Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body?

**Gill Envy** · 10th August 2006, 19:14

With all this talk of Co2 detectors, scrubber duration and breakthrough, I've started thinking about what is the greatest source of Co2 in the body, and where is the greatest increase likely to come from. In other words, what specific area in the body is most likely to be the source of a big spike?

I’m thinking it’s the big muscle groups of the legs, by a long shot, like on the order of 10 times that of the rest of the body. Why is this important? Getting religious about finding a perch or a position on the shot line where your legs are not moving at all might be as important a part of the reaction protocol as flushing your loop. Without actually feeling like it, we are likely producing a lot of CO2 in our legs even without working them that hard. So, for whatever it’s worth, if you are in a situation where you are sensing a CO2 issue I’m thinking it would be most prudent to focus on getting your legs still over any other part of the body, till you catch your breath and the symptoms reside.

Anyone who could confirm or deny the value in this thinking?

jhaaja · 10th August 2006, 19:59

You have the right kind of thinking, the bigger the muscle the more oxygen it can use and produce co2. In general you should stop all movement if you start feeling co2 and breathe really through and deep. That way you ventilate as much as possible and reduce production of co2 a little.

JH

Mixaddict · 11th August 2006, 04:25

Obviously going off the loop for sanity breaths and completely flushing the loop would still be required (or at least flushing the loop). Otherwise the CO2 will still be in the loop and continue to be a big time problem! But you are correct, just as in OC, when the CO2 starts to build up, stop the activity that is creating the CO2.

**Gill Envy** · 11th August 2006, 18:25

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mixaddict)

Obviously going off the loop for sanity breaths and completely flushing the loop would still be required (or at least flushing the loop). Otherwise the CO2 will still be in the loop and continue to be a big time problem! But you are correct, just as in OC, when the CO2 starts to build up, stop the activity that is creating the CO2.

by all means, wouldn't want anyone to think i'm suggesting focussing on getting still more than flushing the loop. My point is mostly that while it probably seems obvious when you think about it, actually making getting still a part of ones protocal would seem to be a good idea, especially with respect to ones legs... it seems that most people when they get elevated anxiety start kicking more, involuntarily...to fight that instinct, i'm thinking it takes pre-learned patterns/drills...just a thought.

**nigelh** · 11th August 2006, 19:28

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gillenvy)

Anyone who could confirm or deny the value in this thinking?

I think I read somewhere that the brain is one of the main consumers of oxygen and hence producers of CO2. Hence 'this thinking' or in fact any thinking is obviously a bad idea.

I go with the general concensus that if you think there is a problem get off the loop while you can. If that doesn't change anything go back.

silent running · 11th August 2006, 20:04

Quote: (Originally Posted by nigelh)

I think I read somewhere that the brain is one of the main consumers of oxygen and hence producers of CO2. Hence 'this thinking' or in fact any thinking is obviously a bad idea.

I go with the general concensus that if you think there is a problem get off the loop while you can. If that doesn't change anything go back.

Hi Nigel, this is my understanding too. The brain is proportionally the largest comsumer of O2 in the body-3% of body weight which comsumes 20% of the O2. This is one of the reasons proposed for the slow expansion of brain size during the stage of evolution between arcaics and modern humans-bigger brain is greedy consumer of O2, a large hurdle to get over.

But my guess is that it's a steady consumer of O2, unlike a large muscle group whose consumption rises and falls with exertion. So I think those big muscle groups would be the main factor in the kind of high, short term CO2 production that could cause a hit. -Andy

decoweenie · 11th August 2006, 20:10

Quote: (Originally Posted by silent running)

...But my guess is that it's a steady consumer of O2...

Not sure about that, I certainly don't get a steady output of useful information from my brain... I think mine has idle mode...

Janos · 11th August 2006, 22:11

Also I believe that the liver has a huge blood supply. There are studies on narcosis [1] which show the liver shutting down too.

Janos

[1] - Zak's going to ask me for references isn't he... Time to dig.

shell-back · 11th August 2006, 22:16

there is a way to test this ,
If you wish to participate in this study do the following , Strip naked while standing next to a lake in Minnesota just as the sun starts to set. do some deep knee bends and try to ignore the cloud of swarming f^*$#@ mosquito. they say the little buggers are attracted to CO2

then run like Hell inside and wait about 5 mins then start counting bites. the body part with the most bites wins.

In all seriousness I believe the skin ( largest most import organ of the human body) is the winner for the most output.

MGI · 14th August 2006, 20:01

All living tissue consumes O2 and exerts CO2. For every pint of oxygen that it consumed, the human body produces almost a pint of carbon dioxide. The exact amount depends upon the individual and varies according to diet, fitness and other factors. Obviously this changes dramatically when a diver is subjected to increased workloads and exercise. The more the system is exerted the greater the amount of CO2 production. Rather than thinking about where the CO2 is produced i.e. legs, arms, brain, etc. keep it simple. If you want to limit CO2 excess just breath or take the mosquito test.

10th August 2006, 19:14	#1 (permalink)
Gill Envy Shearwater Copis Diver Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Other CCR Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: seattle Posts: 1,250	Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? With all this talk of Co2 detectors, scrubber duration and breakthrough, I've started thinking about what is the greatest source of Co2 in the body, and where is the greatest increase likely to come from. In other words, what specific area in the body is most likely to be the source of a big spike? I’m thinking it’s the big muscle groups of the legs, by a long shot, like on the order of 10 times that of the rest of the body. Why is this important? Getting religious about finding a perch or a position on the shot line where your legs are not moving at all might be as important a part of the reaction protocol as flushing your loop. Without actually feeling like it, we are likely producing a lot of CO2 in our legs even without working them that hard. So, for whatever it’s worth, if you are in a situation where you are sensing a CO2 issue I’m thinking it would be most prudent to focus on getting your legs still over any other part of the body, till you catch your breath and the symptoms reside. Anyone who could confirm or deny the value in this thinking? __________________ Gill Envy ...Because I wasn't born with gills! ><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>
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10th August 2006, 19:59	#2 (permalink)
jhaaja Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 867	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? You have the right kind of thinking, the bigger the muscle the more oxygen it can use and produce co2. In general you should stop all movement if you start feeling co2 and breathe really through and deep. That way you ventilate as much as possible and reduce production of co2 a little. JH
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11th August 2006, 04:25	#3 (permalink)
Mixaddict Always Learning! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other CCR Dolphin Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Draper, Utah USA Posts: 426	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Obviously going off the loop for sanity breaths and completely flushing the loop would still be required (or at least flushing the loop). Otherwise the CO2 will still be in the loop and continue to be a big time problem! But you are correct, just as in OC, when the CO2 starts to build up, stop the activity that is creating the CO2.
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11th August 2006, 18:25	#4 (permalink)
Gill Envy Shearwater Copis Diver Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Other CCR Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: seattle Posts: 1,250	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Quote: (Originally Posted by Mixaddict) Obviously going off the loop for sanity breaths and completely flushing the loop would still be required (or at least flushing the loop). Otherwise the CO2 will still be in the loop and continue to be a big time problem! But you are correct, just as in OC, when the CO2 starts to build up, stop the activity that is creating the CO2. by all means, wouldn't want anyone to think i'm suggesting focussing on getting still more than flushing the loop. My point is mostly that while it probably seems obvious when you think about it, actually making getting still a part of ones protocal would seem to be a good idea, especially with respect to ones legs... it seems that most people when they get elevated anxiety start kicking more, involuntarily...to fight that instinct, i'm thinking it takes pre-learned patterns/drills...just a thought. __________________ Gill Envy ...Because I wasn't born with gills! ><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>><(°>
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11th August 2006, 19:28	#5 (permalink)
nigelh New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Brighton, Sussex, UK Posts: 792	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Quote: (Originally Posted by Gillenvy) Anyone who could confirm or deny the value in this thinking? I think I read somewhere that the brain is one of the main consumers of oxygen and hence producers of CO2. Hence 'this thinking' or in fact any thinking is obviously a bad idea. I go with the general concensus that if you think there is a problem get off the loop while you can. If that doesn't change anything go back. __________________ nigelh
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11th August 2006, 20:04	#6 (permalink)
silent running Mature mouth breather Current Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: U.S.A. Brooklyn, New York Posts: 1,777	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Quote: (Originally Posted by nigelh) I think I read somewhere that the brain is one of the main consumers of oxygen and hence producers of CO2. Hence 'this thinking' or in fact any thinking is obviously a bad idea. I go with the general concensus that if you think there is a problem get off the loop while you can. If that doesn't change anything go back. Hi Nigel, this is my understanding too. The brain is proportionally the largest comsumer of O2 in the body-3% of body weight which comsumes 20% of the O2. This is one of the reasons proposed for the slow expansion of brain size during the stage of evolution between arcaics and modern humans-bigger brain is greedy consumer of O2, a large hurdle to get over. But my guess is that it's a steady consumer of O2, unlike a large muscle group whose consumption rises and falls with exertion. So I think those big muscle groups would be the main factor in the kind of high, short term CO2 production that could cause a hit. -Andy
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11th August 2006, 20:10	#7 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Quote: (Originally Posted by silent running) ...But my guess is that it's a steady consumer of O2... Not sure about that, I certainly don't get a steady output of useful information from my brain... I think mine has idle mode... __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
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11th August 2006, 22:11	#8 (permalink)
Janos "Two Sheds" Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: East Surrey Posts: 580	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? Also I believe that the liver has a huge blood supply. There are studies on narcosis [1] which show the liver shutting down too. Janos [1] - Zak's going to ask me for references isn't he... Time to dig. __________________ You can lead a horse to water but you can't climb a ladder with a large bell in both hands - Vic Reeves www.hellfins.com/shed
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11th August 2006, 22:16	#9 (permalink)
shell-back I do all my own stunts Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Dolphin Ray Azimuth Other SCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Dolphin Ray Azimuth Other SCR Home Build Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: middle of US Posts: 481	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? there is a way to test this , If you wish to participate in this study do the following , Strip naked while standing next to a lake in Minnesota just as the sun starts to set. do some deep knee bends and try to ignore the cloud of swarming f^$#@ mosquito. they say the little buggers are attracted to CO2 then run like Hell inside and wait about 5 mins then start counting bites. the body part with the most bites wins. In all seriousness I believe the skin ( largest most import organ of the human body) is the winner for the most output. __________________ The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance -- it is the illusion of knowledge. ----Daniel Boorstin Billy Beal* SDITDI IT #3507 Rebreather World FIGJAM commitee member Last edited by shell-back : 11th August 2006 at 22:19.
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14th August 2006, 20:01	#10 (permalink)
MGI New Member Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 63	Re: Where is the largest source of CO2 in the body? All living tissue consumes O2 and exerts CO2. For every pint of oxygen that it consumed, the human body produces almost a pint of carbon dioxide. The exact amount depends upon the individual and varies according to diet, fitness and other factors. Obviously this changes dramatically when a diver is subjected to increased workloads and exercise. The more the system is exerted the greater the amount of CO2 production. Rather than thinking about where the CO2 is produced i.e. legs, arms, brain, etc. keep it simple. If you want to limit CO2 excess just breath or take the mosquito test.
(Offline)

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