Bad Timekeeping!

***Beanie*** · 2nd November 2005, 15:00

Quote: (Originally Posted by simon varley)

did anyone who went to the show get an update on this? Latest timing for v31?

This week according to Tony.

UKSteve · 2nd November 2005, 15:50

I asked Nicky about it ...she said it was still in testing but release is imminent...

***Louby Lou*** · 28th December 2005, 18:13

Sorry to bump this folks but with the nightmare goings-on with my head and scrubber today and only 4 weeks till my Red Sea trip... has anyone heard anything from AP on the timing issue... or is it more of a case of when

Cheers

Westwinds · 28th December 2005, 22:31

You will have to excuse my ignorance on this topic but what are the advantages to using the nitrox setting (nitrox diluent)?

I certainly understand that when diluent is added to the loop for volume upon decent that the nitrox would be adding more oxygen to the loop but is there more to it? Am I too nieve, too new?

Could you not dive air diluent and let the Rebreather add the additional O2 to the mix? This would eliminate the need to run the computer in Nitrox mode, thus removing the timing issue from your trip? (at least until a fix is released)

** Perhaps this is a break away conversation **

Westwinds.

***jradomski*** · 28th December 2005, 23:04

Quote: (Originally Posted by Westwinds)

You will have to excuse my ignorance on this topic but what are the advantages to using the nitrox setting (nitrox diluent)?

I certainly understand that when diluent is added to the loop for volume upon decent that the nitrox would be adding more oxygen to the loop but is there more to it? Am I too nieve, too new?

Could you not dive air diluent and let the Rebreather add the additional O2 to the mix? This would eliminate the need to run the computer in Nitrox mode, thus removing the timing issue from your trip? (at least until a fix is released)

** Perhaps this is a break away conversation **

Westwinds.

The "nitrox" version has nothing to do with setting the diluent to anything other than Air... Its just that the unit is only capable of working with N2 based mixtures..

Westwinds · 28th December 2005, 23:17

Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski)

The "nitrox" version has nothing to do with setting the diluent to anything other than Air... Its just that the unit is only capable of working with N2 based mixtures..

Thanks for the reply. Quick follow-up:

What's the difference between the nitrox setting and the regular setting? Why would someone spend the extra money to buy the nitrox software?

Westwinds.

wizbang · 28th December 2005, 23:28

Hi Westwinds, the "nitrox" setting is the regular setting.
air + O2 = Nitrox
The other setting is the Mod1 or Mod2 to get the release key for Helium.
Trimix, Heliox etc.

There doesn't seem to be any problem with the Vision electronics with the Helium setting.

Hope that helps Wiz

***EBT*** · 28th December 2005, 23:29

Nitrox IS the regular setting. Trimix is the enhanced version.

All this info can be read on the AP website

Westwinds · 28th December 2005, 23:45

Yes. I understand the concept of nitrox (O2 and Nitrogen). I've been diving for many years and have many courses under my belt.

Bear with me. It might take me a little longer to get where we are going.

My evolution came fully loaded, the computer was pre-loaded with the nitrox and trimix deco software. So this might be where some of the confusion is for me.

The Silent Diving catalog lists a Nitrox deco software upgrade for $300 US and a Trimix deco software upgrade for additional $300 USD.

What I was trying to ask is what would I have if I didn't purchase the nitrox or trimix deco software. The answer was found on the AP website (Thanks EBT). Iis a simple dive timer (what I incorrectly referring to before as 'regular')

> Deco Options - Deco options are easily changed to convert the unit from a Dive Timer to Nitrox, to Trimix decompression models.

Problem solved, Thank you.

Westwinds.

Genesis · 29th December 2005, 00:01

That sort of error is VERY scary.

As a guy who writes code for a living and has for close to three decades, this sort of "error" generally means one of the following is happening:

An internal storage location is being scribbled on by some piece of code.
An interrupt is being left disabled when it shouldn't be, and thus internal timer "ticks" are being missed entirely by the software.

Both of these are very, very bad news as they would be expected to impact any other computations made using those time values, and in case (1) if that's being scribbled on the obvious next question is "what ELSE might be scribbled on?"

I would NOT dive a unit showing this sort of fault until it is corrected, as if the fault is #1 above there is absolutely no way to be certain that the PO2 settings or readings, or O2 injection parameters are also not being scrambled internally.

If the problem is due to missing ticks you could also have bad injection timing, as that same timebase is almost certainly involved in that process as well.

Simply put, you cannot have any assurance that this problem is limited to internal timekeeping!

2nd November 2005, 15:00	#61 (permalink)
*Beanie* Gallery Administrator Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: In da house! yeah baby! Posts: 3,312	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Quote: (Originally Posted by simon varley) did anyone who went to the show get an update on this? Latest timing for v31? This week according to Tony. __________________ Beanie Gallery Admin & Library Assistant. www.outlawdivers.org.uk www.beandiving.co.uk www.beanengineering.co.uk
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2nd November 2005, 15:50	#62 (permalink)
UKSteve Steve Collard Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Weymouth, UK Posts: 601	Re: Bad Timekeeping! I asked Nicky about it ...she said it was still in testing but release is imminent...
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28th December 2005, 18:13	#63 (permalink)
*Louby Lou* XLVI WC! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Roman Corinium! Posts: 1,049	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Sorry to bump this folks but with the nightmare goings-on with my head and scrubber today and only 4 weeks till my Red Sea trip... has anyone heard anything from AP on the timing issue... or is it more of a case of when Cheers __________________ Miss Lou x Use of RBW is subject to the Rebreatherworld Terms and Conditions - Please read! Outlaw Divers - Sssh we're diving! You heff vays uff dealink vis zem, oh Miss RBW Admin! - Rob Davie Feb 06
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28th December 2005, 22:31	#64 (permalink)
Westwinds Supporting Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 89	Re: Bad Timekeeping! You will have to excuse my ignorance on this topic but what are the advantages to using the nitrox setting (nitrox diluent)? I certainly understand that when diluent is added to the loop for volume upon decent that the nitrox would be adding more oxygen to the loop but is there more to it? Am I too nieve, too new? Could you not dive air diluent and let the Rebreather add the additional O2 to the mix? This would eliminate the need to run the computer in Nitrox mode, thus removing the timing issue from your trip? (at least until a fix is released) Perhaps this is a break away conversation Westwinds. __________________ Located in Canada
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28th December 2005, 23:04	#65 (permalink)
*jradomski* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Optima rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: "Da" Bronx Posts: 3,115	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Quote: (Originally Posted by Westwinds) You will have to excuse my ignorance on this topic but what are the advantages to using the nitrox setting (nitrox diluent)? I certainly understand that when diluent is added to the loop for volume upon decent that the nitrox would be adding more oxygen to the loop but is there more to it? Am I too nieve, too new? Could you not dive air diluent and let the Rebreather add the additional O2 to the mix? This would eliminate the need to run the computer in Nitrox mode, thus removing the timing issue from your trip? (at least until a fix is released) Perhaps this is a break away conversation Westwinds. The "nitrox" version has nothing to do with setting the diluent to anything other than Air... Its just that the unit is only capable of working with N2 based mixtures.. __________________ Joe Radomski CCR Trimix Instructor Trainer ANDI Instructor Trainer Director #10 All posts are personal opinions and DO NOT reflect any affiliated agency unless specifically stated.
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28th December 2005, 23:17	#66 (permalink)
Westwinds Supporting Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 89	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski) The "nitrox" version has nothing to do with setting the diluent to anything other than Air... Its just that the unit is only capable of working with N2 based mixtures.. Thanks for the reply. Quick follow-up: What's the difference between the nitrox setting and the regular setting? Why would someone spend the extra money to buy the nitrox software? Westwinds. __________________ Located in Canada
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28th December 2005, 23:28	#67 (permalink)
wizbang WEB MERMEN Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Vision Evolution Prism Topaz Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Perth Australia Posts: 386	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Hi Westwinds, the "nitrox" setting is the regular setting. air + O2 = Nitrox The other setting is the Mod1 or Mod2 to get the release key for Helium. Trimix, Heliox etc. There doesn't seem to be any problem with the Vision electronics with the Helium setting. Hope that helps Wiz
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28th December 2005, 23:29	#68 (permalink)
*EBT* Apprentice Luddite Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK, Brighton Posts: 2,115	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Nitrox IS the regular setting. Trimix is the enhanced version. All this info can be read on the AP website __________________ Eagles May Soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! RBW Terms of service
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28th December 2005, 23:45	#69 (permalink)
Westwinds Supporting Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 89	Re: Bad Timekeeping! Yes. I understand the concept of nitrox (O2 and Nitrogen). I've been diving for many years and have many courses under my belt. Bear with me. It might take me a little longer to get where we are going. My evolution came fully loaded, the computer was pre-loaded with the nitrox and trimix deco software. So this might be where some of the confusion is for me. The Silent Diving catalog lists a Nitrox deco software upgrade for $300 US and a Trimix deco software upgrade for additional $300 USD. What I was trying to ask is what would I have if I didn't purchase the nitrox or trimix deco software. The answer was found on the AP website (Thanks EBT). Iis a simple dive timer (what I incorrectly referring to before as 'regular') > Deco Options - Deco options are easily changed to convert the unit from a Dive Timer to Nitrox, to Trimix decompression models. Problem solved, Thank you. Westwinds. __________________ Located in Canada
(Offline)

29th December 2005, 00:01	#70 (permalink)
Genesis Bubbless Box of Death Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Sunny Florida Posts: 1,453	Re: Bad Timekeeping! That sort of error is VERY scary. As a guy who writes code for a living and has for close to three decades, this sort of "error" generally means one of the following is happening: An internal storage location is being scribbled on by some piece of code. An interrupt is being left disabled when it shouldn't be, and thus internal timer "ticks" are being missed entirely by the software. Both of these are very, very bad news as they would be expected to impact any other computations made using those time values, and in case (1) if that's being scribbled on the obvious next question is "what ELSE might be scribbled on?" I would NOT dive a unit showing this sort of fault until it is corrected, as if the fault is #1 above there is absolutely no way to be certain that the PO2 settings or readings, or O2 injection parameters are also not being scrambled internally. If the problem is due to missing ticks you could also have bad injection timing, as that same timebase is almost certainly involved in that process as well. Simply put, you cannot have any assurance that this problem is limited to internal timekeeping!
(Offline)

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