RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV

DanDunfee · 27th May 2007, 04:03

For several months I've tried to find and buy ,vs make, a DSV that can conveniently be integrated into the heavily modded RGU rig that I"m working up. I found the big-bore hoses & DSVs (eg Dolphin) much bulkier than I want for my little close-coupled chest-pack, at least during this phase of the project. I considered the IDA family of DSVs, but could find none that were within this projects budget, and heard many complaints on their low gas throughput and added WOB..and weight. I finally found one by going back to a website that I had visited several times, several months ago. The site is www.nva-militaria.de Its the old East German NVA Militaria site, run by Martin Klokosch. No one there speaks /writes english. They use Babelfish to translate e-mails, so communications are a bit slow for us one-language folks. but they try to be responsive. They have lots of RGU kits and individual parts (and a substantial inventory of Draeger parts). The customized RGU DSV / mouthpiece assy must be a new product for them. They've advertized it some on EBay. It sells for less than 100 USD + S&H. I just got the DSV, and haven't leak tested or torn it down yet, so comments here are first preliminary observations.

The DSV is made by taking a stock RGU mouthpiece shell and inserting a custom spool directly into the shell, with machining for the lever & vents. As normally delivered, the DSV assy consists only of the shell, DSV spool and lever, and a new mouthpiece...... no non-return valves or hose end fittings. They obviously assume that you already have these... but they're probably available at added cost. When assembled into my loop, it fits and works quite well. The new, smaller, mouthpiece is comfortable for me . Couch breathing tests indicate that , surprisingly, it doesn't add perceptibly to the loop WOB.

I've not torn it down yet, but it appears to have one potentially disconcerting feature..no apparent o-ring or gasket sealing of the spool. The new spool is made of POM Polyascetal, same as Draeger uses for mouthpeices / DSVs. They've apparently extended the european philosophy of metal-on-metal sealing, to plastic-on-plastic. The spool appears to be split longitudinally thru the breathing slot, so that it spring-loads itself radially against the stock housing and forms a surface-contact seal when rotated to the shut-off 'surface' position. An innovative approach.... it'll be interesting to see how well it stands up to use... or not. With its MolyKote 111 lubrication, the spool rotates without undue force needed.

The custom RGU DSV will serve my purposes well, at least during the next phase of my little program. I'll report on how it performs in repetitive / extended service later on.

Given the difficulties I had getting a DSV to fill my immediate wants / needs, I thought there might be other RGU divers who might find it interesting, maybe worthwhile. Also it might be worthwhile to IDA divers who are using the smaller-bore stock hoses, but don't like the heavy brass IDA DSVs with their reportedly small gas breathing port to the mouthpiece, low gas throughput, and higher WOB.

More later

Dan

Yankee Rebel · 27th May 2007, 05:17

hi Dan!

great post/info!!
thankyou for taking the time to post this. im glad to see that Martin has a website back up. his old site disappeared before i had a chance to order some parts i was needing. that project got backshelved until i could locate some RGU regs. im still on the hunt for regs and cylinders stateside too... now ill have to send him an email and see if he has any seperate forsale.

the DSV mod im glad to hear works well, i had wondered about that when id seen it listed on ebay. looks good, and cheaper than the new RAY manifold, hoses, dsv setup. it gets rid of the one major complaint about the RG-UF/M i have.. besides the original mouthpeice is so large that some are prone to suffer a gag reflex.

excellent info!! thanks again!

ETA:
is the internal spool nylon? i saw a simular design used on a homebuilt DSV once, but i could never find the webpage afterwards.
the person took a common PVC plumbing T with a reducing leg on it, and used the same spool design to make it watertight and turn it into a DSV. it reportedly worked well iirc, but ive no idea how well itd work longterm.

how much force is excerted on the RGU DSV/housing by the internal spool? is it much? the RGU mouthpeice is somewhat thin from waht i remember wich is why i ask.

Tom Rose · 27th May 2007, 11:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

The site is www.nva-militaria.de Its the old East German NVA Militaria site, run by Martin Klokosch.
Dan

Great find Dan,

I was very frustrated when the site went down some time ago....I purchased a number of items from Martin and was well pleased with the way they did business.

If you are planning to put together an order, give me a call and we can combine if you so desire.

Tom

**Dave Sutton** · 27th May 2007, 12:11

Good stuff.

The plastic on plastic seal is right out of the Draeger playbook. I wouldn't worry about that at all.

Dave

DanDunfee · 27th May 2007, 12:29

After midnite last nite, groggy from a difficult day, I mistakenly wrote the old NVA Mil web address into the first msg. . It still exists, but the better address to get directly to the new commercial site is www.nva-militaria.de.

BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-)

More later.....Cheers

Dan

DanDunfee · 27th May 2007, 12:37

I've tried several times to edit / correct, and when I type in the Medi-Leipzig URL, the 'system' automatically changes it to the old NVA-Militaria address.
I'll try once more......www.nva-militaria.de..... Nope, it switched the URL address again.

Dan

undrh2o · 27th May 2007, 13:30

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

I've tried several times to edit / correct, and when I type in the Medi-Leipzig URL, the 'system' automatically changes it to the old NVA-Militaria address.
I'll try once more......www.nva-militaria.de..... Nope, it switched the URL address again.

Dan

If you look under misc options in the post editing screen the is an option to parse HTML links and use the page title instead of the URL - it's on by default and they are using their old URL as the page title. The right URL is http://www.medi-leipzig.de/

Tom Rose · 27th May 2007, 17:24

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-)

More later.....Cheers

Dan

Dan you gotta take better care of yourself...Thats a hell of a fall. Get better soon.

Tom

Tom Rose · 27th May 2007, 19:17

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-)

More later.....Cheers

Dan

Dan you gotta take better care of yourself...Thats a hell of a fall. Get better soon.

Tom

Barrie Law · 27th May 2007, 23:20

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

After midnite last nite, groggy from a difficult day, I mistakenly wrote the old NVA Mil web address into the first msg. . It still exists, but the better address to get directly to the new commercial site is www.nva-militaria.de.

BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-)

More later.....Cheers

Dan

Hi Dan,

Sorry to hear about your fall it sounds quite serious but at least you can laugh about it.

If it had been any worse you would need some medical treatment..

Get well soon.

Regards

27th May 2007, 04:03	#1 (permalink)
DanDunfee Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 204	RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV For several months I've tried to find and buy ,vs make, a DSV that can conveniently be integrated into the heavily modded RGU rig that I"m working up. I found the big-bore hoses & DSVs (eg Dolphin) much bulkier than I want for my little close-coupled chest-pack, at least during this phase of the project. I considered the IDA family of DSVs, but could find none that were within this projects budget, and heard many complaints on their low gas throughput and added WOB..and weight. I finally found one by going back to a website that I had visited several times, several months ago. The site is www.nva-militaria.de Its the old East German NVA Militaria site, run by Martin Klokosch. No one there speaks /writes english. They use Babelfish to translate e-mails, so communications are a bit slow for us one-language folks. but they try to be responsive. They have lots of RGU kits and individual parts (and a substantial inventory of Draeger parts). The customized RGU DSV / mouthpiece assy must be a new product for them. They've advertized it some on EBay. It sells for less than 100 USD + S&H. I just got the DSV, and haven't leak tested or torn it down yet, so comments here are first preliminary observations. The DSV is made by taking a stock RGU mouthpiece shell and inserting a custom spool directly into the shell, with machining for the lever & vents. As normally delivered, the DSV assy consists only of the shell, DSV spool and lever, and a new mouthpiece...... no non-return valves or hose end fittings. They obviously assume that you already have these... but they're probably available at added cost. When assembled into my loop, it fits and works quite well. The new, smaller, mouthpiece is comfortable for me . Couch breathing tests indicate that , surprisingly, it doesn't add perceptibly to the loop WOB. I've not torn it down yet, but it appears to have one potentially disconcerting feature..no apparent o-ring or gasket sealing of the spool. The new spool is made of POM Polyascetal, same as Draeger uses for mouthpeices / DSVs. They've apparently extended the european philosophy of metal-on-metal sealing, to plastic-on-plastic. The spool appears to be split longitudinally thru the breathing slot, so that it spring-loads itself radially against the stock housing and forms a surface-contact seal when rotated to the shut-off 'surface' position. An innovative approach.... it'll be interesting to see how well it stands up to use... or not. With its MolyKote 111 lubrication, the spool rotates without undue force needed. The custom RGU DSV will serve my purposes well, at least during the next phase of my little program. I'll report on how it performs in repetitive / extended service later on. Given the difficulties I had getting a DSV to fill my immediate wants / needs, I thought there might be other RGU divers who might find it interesting, maybe worthwhile. Also it might be worthwhile to IDA divers who are using the smaller-bore stock hoses, but don't like the heavy brass IDA DSVs with their reportedly small gas breathing port to the mouthpiece, low gas throughput, and higher WOB. More later Dan __________________ There are 'Bold' divers and old divers, but NO old, ' Bold ' divers Last edited by DanDunfee : 30th May 2007 at 13:51.
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27th May 2007, 05:17	#2 (permalink)
Yankee Rebel Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: California Posts: 147	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV hi Dan! great post/info!! thankyou for taking the time to post this. im glad to see that Martin has a website back up. his old site disappeared before i had a chance to order some parts i was needing. that project got backshelved until i could locate some RGU regs. im still on the hunt for regs and cylinders stateside too... now ill have to send him an email and see if he has any seperate forsale. the DSV mod im glad to hear works well, i had wondered about that when id seen it listed on ebay. looks good, and cheaper than the new RAY manifold, hoses, dsv setup. it gets rid of the one major complaint about the RG-UF/M i have.. besides the original mouthpeice is so large that some are prone to suffer a gag reflex. excellent info!! thanks again! ETA: is the internal spool nylon? i saw a simular design used on a homebuilt DSV once, but i could never find the webpage afterwards. the person took a common PVC plumbing T with a reducing leg on it, and used the same spool design to make it watertight and turn it into a DSV. it reportedly worked well iirc, but ive no idea how well itd work longterm. how much force is excerted on the RGU DSV/housing by the internal spool? is it much? the RGU mouthpeice is somewhat thin from waht i remember wich is why i ask. Last edited by Yankee Rebel : 27th May 2007 at 05:22.
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27th May 2007, 11:47	#3 (permalink)
Tom Rose Still Learning Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: USA,North Carolina Posts: 328	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) The site is www.nva-militaria.de Its the old East German NVA Militaria site, run by Martin Klokosch. Dan Great find Dan, I was very frustrated when the site went down some time ago....I purchased a number of items from Martin and was well pleased with the way they did business. If you are planning to put together an order, give me a call and we can combine if you so desire. Tom __________________ The 50-50-90 rule: Anytime I have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there's a 90% probability I'll get it wrong the first time. www.atlimp.com
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27th May 2007, 12:11	#4 (permalink)
Dave Sutton Diveshop of Horrors Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Narragansett, Rhode Island and Hackettstown, New Jersey Posts: 2,672	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Good stuff. The plastic on plastic seal is right out of the Draeger playbook. I wouldn't worry about that at all. Dave __________________ "Changes in Lattitudes, Changes in Attitudes, Nothing remains quite the same".... www.nobubblediving.com
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27th May 2007, 12:29	#5 (permalink)
DanDunfee Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 204	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV After midnite last nite, groggy from a difficult day, I mistakenly wrote the old NVA Mil web address into the first msg. . It still exists, but the better address to get directly to the new commercial site is www.nva-militaria.de. BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-) More later.....Cheers Dan __________________ There are 'Bold' divers and old divers, but NO old, ' Bold ' divers Last edited by DanDunfee : 27th May 2007 at 12:33.
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27th May 2007, 12:37	#6 (permalink)
DanDunfee Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 204	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV I've tried several times to edit / correct, and when I type in the Medi-Leipzig URL, the 'system' automatically changes it to the old NVA-Militaria address. I'll try once more......www.nva-militaria.de..... Nope, it switched the URL address again. Dan __________________ There are 'Bold' divers and old divers, but NO old, ' Bold ' divers Last edited by DanDunfee : 27th May 2007 at 13:18.
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27th May 2007, 13:30	#7 (permalink)
undrh2o Chris Miller Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 199	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) I've tried several times to edit / correct, and when I type in the Medi-Leipzig URL, the 'system' automatically changes it to the old NVA-Militaria address. I'll try once more......www.nva-militaria.de..... Nope, it switched the URL address again. Dan If you look under misc options in the post editing screen the is an option to parse HTML links and use the page title instead of the URL - it's on by default and they are using their old URL as the page title. The right URL is http://www.medi-leipzig.de/
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27th May 2007, 17:24	#8 (permalink)
Tom Rose Still Learning Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: USA,North Carolina Posts: 328	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-) More later.....Cheers Dan Dan you gotta take better care of yourself...Thats a hell of a fall. Get better soon. Tom __________________ The 50-50-90 rule: Anytime I have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there's a 90% probability I'll get it wrong the first time. www.atlimp.com
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27th May 2007, 19:17	#9 (permalink)
Tom Rose Still Learning Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: USA,North Carolina Posts: 328	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-) More later.....Cheers Dan Dan you gotta take better care of yourself...Thats a hell of a fall. Get better soon. Tom __________________ The 50-50-90 rule: Anytime I have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there's a 90% probability I'll get it wrong the first time. www.atlimp.com
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27th May 2007, 23:20	#10 (permalink)
Barrie Law RebreatherWorld Sponsor Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Ireland Posts: 459	Re: RG-UF/M Custom Commercial DSV Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) After midnite last nite, groggy from a difficult day, I mistakenly wrote the old NVA Mil web address into the first msg. . It still exists, but the better address to get directly to the new commercial site is www.nva-militaria.de. BTW Tom: I've had a little mishap that will 'ground me' for a while. Did a 1 1/2 Forward Summersault down a flight of 12 stairs. If had been in board diving competition, would have scored at least 9.5 Broke 3 ribs, cracked a few more, partially deflated a lung, and am collecting some fluids in it. Crashed a knee.....don't really know how much damage to the knee yet. Lots of hurting, but no serious damage so far....thankfully...sure could have been a lot worse. It's all relative yaknow ;-) More later.....Cheers Dan Hi Dan, Sorry to hear about your fall it sounds quite serious but at least you can laugh about it. If it had been any worse you would need some medical treatment.. Get well soon. Regards __________________ Barrie Law Rebreather World Store Supplying the Rebreather World Tel:US +19548403892 Fax:US+19543333792 Tel:EU+442071930496 Fax:EU+442077606344 Mobile+353876880628 Skype:barrielaw Email: barrie@rebreatherworldstore.com
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