Vision/evolution new electronics

gabrielesub

Hi everybody,
I need help from new APD electronic divers...
Maybe this topic has been already discussed... if so please excuse me and suggest me where to find recent information about this.
If not (or if someone can reply anyway) I need information about the new vision/evolution electronics.
I am an Inspiration diver, I own my unit since July 2003, I have over 350hrs on it at the moment.
I am thinking to switch from my Classic to the new "Vision"... same body...new heart (or I should say brain!?)

Well, here is the problem:
I am pretty scared to leave the old way to... take a new one... just reading the interesting features of the new product on a seller brochure.
I need the impression of REAL vision/evolution divers...
people who own the unit and already dove it.
Please, if you reply to this post, tell me how many dives and how many hours you have done on your unit;
It is important for me to collect the pros and cons opinion on this unit before I decide to abandon my old, but real good working, unit to buy a new one (and spend a lot of money! ).
In particular I would like to know how it works in genreral, if there is any bug on the software, how the temperature controller works, how is the decompression protocol, if there is same condensation inside the lid, how easy is to mantein it.
More comment are welcome about HUD, battery life and.... your fantasy will say more and more!


Thanks in advance,
safe diving
gabriele

decoweenie

Gabriele,

Take this as a grain of salt since I have just received my Evolution unit not too long, but here are some feed-backs based on my limited exposure with it:

1. Only ~20 hours/15 dives.
2. Works great. The best unit of 10+ units that I have/had.
3. Supposedly the Nitrox version has a time keeping error, but so far no bug reported on the Trimix version.
4. The scrubber monitor is wonderful. You could see the changes at depth and shallow during deco. In warmwater, it still show 1/2 of the scrubber is still active after almost 5 hours though...
5. Deco is a little bit difficult to compare directly to the table since the Vision deco is showing a moving ceiling instead of step-wise like GF tables, but the total runtime is very close.
6. Same condensation in the loop.
7. Same maintainance, except removing the lid is A LOT more difficult since it seems to fit tighter and almost no place on the lid for leverage.
8. I only used 1 other HUD system before (Hammerhead) so not an authority. However, it is very informative/convenient to have it always available. I will miss it greatly if diving another unit without one.
9. No idea yet since still on original batteries.

I am sure someone with more experience on the Vision electronic will come along to provide more information...

__________________
"...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..."

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GoProHonduras

Any pro's or cons when comparing the new Vision specifically asgainst the HH for Inspiration? I'm currently weighing up between HH with VR3 against Vision and really would appreciate your opinion from experience with both set ups.

Regards,
Andy

PeteS

Well, not MORE experience on the vision, however, I'd echo all the points made by Phi. And it does seem to run very nicely. It seems to control the set point closer than the old system. Baleouts are easy, with gas mixes being quickly editable underwater. You don't need to programme anything in previously, just make it up as you go along!!

It took a couple of dives to get into it, and the manual is like many others, easier to understand when you've had a play with the kit. So, my crossover went like this:-

Open box. Ooooh, new toys. Start up handset, play, read manual enough to get in the water, go diving and play lots with the buttons, while running from the H S Explorer for deco so that if I really screwed up it didn't matter. Get back home and read manual. "Oh, THAT'S what they mean...." Go diving again to reinforce lessons. Repeat often. Piece of piss really!!

Dive Planning?, who said that!!!!

I think that the best way to run it would be Inspiration with Vision electronics, with an Explorer or VR3 on your wrist, not linked to the Inspiration, for those "Oh shit" moments......

__________________
Pete S.

http://www.steggle.co.nz

Every silver lining has a cloud

decoweenie

I didn't have the HH-Inspiration system, but dived the very first HH-KISS system last year.

The first set had these issues that were fixed by the second set:

• Flooded connector - my fault since I didn't push it all the way and it was off by 1-2mm which where the o-ring was located (at the end of connector )
• Battery compartment housing rotated and sheared the power connector when installing the battery cap too tight. Handset is considered destroyed when/if that happens.

Some quick main points on the second set:

• HH deco profile uses step-wise method so more easy to compare/follow to GF tables.
• GF lo/hi values didn't match up between tables and computers - this means 10/100 from tables produces different profile from 10/100 from computer. Computer was more aggressive.
• After a few dives, I was able to tune in by using more conservative values of GF lo/hi on the computer to match my 10/100 table.
• The deep and intermediate profiles match perfectly to the table, but the last 2 stops from HH computer are still too short in the range of 10-15 minutes at the last 2 stops.
• HUD is great especially in Smithers mode - blink red/green sequence to show PO2 of each sensor.
• I had a battery issue with the Primary handset that I had to use new battery for each trimix dive. There was no indicator for the remaining capacity of the battery, so it could die anytime. On one of the dives, I only had the secondary and dived the unit on manual set-point.

I only had 6 dives on the unit before the solenoid died. All of the dives were Trimix dives from 72m to 92m. Everything was reported back to Kevin and posted on the KISS list. Both sets were sent back as well.

I don't know if anything was fixed since I sold my Classic-KISS late last year.

Other than those mentioned issues, everything else works well. The set-point was kept very close, backlight on handset, vibrator on HUD, etc.

HH is still a good deal considering the cost, especially now that Kevin has improved a lot of the design. I would still love to be able to try it on the Inspiration one day...

Concerning the VR-3, I just don't like the ZHL + microbubble (Pyle) stops profile that it uses. However, I have one that I use for backing up my tables or teaching courses when everyone uses VR-3. It is reliable, the color screen is wonderful at depth and in darker environment.

I have used the cell-intergrated feature for a few trimix dives, and didn't bother again since it made no difference unless the loop set-point is way off from the intended set-point (for the KISS) - which is a totally different issue to work on.

But to use it as the back-up 4th might be useful.

In short, all systems will have issues.

However on the Vision, it is easy to fix since the patch is sent via email for you to download into the unit. For any other unit, you will have the courier the package to the manufacturer to do a simple software upgrade.

Just IMHO...

__________________
"...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..."

- Rebreather World PM

jradomski

The battery issue sounds like it was an early rev b issue..

Still no battery indicator, For Rev C, I treat it as a 6 hour battery when using a 1.5v AA cell, life is actually about 2 times this but AA cells are cheap.. If you use 3.6v AA, 2-3 weeks of diving everyday is the norm..

__________________
Joe Radomski
CCR Trimix Instructor Trainer
ANDI Instructor Trainer Director #10

All posts are personal opinions and DO NOT reflect any affiliated agency unless specifically stated.

tecdivertraining

Hi Gabrielle

I have both the classic Inspiration with the 4th cell to a VR3 and an Evo with Trimix Vision personally i do not feel thier is much between them. it is however nice to not have the two big hansets on the classic dangelling below you when you dive.

The VR3 with interface would be my choice if i had a classic and had to
spend two and half grand on the upgrade and we sell the VR3 C4 with interface for 900 GBP, a saving of 1600 is a whole heep of dive sorb and fills

They give about the same benefits except the HUD and personally I m not that keen it kind of bugs me, as I like to take quite alot of photography on my dives. It might be worth waiting to see what people think of the new VPM model available on the VR3 and what schedules this gives as a comparisson before you spend the hard cash .

The vision is very easy to read when diving and no additional calibration of the handset is required unlike when using the VR3 with the 4th cell

If you where buying a brand new unit for sure you would buy the unit with the new electronics.

As our units are in constant use we get problems with both, the VR3 can be temprimental as can the new vision its kind of like the buying a new TV if it works good from the box they tend to work for years but if you are unluky to get a duff unit you will probably be sending back to manufacturer more than once.

just my two pence worth.

__________________
Mathew Partridge
Technical Director
Pro-Tech Dive College
www.protechdivers.com
www.tech-ccr.com

gabrielesub

An 8.000euro TV that will put you in serious troubles if the "tuner" does not work!!!

Just kidding!

Well, thanks to all of you guys for your help!
I already own a VR3 C4 linked to my unit. It works fine....
the deco profile inside the vision software is not the only things I would evaluate before to buy it.
honestly condensation in the lid, HUD quality, software control protocol, downloading data software, and other features are more interesting to me.

I really appreciate your help in telling me your impression.
At the moment my opinio is that only Megalodon can win a race against Vision...
This is also because the pretty important difference in initial cost...

Please tell me if I am making a mistake thinking so.

Thanks again,
safe diving

gabriele

decoweenie

Could you expand on why you think the Meg electronic is better than the Evolution ?

Also which Meg electronic since I believe there are quite a number of different makes floating around ? And, unfortunately, the one I like the most (Shearwater) isn't available any more either...

__________________
"...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..."

- Rebreather World PM

schford

I agree with Phi on this one and I dive a Shearwater Meg....

The vision electronics GUI is superior to the Meg implementation of the Shearwater (although new one is yummy!) and temp stik is a killer app.

There are reasons why a Meg is seen by some as being better than an Insp or Evo but I dont think electronics is one of them.

Stuart

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