I love to Hate O2 cells

tflaris · 19th August 2008, 03:22

Purchased 3 new cells from Fill Express July 4th weekend. A fews dives for them to settle and then I started noticing a drift in the reading just .1 and then .2 or so higher than cell 1 and 3. Next dive cell checker voted out cell 2 it was .3 higher out of sync with the other cells. Next calibration FAILED..................

Does the Vision software display a mv reading on the cells similiar to the Meg?

I have never seen it in the manaul.

Thanks

rewrites · 19th August 2008, 15:27

hi

no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter. Check the connector for cell 2 also just in case any corrosion is causing problems.

I currently have similar problem with a set of new cells, but luckily the errant cell (also cell 2) is short of being voted out and has been stable throughout the last few dives. Unit has calibrated fine.

What date are the cells?

Celia_E · 19th August 2008, 16:43

Tony,

My buddies and I have had multiple issues with cells from DR or Fill Express, not sure if it's a QA issue or what. But they have always made good on them so don't throw them away, call them up and tell them there is a problem.

We just bought 4 more, so cross your fingers....we had three different ones go bad while in Guam and Chuuk, luckily there were spares in the group and we all dived.

Dive safe,

Celia

hchoat · 19th August 2008, 18:12

I recently had a new DR sensor go bad (literally) 24 hours after installing it. I called Dive Rite Express (where I purchased it), and explained what happened. They asked me to send it back to them- which I did with a little note giving the details. They tested the cell and agreed it was bad. Within the week I had a new cell. The whole process took about 10 days.

This is my first go round with the DR cells- so far they seem to be OK. The service from DR Express was (as usual) exemplary.

tflaris · 20th August 2008, 21:01

Quote: (Originally Posted by rewrites)

hi

no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter. Check the connector for cell 2 also just in case any corrosion is causing problems.

I currently have similar problem with a set of new cells, but luckily the errant cell (also cell 2) is short of being voted out and has been stable throughout the last few dives. Unit has calibrated fine.

What date are the cells?

March 2008.

tflaris · 20th August 2008, 21:03

Quote: (Originally Posted by Celia_E)

Tony,

My buddies and I have had multiple issues with cells from DR or Fill Express, not sure if it's a QA issue or what. But they have always made good on them so don't throw them away, call them up and tell them there is a problem.

We just bought 4 more, so cross your fingers....we had three different ones go bad while in Guam and Chuuk, luckily there were spares in the group and we all dived.

Dive safe,

Celia

According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers.

Celia_E · 22nd August 2008, 00:38

Quote: (Originally Posted by tflaris)

According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers.

Interesting, if they are supposed to have passed QA in UK then they should work fine for you. Are they going to make good on them?

Dive safe,

Celia

jkaterenchuk · 22nd August 2008, 01:01

Quote: (Originally Posted by tflaris)

According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers.

You might already know this but the AP approved cells are different then the AI cells. If you look carefully on their website you will also notice that the price is also higher for the AP cells. I have not personally purchased any of the AP cells from DRE but when I have gotten them in the past they were teledyne cells with the BUDDY branding. The AI cells I have purchased from DRE are black.John

wizbang · 22nd August 2008, 07:18

I am 3 out of 5 dead for DRE.
2 out of 2 molex.
1 out of three SMB.

Not happy Jan.

Tino de Rijk · 22nd August 2008, 21:04

Quote: (Originally Posted by rewrites)

hi

no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter.

Hmm..... actually not true. The value shown on the handsets during calibration (this applies to both the Classic as well as the Vision) is the mV value in air, divided by 10. So if you see 0.89, it indicates 8.9 mV, 1.21 means 12.1 mV etc.
The way this is done is that the electronics assume a scale factor of 10 mV during the calibration process. So if it measures, say, 50 mV during the calibration run, and you indicated to use 98% oxygen for your calibration (as you know, you need to enter that value at the start of the calibration), it will display 50/98*21 = 10.7 mV at the end of the calibration run, i.e. when the scrubber head is properly flushed with oxygen.
There is also a compensation for the ambient pressure, but let's keep things simple here: this is the main principle.
The electronics also use this to determine if the cells are in the acceptable range of 7-13.5 mV in air. See paragraph 6.8.2 of the user manual.

This is also a good way to keep track of the decay of the cell output over time. You may want to write down the values of your new cells the first time, inmediately before it says "calibrating", so when it is still showing "flushing", but when the first cell values turn white-on-black (this is only on the Vision), indicating calibration is nearly done. Then you can follow the decay of that mV value over the cell's 12-18 months lifetime.
You see: no multimeter needed; all out of the box!

ciao,

Tino.

19th August 2008, 03:22	#1 (permalink)
tflaris God save the Queen Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Neptune Beach, Florida Posts: 274	I love to Hate O2 cells Purchased 3 new cells from Fill Express July 4th weekend. A fews dives for them to settle and then I started noticing a drift in the reading just .1 and then .2 or so higher than cell 1 and 3. Next dive cell checker voted out cell 2 it was .3 higher out of sync with the other cells. Next calibration FAILED.................. Does the Vision software display a mv reading on the cells similiar to the Meg? I have never seen it in the manaul. Thanks __________________ "Except for this one, I have come to the conclusion that all generalizations are false" -Jim Hayes
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19th August 2008, 15:27	#2 (permalink)
rewrites RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Cornwall, UK Posts: 91	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells hi no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter. Check the connector for cell 2 also just in case any corrosion is causing problems. I currently have similar problem with a set of new cells, but luckily the errant cell (also cell 2) is short of being voted out and has been stable throughout the last few dives. Unit has calibrated fine. What date are the cells? __________________ Always running with scissors ~8~
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19th August 2008, 16:43	#3 (permalink)
Celia_E RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: back from paradise... Posts: 113	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Tony, My buddies and I have had multiple issues with cells from DR or Fill Express, not sure if it's a QA issue or what. But they have always made good on them so don't throw them away, call them up and tell them there is a problem. We just bought 4 more, so cross your fingers....we had three different ones go bad while in Guam and Chuuk, luckily there were spares in the group and we all dived. Dive safe, Celia __________________ "We are now a two Meg family!!!"
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19th August 2008, 18:12	#4 (permalink)
hchoat Resident Selkie Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Pensacola, FL- USA Posts: 227	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells I recently had a new DR sensor go bad (literally) 24 hours after installing it. I called Dive Rite Express (where I purchased it), and explained what happened. They asked me to send it back to them- which I did with a little note giving the details. They tested the cell and agreed it was bad. Within the week I had a new cell. The whole process took about 10 days. This is my first go round with the DR cells- so far they seem to be OK. The service from DR Express was (as usual) exemplary. __________________ Duct tape is like the force... it has a light side and dark side, and it holds the universe together.
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20th August 2008, 21:01	#5 (permalink)
tflaris God save the Queen Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Neptune Beach, Florida Posts: 274	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Quote: (Originally Posted by rewrites) hi no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter. Check the connector for cell 2 also just in case any corrosion is causing problems. I currently have similar problem with a set of new cells, but luckily the errant cell (also cell 2) is short of being voted out and has been stable throughout the last few dives. Unit has calibrated fine. What date are the cells? March 2008. __________________ "Except for this one, I have come to the conclusion that all generalizations are false" -Jim Hayes
(Offline)

20th August 2008, 21:03	#6 (permalink)
tflaris God save the Queen Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Neptune Beach, Florida Posts: 274	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Quote: (Originally Posted by Celia_E) Tony, My buddies and I have had multiple issues with cells from DR or Fill Express, not sure if it's a QA issue or what. But they have always made good on them so don't throw them away, call them up and tell them there is a problem. We just bought 4 more, so cross your fingers....we had three different ones go bad while in Guam and Chuuk, luckily there were spares in the group and we all dived. Dive safe, Celia According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers. __________________ "Except for this one, I have come to the conclusion that all generalizations are false" -Jim Hayes
(Offline)

22nd August 2008, 00:38	#7 (permalink)
Celia_E RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: back from paradise... Posts: 113	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Quote: (Originally Posted by tflaris) According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers. Interesting, if they are supposed to have passed QA in UK then they should work fine for you. Are they going to make good on them? Dive safe, Celia __________________ "We are now a two Meg family!!!"
(Offline)

22nd August 2008, 01:01	#8 (permalink)
jkaterenchuk . Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Megalodon Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2006 Location: Lititz, PA Posts: 1,100	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Quote: (Originally Posted by tflaris) According to Fill Express the AP Valves O2 Sensors are sent to England then tested and the ones that did not fail are sent out to customers/suppliers. You might already know this but the AP approved cells are different then the AI cells. If you look carefully on their website you will also notice that the price is also higher for the AP cells. I have not personally purchased any of the AP cells from DRE but when I have gotten them in the past they were teledyne cells with the BUDDY branding. The AI cells I have purchased from DRE are black.John
(Online)

22nd August 2008, 07:18	#9 (permalink)
wizbang WEB MERMEN Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Vision Evolution Prism Topaz Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Perth Australia Posts: 386	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells I am 3 out of 5 dead for DRE. 2 out of 2 molex. 1 out of three SMB. Not happy Jan.
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22nd August 2008, 21:04	#10 (permalink)
Tino de Rijk Old, maybe one day wise Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 375	Re: I love to Hate O2 cells Quote: (Originally Posted by rewrites) hi no milivoltage readout available on the handset - or on the log download. You'll have to check with a multimeter. Hmm..... actually not true. The value shown on the handsets during calibration (this applies to both the Classic as well as the Vision) is the mV value in air, divided by 10. So if you see 0.89, it indicates 8.9 mV, 1.21 means 12.1 mV etc. The way this is done is that the electronics assume a scale factor of 10 mV during the calibration process. So if it measures, say, 50 mV during the calibration run, and you indicated to use 98% oxygen for your calibration (as you know, you need to enter that value at the start of the calibration), it will display 50/98*21 = 10.7 mV at the end of the calibration run, i.e. when the scrubber head is properly flushed with oxygen. There is also a compensation for the ambient pressure, but let's keep things simple here: this is the main principle. The electronics also use this to determine if the cells are in the acceptable range of 7-13.5 mV in air. See paragraph 6.8.2 of the user manual. This is also a good way to keep track of the decay of the cell output over time. You may want to write down the values of your new cells the first time, inmediately before it says "calibrating", so when it is still showing "flushing", but when the first cell values turn white-on-black (this is only on the Vision), indicating calibration is nearly done. Then you can follow the decay of that mV value over the cell's 12-18 months lifetime. You see: no multimeter needed; all out of the box! ciao, Tino.
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