Scrubber
I Won't - I Stick to APD's Limits	34	39.53%
I'll Go 25% Over	25	29.07%
I'll Go 50% Over	12	13.95%
I'll Go 75% Over	6	6.98%
I'll Go 100% Over	9	10.47%
Voters: 86. You may not vote on this poll

3rd January 2006, 23:02	#1 (permalink)
grahamsp New Member Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 117	How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? I'd be interested to know to what extent Inspo/Evo divers push their scrubbers past the limits prescribed by APD. Assume for the sake of the poll a comfortable dive to 50 metres or less, low/moderate workload and water more than 15 degrees C. 0% means you don't exceed the limits set, ever. 50% means you are happy to go to 4.5 hours (Inspo) or 3 hours (Evo) under the conditions given above. Graham
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4th January 2006, 05:56	#2 (permalink)
Drmike RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,335	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? Quote: (Originally Posted by grahamsp) I'd be interested to know to what extent Inspo/Evo divers push their scrubbers past the limits prescribed by APD. Assume for the sake of the poll a comfortable dive to 50 metres or less, low/moderate workload and water more than 15 degrees C. 0% means you don't exceed the limits set, ever. 50% means you are happy to go to 4.5 hours (Inspo) or 3 hours (Evo) under the conditions given above. Graham Based on this and your other thread Im wondering why you are in such a hurry to get yourself killed? If you can afford a Rebreather surely you can afford some lime? Trust me its not worth it. __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
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4th January 2006, 06:25	#3 (permalink)
Drmike RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,335	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? My advice if you really want to push your luck with scrubber usage would be not to listen to other peoples numbers. You need to determine what your scrubber usage will be based on your diving and on your fitness/CO2 production rates ect ect. Also im my experience the lifetimes people say they do and what they actually do is often quite different. You could use your temp stick as a guide and also take a look at how much clumping youve got when you change your lime. At the end of the day the Evo has a small scrubber. __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

4th January 2006, 07:19	#4 (permalink)
CCR900 Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: England Posts: 333	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? So far 75% of replies say they push their scrubber, that's scary. F
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4th January 2006, 08:44	#5 (permalink)
dave t RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Dolphin Ray Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Dolphin Ray Azimuth Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: UK Posts: 659	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? Graham Listen to Dr Mike his words are very wise! the temp stick contrary to what some people tried to prove is a very useful and reliable toool but thats all it is a tool NOT a co2 moniter. Dave
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4th January 2006, 09:40	#6 (permalink)
Nick uk. Made in England. Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Azimuth Other Rebreather/s: Azimuth Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Viale C.Colombo 75 Marina di Carrara. MS 54036 Italy Posts: 575	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? I would be prepared to go over on a long dive, for example a four hour dive because of deco, but wouldn't do two 2 hour dives without changing the lime between dives, why, because you can!! __________________ If it aint broke....don't fix it, and if it is.............well......get another one! divechief2000@hotmail.com
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4th January 2006, 10:13	#7 (permalink)
Karlos New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 55	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? Quote: (Originally Posted by CCR900) So far 75% of replies say they push their scrubber, that's scary. F why???
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4th January 2006, 10:29	#8 (permalink)
Karlos New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 55	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? Quote: (Originally Posted by dave t) Graham Listen to Dr Mike his words are very wise! the temp stick contrary to what some people tried to prove is a very useful and reliable toool but thats all it is a tool NOT a co2 moniter. Dave Lets look at an average typical weekend dive: 50m BT 30 minutes RT ~60-70 minutes most of your dive time is decompressing in somewhere around 10m of water. Your CO2 production is no where near what the unit is rated for and what can be achieved with the scrubber. An Inspiration has a rated scrubber duration of 3 hours - but over the past ~5 years almost every YBOD diver has dived over the rated scrubber duration. Now I'm not saying this is always good and you shouldn't be pushing it to the absolute maximum. Having done 5 hours on the scrubber and attempting a 80m dive is an "attempted" suicide as you will more than likely be able to pull it off and not die - But - you are not leaving yourself with much room to move in my opinion. In OC terms we always think of rules of thirds - now where does that fit into the picture with Rebreather diving. The scrubber has to fit into it. Taking a scrubber to the limit is not adhering to that limit. The Evolution scrubber is capable of handling 4 hours in warm water according to APD - the Inspiration is capable of handling 5-6 hours in warm water. Its upto you whether you want to push the rule Cheers, Karl
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4th January 2006, 11:04	#9 (permalink)
Tom F. New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Herlev, Denmark Posts: 41	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? I did between 5 and 6 hours on the Classic Inspiration. I just started to dive the Vision with the tempstick, so now it will be interesting to see how crazy 5-6 hours is accordingly to the scrubber monitor. Tom F.
(Offline)

4th January 2006, 11:15	#10 (permalink)
CCR900 Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: England Posts: 333	Re: How Far Do You Push Your Scrubber? Quote: (Originally Posted by Karlos) why??? Call it a love for life and a desire to spend a few bucks/quid or euros on new lime. What we are talking about here is not the small percentage of users that regularly do single run times of over 180 minutes but people that get out of the water and knowingly return to it without changing their scrubber. The guys that build these machines say X minutes and yet we decide we know better. That is a divers choice but, and I can only speak for myself, one accident or life lost not only ruins the victims family's lives but can mean CCR being banned altogther in places were their legality is already tenious. Is it really that tough changing one's scrubber between dives. F
(Offline)

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