Inspiration Scrubber Time

ding · 13th March 2008, 22:37

If in doubt chuck it out....It works for me

aainslie · 14th March 2008, 01:04

Convert it to a Vision. Then you can save on the scrubber cost!

sddiverrob · 14th March 2008, 03:37

Quote: (Originally Posted by Timbo)

There is one big unwritten scrubber rule that should be in the manual but it isn't.

"If you cannot afford to change your scrubber material/cells. You should not be diving CCR."

Well Said!

PCDiver · 14th March 2008, 05:55

Like already mentioned, the time is not the problem, but the depth is. The scrubber bed can become too short. Especially if you have to swim hard. I wouldn't even do it in warm waters.

75 meters is a big dive. For me, beyond 55 and I'm on a fresh scrubber. For shallow dives I will rely on my temp stick. I already overbreathed my scrubber while trying to swim into a current with a big camera at 60 meters and I can assure you, a CO2 hit or CO2 retention is scarry.

Ben Field · 14th March 2008, 09:56

Quote: (Originally Posted by adrenalin_junkie)

Hi All, Question: you have fresh scrubber fill in your Inspiration Classic and plan to do a dive to 75m with total dive time of 90min (you complete this dive to plan)and then two days later are planning to do the same dive plan again. Would you use the same fill again or use a fresh fill. It’s not about being tight, just wondering what others are do.

I really really don't want to sound rude, please don't be offended by this question- To be considering the above set of dives you'll have done Mod1 and 2, maybe 3, you've been diving CCR for 3years.... and you need to ask this question?

The manuals for almost all the rebreathers repeat throughout them the scrubber limits, and almost always preface them with- "if the first dive is deep, bin it and start again"

Much like the thread on people pouring and repacking part used scrubbers this kind of thing staggers me.... sorry but it does. In other threads people are discussing programming and deep design issues for units to avoid highly improbably and unlikely failures to be ultra safe and at the same time other people want to take the basic scrubber rules well beyond the brink.

This feels like a F1 driver asking which pedal is the brake.

Sorry Adrenalin-Junkie, no offence to you, perhaps I've misunderstood but...

Tino de Rijk · 14th March 2008, 10:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by paulraymaekers)

in warm water, there would probably be less a problem

paul

Sorry, Paul, but still not very scientific. "Less of a problem" in my book is still a problem. How warm is warm? Is it equally warm at the surface and on depth? How less is less? Do we account for unexpected hard work (current, having to assist a buddy with problems, detach an anchor...)?

Why take the risk? If you value your life less than 12 euro, buy a gun as a bullit is cheaper.

I'm quite fanatic on this subject, as I've seen all too many accidents and near-accidents due to Hypercapnia in my 10 years CCR'ing.
Personally I am convinced hypercapnia is most likely THE biggest killer of all H's, followed by hypoxia.
Both self-diagnosing it and solving it is hugely underestimated. Reports of that abound.

Something like a TempStik helps a bit in assessing, but even that is not perfect. Why risk it?

ciao,

Tino.

paulraymaekers · 14th March 2008, 12:29

Quote: (Originally Posted by Tino de Rijk)

Sorry, Paul, but still not very scientific. "Less of a problem" in my book is still a problem. How warm is warm? Is it equally warm at the surface and on depth? How less is less? Do we account for unexpected hard work (current, having to assist a buddy with problems, detach an anchor...)?

Why take the risk? If you value your life less than 12 euro, buy a gun as a bullit is cheaper.

I'm quite fanatic on this subject, as I've seen all too many accidents and near-accidents due to Hypercapnia in my 10 years CCR'ing.
Personally I am convinced hypercapnia is most likely THE biggest killer of all H's, followed by hypoxia.
Both self-diagnosing it and solving it is hugely underestimated. Reports of that abound.

Something like a TempStik helps a bit in assessing, but even that is not perfect. Why risk it?

ciao,

Tino.

Hello Tino, perhaps I 'misphrased' it a bit:

this 'less of a problem' was ment 'statistically': meaning in cold water you can have easely break trough in the mentioned conditions, in warm water (red sea :-) you will PROBABLY have less chance to have a problem

(I wrote probably in my first mail, so the probability of having a CO2 problem will be less in warm water)

so to make it clear: my advise is anyway to put fresh sorb in the unit!!

paul

adrenalin_junkie · 14th March 2008, 12:32

I was taught to use a fresh scrubber fill on all dives below 50m and that’s what I have been doing. Just thought I’d see if other CCR dives are sticking to the “rules”

As usual a some feel the need to be insulting in their response, rather then just being objective

As it happens........ I'm loadeddddddddddddddd

Ben Field · 14th March 2008, 13:09

Quote: (Originally Posted by adrenalin_junkie)

I was taught to use a fresh scrubber fill on all dives below 50m and that’s what I have been doing. Just thought I’d see if other CCR dives are sticking to the “rules”

As usual a some feel the need to be insulting in their response, rather then just being objective

As it happens........ I'm loadeddddddddddddddd

Trolling and bragging in one post- neat.

CharlieT · 14th March 2008, 13:41

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field)

Trolling and bragging in one post- neat.

Are you the same guy who's just posted a similar question on the Inspo list?

If not, do you read the Inspo list email traffic?

If no to either of the above, how about the clear advice set out in the Inspiration manual?

No sensible rebreather diver is going to encourage anyone else to push a scrubber whatever they might do themselves from time to time.

Always play it safe with sofnolime as others have advised. If in doubt, chuck it out. Is that simple enough for you?

I am sorry but I'm with Ben Field on this one

Charliet

13th March 2008, 22:37	#11 (permalink)
ding New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2006 Location: Glasgow Posts: 55	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time If in doubt chuck it out....It works for me __________________ Finstrokes
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14th March 2008, 01:04	#12 (permalink)
aainslie Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: LA Posts: 117	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Convert it to a Vision. Then you can save on the scrubber cost! __________________ Andrew Ainslie
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14th March 2008, 03:37	#13 (permalink)
sddiverrob New Member Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic rEvo Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: San Diego Posts: 79	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by Timbo) There is one big unwritten scrubber rule that should be in the manual but it isn't. "If you cannot afford to change your scrubber material/cells. You should not be diving CCR." Well Said! __________________ "Tech divers are the same all over the world..."
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14th March 2008, 05:55	#14 (permalink)
PCDiver Submerge Productions Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 934	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Like already mentioned, the time is not the problem, but the depth is. The scrubber bed can become too short. Especially if you have to swim hard. I wouldn't even do it in warm waters. 75 meters is a big dive. For me, beyond 55 and I'm on a fresh scrubber. For shallow dives I will rely on my temp stick. I already overbreathed my scrubber while trying to swim into a current with a big camera at 60 meters and I can assure you, a CO2 hit or CO2 retention is scarry. __________________ >>>>> www.submergeproductions.com dedicated to promoting technical diving >>>>> Check out our dive show video interviews at http://www.submergeproductions.com/A...nterviews.aspx >>>>> Wreck dive videos http://www.submergeproductions.com/A...omthedeep.aspx
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14th March 2008, 09:56	#15 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,559	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by adrenalin_junkie) Hi All, Question: you have fresh scrubber fill in your Inspiration Classic and plan to do a dive to 75m with total dive time of 90min (you complete this dive to plan)and then two days later are planning to do the same dive plan again. Would you use the same fill again or use a fresh fill. It’s not about being tight, just wondering what others are do. I really really don't want to sound rude, please don't be offended by this question- To be considering the above set of dives you'll have done Mod1 and 2, maybe 3, you've been diving CCR for 3years.... and you need to ask this question? The manuals for almost all the rebreathers repeat throughout them the scrubber limits, and almost always preface them with- "if the first dive is deep, bin it and start again" Much like the thread on people pouring and repacking part used scrubbers this kind of thing staggers me.... sorry but it does. In other threads people are discussing programming and deep design issues for units to avoid highly improbably and unlikely failures to be ultra safe and at the same time other people want to take the basic scrubber rules well beyond the brink. This feels like a F1 driver asking which pedal is the brake. Sorry Adrenalin-Junkie, no offence to you, perhaps I've misunderstood but... __________________ www.hugsac.org.uk Beware Fridge Suck
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14th March 2008, 10:47	#16 (permalink)
Tino de Rijk Old, maybe one day wise Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 319	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by paulraymaekers) in warm water, there would probably be less a problem paul Sorry, Paul, but still not very scientific. "Less of a problem" in my book is still a problem. How warm is warm? Is it equally warm at the surface and on depth? How less is less? Do we account for unexpected hard work (current, having to assist a buddy with problems, detach an anchor...)? Why take the risk? If you value your life less than 12 euro, buy a gun as a bullit is cheaper. I'm quite fanatic on this subject, as I've seen all too many accidents and near-accidents due to Hypercapnia in my 10 years CCR'ing. Personally I am convinced hypercapnia is most likely THE biggest killer of all H's, followed by hypoxia. Both self-diagnosing it and solving it is hugely underestimated. Reports of that abound. Something like a TempStik helps a bit in assessing, but even that is not perfect. Why risk it? ciao, Tino.
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14th March 2008, 12:29	#17 (permalink)
paulraymaekers rEvo's daddy Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: belgium Posts: 1,432	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by Tino de Rijk) Sorry, Paul, but still not very scientific. "Less of a problem" in my book is still a problem. How warm is warm? Is it equally warm at the surface and on depth? How less is less? Do we account for unexpected hard work (current, having to assist a buddy with problems, detach an anchor...)? Why take the risk? If you value your life less than 12 euro, buy a gun as a bullit is cheaper. I'm quite fanatic on this subject, as I've seen all too many accidents and near-accidents due to Hypercapnia in my 10 years CCR'ing. Personally I am convinced hypercapnia is most likely THE biggest killer of all H's, followed by hypoxia. Both self-diagnosing it and solving it is hugely underestimated. Reports of that abound. Something like a TempStik helps a bit in assessing, but even that is not perfect. Why risk it? ciao, Tino. Hello Tino, perhaps I 'misphrased' it a bit: this 'less of a problem' was ment 'statistically': meaning in cold water you can have easely break trough in the mentioned conditions, in warm water (red sea :-) you will PROBABLY have less chance to have a problem (I wrote probably in my first mail, so the probability of having a CO2 problem will be less in warm water) so to make it clear: my advise is anyway to put fresh sorb in the unit!! paul __________________ www.rEvo-rebreathers.com .... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials...
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14th March 2008, 12:32	#18 (permalink)
adrenalin_junkie Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: BIRMINGHAM ENGLAND Posts: 108	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time I was taught to use a fresh scrubber fill on all dives below 50m and that’s what I have been doing. Just thought I’d see if other CCR dives are sticking to the “rules” As usual a some feel the need to be insulting in their response, rather then just being objective As it happens........ I'm loadeddddddddddddddd
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14th March 2008, 13:09	#19 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,559	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by adrenalin_junkie) I was taught to use a fresh scrubber fill on all dives below 50m and that’s what I have been doing. Just thought I’d see if other CCR dives are sticking to the “rules” As usual a some feel the need to be insulting in their response, rather then just being objective As it happens........ I'm loadeddddddddddddddd Trolling and bragging in one post- neat. __________________ www.hugsac.org.uk Beware Fridge Suck
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14th March 2008, 13:41	#20 (permalink)
CharlieT Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: London Posts: 449	Re: Inspiration Scrubber Time Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field) Trolling and bragging in one post- neat. Are you the same guy who's just posted a similar question on the Inspo list? If not, do you read the Inspo list email traffic? If no to either of the above, how about the clear advice set out in the Inspiration manual? No sensible rebreather diver is going to encourage anyone else to push a scrubber whatever they might do themselves from time to time. Always play it safe with sofnolime as others have advised. If in doubt, chuck it out. Is that simple enough for you? I am sorry but I'm with Ben Field on this one Charliet
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