Passive Scr Superiority?

Marc T · 16th October 2006, 12:09

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy)

Is that all you do? Your dives must be one long dull experience.

Try looking at fish or wrecks some time. You might like it

Watching Fishes! these disgusting animals who piss in the sea more particulary around these horrible used boats you can more easily watch at on surface?

RichardGreen · 16th October 2006, 12:27

Quote: (Originally Posted by Marc T;72974quote)

That wasnt the question I think.
Its an evidence that a life support must be idiot proof.
Even an" underwater - idiot" can slowly and carrefuly prepare his dive before ( correct gaz etc ) but even a genius or a professional pilot can do a mistake with or without any stress.
I dived a pSCR for enough time to appreciate that the only thing to do underwater was to listen to the regular flow of bubbles on inhale time.
The less you have to do underwater the less mistake you can do.
If your Rebreather is complex or possible known issue then its just a matter of time.

Total bollocks

Richard Green

Marc T · 16th October 2006, 12:35

Quote: (Originally Posted by RichardGreen)

Total bollocks

Richard Green

decoweenie · 16th October 2006, 12:38

"Gentlemen",

Let's not get another thread closed, please...

Mike · 16th October 2006, 12:45

Quote: (Originally Posted by Marc T)

I dived a pSCR for enough time to appreciate that the only thing to do underwater was to listen to the regular flow of bubbles on inhale time.
The less you have to do underwater the less mistake you can do.
If your Rebreather is complex or possible known issue then its just a matter of time.

Ummm how do you do a 20min at 70m dive without swapping gasses on a pSCR?
If you've done 15 hours diving on the scrubber, are you safe for another 5 hours just listening to bubbles?
If you pack the scrubber at home, drive for 6 hours to site and the unit rattles as you get in the water, are you safe listening to the bubbles?
If your nitrox analyser you used to analyse the gas on land with isn't linear anymore, and your 40% mix is actually 60% can you tell in the water?
If your flapper valves in the DSV fail, how do those bubbles sound different?

Hey - I don't know shit and I've never seen a pSCR

Mike

RichardGreen · 16th October 2006, 12:47

I cannot think of anthing on the planet that's idiot proof, and quite frankly to say that a rebreather that is "complex" is just a matter of time ("before" , pressumably it kills you?) is ridiculous, not to mention the other comments.

Richard Green

decoweenie · 16th October 2006, 12:49

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mike)

If your flapper valves in the DSV fail, how do those bubbles sound different?

This one is actually detectable on the pSCR...

Mark Chase · 16th October 2006, 12:54

Quote: (Originally Posted by robertfondren)

By virtue of the "fact" that passive addition SCRS require little or no monitoring of loop PO2, and still manage to enhance gas utilization by an engineer-defined ratio (1/7) or greater, are they not at least theoretically the safest form of re breather?

I think they could be. However the limited benefits of SCR over OC for OW diving make it a very expensive toy. IF they sorted out the WOB issues with a RB80 type unit It would be worth considering but with fixed PP02 problems, the possibility for error on a gas switching block and the need for multiple drive gases AND bailout on OW dives I still don't see it as being that good a choice.

If i dived one Id dive it the equivalent of Alpinist in that i do two or three big dives on the unit with the same tins of gas. So by dive 3 ill probably not have enough reserve gas to bailout OC

It also reintroduces the best mix issue into diving. These days i dive 18/45 on everything down to 60 and 14/55 past that. The thought of doing a 30m dive on 18/45 doesn't appeal to me. I have a tin of 18/45 and a tin of 14/55 and a booster to fill the little 3ltr tins. Life is good.

I still think the KISS with a HUD is the way to go to achieve the balance of safety and practical advantages of CCR.

ATB

Mark Chase

***caveseeker7*** · 16th October 2006, 13:07

Listen to what decoweenie just said. He's wise beyond his years.

Mike · 16th October 2006, 13:09

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

This one is actually detectable on the pSCR...

Hey - I said I don't know shit...

One way valve in the bellows?

Mike

16th October 2006, 12:09	#11 (permalink)
Marc T hell is in the details Current Rebreather/s: RB80 / Clone Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet RB80 / Clone Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: FRANCE Carcassonne Posts: 470	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy) Is that all you do? Your dives must be one long dull experience. Try looking at fish or wrecks some time. You might like it Watching Fishes! these disgusting animals who piss in the sea more particulary around these horrible used boats you can more easily watch at on surface?
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16th October 2006, 12:27	#12 (permalink)
RichardGreen Internet Dive Guru Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 140	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by Marc T;72974quote) That wasnt the question I think. Its an evidence that a life support must be idiot proof. Even an" underwater - idiot" can slowly and carrefuly prepare his dive before ( correct gaz etc ) but even a genius or a professional pilot can do a mistake with or without any stress. I dived a pSCR for enough time to appreciate that the only thing to do underwater was to listen to the regular flow of bubbles on inhale time. The less you have to do underwater the less mistake you can do. If your Rebreather is complex or possible known issue then its just a matter of time. Total bollocks Richard Green
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16th October 2006, 12:35	#13 (permalink)
Marc T hell is in the details Current Rebreather/s: RB80 / Clone Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet RB80 / Clone Home Build Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: FRANCE Carcassonne Posts: 470	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by RichardGreen) Total bollocks Richard Green
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16th October 2006, 12:38	#14 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? "Gentlemen", Let's not get another thread closed, please... __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
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16th October 2006, 12:45	#15 (permalink)
Mike Prism 'prentice Current Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Melbourne Posts: 327	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by Marc T) I dived a pSCR for enough time to appreciate that the only thing to do underwater was to listen to the regular flow of bubbles on inhale time. The less you have to do underwater the less mistake you can do. If your Rebreather is complex or possible known issue then its just a matter of time. Ummm how do you do a 20min at 70m dive without swapping gasses on a pSCR? If you've done 15 hours diving on the scrubber, are you safe for another 5 hours just listening to bubbles? If you pack the scrubber at home, drive for 6 hours to site and the unit rattles as you get in the water, are you safe listening to the bubbles? If your nitrox analyser you used to analyse the gas on land with isn't linear anymore, and your 40% mix is actually 60% can you tell in the water? If your flapper valves in the DSV fail, how do those bubbles sound different? Hey - I don't know shit and I've never seen a pSCR Mike __________________ Open ....... Closed Mind ........ Loop
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16th October 2006, 12:47	#16 (permalink)
RichardGreen Internet Dive Guru Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 140	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? I cannot think of anthing on the planet that's idiot proof, and quite frankly to say that a rebreather that is "complex" is just a matter of time ("before" , pressumably it kills you?) is ridiculous, not to mention the other comments. Richard Green
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16th October 2006, 12:49	#17 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by Mike) If your flapper valves in the DSV fail, how do those bubbles sound different? This one is actually detectable on the pSCR... __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
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16th October 2006, 12:54	#18 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,556	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by robertfondren) By virtue of the "fact" that passive addition SCRS require little or no monitoring of loop PO2, and still manage to enhance gas utilization by an engineer-defined ratio (1/7) or greater, are they not at least theoretically the safest form of re breather? I think they could be. However the limited benefits of SCR over OC for OW diving make it a very expensive toy. IF they sorted out the WOB issues with a RB80 type unit It would be worth considering but with fixed PP02 problems, the possibility for error on a gas switching block and the need for multiple drive gases AND bailout on OW dives I still don't see it as being that good a choice. If i dived one Id dive it the equivalent of Alpinist in that i do two or three big dives on the unit with the same tins of gas. So by dive 3 ill probably not have enough reserve gas to bailout OC It also reintroduces the best mix issue into diving. These days i dive 18/45 on everything down to 60 and 14/55 past that. The thought of doing a 30m dive on 18/45 doesn't appeal to me. I have a tin of 18/45 and a tin of 14/55 and a booster to fill the little 3ltr tins. Life is good. I still think the KISS with a HUD is the way to go to achieve the balance of safety and practical advantages of CCR. ATB Mark Chase __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System
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16th October 2006, 13:07	#19 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,435	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Listen to what decoweenie just said. He's wise beyond his years. __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.'!"
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16th October 2006, 13:09	#20 (permalink)
Mike Prism 'prentice Current Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Evolution Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Melbourne Posts: 327	Re: Passive Scr Superiority? Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) This one is actually detectable on the pSCR... Hey - I said I don't know shit... One way valve in the bellows? Mike __________________ Open ....... Closed Mind ........ Loop
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