Duncan's New Add System

Dave Crampton · 7th June 2007, 16:11

[quote=Duncan Price;119187]

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

The current unit only has one CL (inhale side). Dual CL's too complex.

Excuse my newby ignorance Duncan but does having only one CL mean a higher risk in CO2 rtn? Or do you manage this with carefull minloop volume?

Cheers in advance.

Dave C

EDIT: Of course not, one way valves on the hoses.... Dhoop...

Duncan Price · 7th June 2007, 17:01

[quote=Dave Crampton;119191]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Duncan Price)

Excuse my newby ignorance Duncan but does having only one CL mean a higher risk in CO2 rtn? Or do you manage this with carefull minloop volume?

Cheers in advance.

Dave C

EDIT: Of course not, one way valves on the hoses.... Dhoop...

The loop volume is pretty minimal and the scrubber overspecified.

Tom Rose · 7th June 2007, 18:38

Quote: (Originally Posted by Duncan Price)

Two? I could do with a couple of shrouded push button covers as well. We have buckets full of Swagelok ones here but they have tilt levers.

No problem, PM me your address and how you want them sent. I will put a bill to include shipping in the box with them. My shipping to here was 3 dollars and you get them for my cost in US dollars.

Tom

Style · 7th June 2007, 19:42

Hi, been loking at some differant systems for O2 and diluent addition to my upcoming project. The system discussed in this thread lokks very godd but also quite large if you compare to for an example the KISS injection. But on the samt time I guess it would be quite cheaper.

So any one have an differant design that isnt so expansive(student economy + rebreather = not good) but still is very small and have an constand O2 flow?

undrh2o · 7th June 2007, 20:49

Quote: (Originally Posted by Style)

Hi, been loking at some differant systems for O2 and diluent addition to my upcoming project. The system discussed in this thread lokks very godd but also quite large if you compare to for an example the KISS injection. But on the samt time I guess it would be quite cheaper.

So any one have an differant design that isnt so expansive(student economy + rebreather = not good) but still is very small and have an constand O2 flow?

Most of these system put the constant flow and manual add together like the original KISS and hyrogom. You can reduce the size by separating the two functions and using two low pressure ports on the O2 first stage then combining them with a T connection at the injector (to the counterlung or where ever). This is what I plan on doing with my IDA 71 conversion.

**Dave Sutton** · 7th June 2007, 22:04

Quote: (Originally Posted by undrh2o)

Most of these system put the constant flow and manual add together like the original KISS and hyrogom. You can reduce the size by separating the two functions and using two low pressure ports on the O2 first stage then combining them with a T connection at the injector (to the counterlung or where ever). This is what I plan on doing with my IDA 71 conversion.

All you really need to do is to have the "cross branch" containing the orifice buried back inside the rig. Then all you have exposed is the add valve at the end of the two hoses, which is tiny.

Dave

DanDunfee · 8th June 2007, 00:09

Quotes (2) from D5 writeup=

The D5™ is a sidemounted rebreather designed for cave diving. It incorporates a metered O2 gas feed with manual bypass and manual diluent injection to a single 4 l counterlung mounted on the exhalation side of the mouthpiece.

UPDATE- ... My unit has been heavily modified to incorporate dual counterlungs enclosed in a wider housing...

======================

Duncan, these quotes were the source of my question as to 'what prompted you to go to a second (inh) counterlung ?'. I inferr from your answer that you didn't incorporate it into your current D5 mods. Correct ??. I don't mean to knitpick, just be sure I understood the D5 writeup and your answer. .

Duncan Price · 8th June 2007, 00:55

Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee)

Duncan, these quotes were the source of my question as to 'what prompted you to go to a second (inh) counterlung ?'. I inferr from your answer that you didn't incorporate it into your current D5 mods. Correct ??. I don't mean to knitpick, just be sure I understood the D5 writeup and your answer. .

Dan - the original (001-004) units had 4l CL's on the exhale side - these contained the gas feed and P-ports for O2 monitoring (it was expedient). I experimented with a larger CL case to accomodate a 2 l exhale CL and 4 l inhale CL - it was too bulky. Woz's D5 has a 4 l inhale CL only with the gas feed upstream (inhale side) of the scrubber. D5#003 (retrofitted) and 006 (my current units) are based on this configuation. I wil do a write up in due course.

As far as I'm concerned, O2 injection is best upstream of the scrubber (for best gas mixing). Diluent (ideally - to be able to go open loop) and ppO2 monitoring (for reading what you are really breathing) should be on the inhale side. This is not news to anyone but I've re-learned this from experience.

In order to configure a slimline rig for squeezing through caves, one has to make compromises...e.g the CL is always at minimum loop. As shorter, fatter version is being considered, although I am tempted to abandon the whole idea for something better...

teomannaskali · 8th June 2007, 23:38

Quote: (Originally Posted by Stephane)

I think that reference 9811K51 would do the job (it's a 10µm brass filter).

9811K53

wouldnt this be a better option to directly attach to the hose?

teomannaskali · 9th June 2007, 00:23

5346K13
is this the correct brass hose fitting?

Teoman

Edit:
Yes it is.

7th June 2007, 16:11	#71 (permalink)
Dave Crampton CK #051 Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Bury St Edmunds, UK Posts: 278	Re: Duncan's New Add System [quote=Duncan Price;119187] Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) The current unit only has one CL (inhale side). Dual CL's too complex. Excuse my newby ignorance Duncan but does having only one CL mean a higher risk in CO2 rtn? Or do you manage this with carefull minloop volume? Cheers in advance. Dave C EDIT: Of course not, one way valves on the hoses.... Dhoop... Last edited by Dave Crampton : 7th June 2007 at 16:12. Reason: Dhoop.
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7th June 2007, 17:01	#72 (permalink)
Duncan Price Sump Monster Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Wells, Somerset, UK Posts: 335	Re: Duncan's New Add System [quote=Dave Crampton;119191] Quote: (Originally Posted by Duncan Price) Excuse my newby ignorance Duncan but does having only one CL mean a higher risk in CO2 rtn? Or do you manage this with carefull minloop volume? Cheers in advance. Dave C EDIT: Of course not, one way valves on the hoses.... Dhoop... The loop volume is pretty minimal and the scrubber overspecified.
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7th June 2007, 18:38	#73 (permalink)
Tom Rose Still Learning Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: USA,North Carolina Posts: 331	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quote: (Originally Posted by Duncan Price) Two? I could do with a couple of shrouded push button covers as well. We have buckets full of Swagelok ones here but they have tilt levers. No problem, PM me your address and how you want them sent. I will put a bill to include shipping in the box with them. My shipping to here was 3 dollars and you get them for my cost in US dollars. Tom __________________ The 50-50-90 rule: Anytime I have a 50-50 chance of getting something right, there's a 90% probability I'll get it wrong the first time. www.atlimp.com
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7th June 2007, 19:42	#74 (permalink)
Style New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Lysekil, Sweden Posts: 9	Re: Duncan's New Add System Hi, been loking at some differant systems for O2 and diluent addition to my upcoming project. The system discussed in this thread lokks very godd but also quite large if you compare to for an example the KISS injection. But on the samt time I guess it would be quite cheaper. So any one have an differant design that isnt so expansive(student economy + rebreather = not good) but still is very small and have an constand O2 flow?
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7th June 2007, 20:49	#75 (permalink)
undrh2o Chris Miller Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 206	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quote: (Originally Posted by Style) Hi, been loking at some differant systems for O2 and diluent addition to my upcoming project. The system discussed in this thread lokks very godd but also quite large if you compare to for an example the KISS injection. But on the samt time I guess it would be quite cheaper. So any one have an differant design that isnt so expansive(student economy + rebreather = not good) but still is very small and have an constand O2 flow? Most of these system put the constant flow and manual add together like the original KISS and hyrogom. You can reduce the size by separating the two functions and using two low pressure ports on the O2 first stage then combining them with a T connection at the injector (to the counterlung or where ever). This is what I plan on doing with my IDA 71 conversion.
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7th June 2007, 22:04	#76 (permalink)
Dave Sutton Diveshop of Horrors Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Narragansett, Rhode Island and Hackettstown, New Jersey Posts: 2,907	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quote: (Originally Posted by undrh2o) Most of these system put the constant flow and manual add together like the original KISS and hyrogom. You can reduce the size by separating the two functions and using two low pressure ports on the O2 first stage then combining them with a T connection at the injector (to the counterlung or where ever). This is what I plan on doing with my IDA 71 conversion. All you really need to do is to have the "cross branch" containing the orifice buried back inside the rig. Then all you have exposed is the add valve at the end of the two hoses, which is tiny. Dave __________________ "Silent Diving with No Bubbles and No Politics".... www.nobubblediving.com
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8th June 2007, 00:09	#77 (permalink)
DanDunfee Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other CCR Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Virginia, USA Posts: 204	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quotes (2) from D5 writeup= The D5™ is a sidemounted rebreather designed for cave diving. It incorporates a metered O2 gas feed with manual bypass and manual diluent injection to a single 4 l counterlung mounted on the exhalation side of the mouthpiece. UPDATE- ... My unit has been heavily modified to incorporate dual counterlungs enclosed in a wider housing... ====================== Duncan, these quotes were the source of my question as to 'what prompted you to go to a second (inh) counterlung ?'. I inferr from your answer that you didn't incorporate it into your current D5 mods. Correct ??. I don't mean to knitpick, just be sure I understood the D5 writeup and your answer. . __________________ There are 'Bold' divers and old divers, but NO old, ' Bold ' divers Last edited by DanDunfee : 8th June 2007 at 00:18.
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8th June 2007, 00:55	#78 (permalink)
Duncan Price Sump Monster Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Wells, Somerset, UK Posts: 335	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quote: (Originally Posted by DanDunfee) Duncan, these quotes were the source of my question as to 'what prompted you to go to a second (inh) counterlung ?'. I inferr from your answer that you didn't incorporate it into your current D5 mods. Correct ??. I don't mean to knitpick, just be sure I understood the D5 writeup and your answer. . Dan - the original (001-004) units had 4l CL's on the exhale side - these contained the gas feed and P-ports for O2 monitoring (it was expedient). I experimented with a larger CL case to accomodate a 2 l exhale CL and 4 l inhale CL - it was too bulky. Woz's D5 has a 4 l inhale CL only with the gas feed upstream (inhale side) of the scrubber. D5#003 (retrofitted) and 006 (my current units) are based on this configuation. I wil do a write up in due course. As far as I'm concerned, O2 injection is best upstream of the scrubber (for best gas mixing). Diluent (ideally - to be able to go open loop) and ppO2 monitoring (for reading what you are really breathing) should be on the inhale side. This is not news to anyone but I've re-learned this from experience. In order to configure a slimline rig for squeezing through caves, one has to make compromises...e.g the CL is always at minimum loop. As shorter, fatter version is being considered, although I am tempted to abandon the whole idea for something better...
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8th June 2007, 23:38	#79 (permalink)
teomannaskali RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Home Build Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Istanbul TR Posts: 421	Re: Duncan's New Add System Quote: (Originally Posted by Stephane) I think that reference 9811K51 would do the job (it's a 10µm brass filter). 9811K53 wouldnt this be a better option to directly attach to the hose?
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9th June 2007, 00:23	#80 (permalink)
teomannaskali RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Home Build Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Istanbul TR Posts: 421	Re: Duncan's New Add System 5346K13 is this the correct brass hose fitting? Teoman Edit: Yes it is. Last edited by teomannaskali : 9th June 2007 at 01:04. Reason: got the correct answer
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