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Old 31st March 2006, 21:55   #1 (permalink)
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Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

Hello all,

So what if I wanted to do my time on the CCR and then be a CCR instructor and avoid the whole OC route, is there a problem there?

As I understand it, the course of action is Open Water/Nitrox, Adv. Nitrox, then CCR? So with that said, I could only take an Adv. Nitrox diver to train and couldn't train from beginning? Will there be a time when you can skip OC?
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Old 1st April 2006, 00:31   #2 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

I don't know of an agency that will let you become an advanced instructor without first being a O/W instructor. TDI requires you be an OWI before you can teach nitrox. I'm pretty sure PSA is the same.
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Old 1st April 2006, 16:51   #3 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

84 views and 1 comment...

I understand that it's a semi-stupid question, but...

Will there ever be an Open Water Rebreather course?
Everyone says it's learning to dive all over again, so why not just start out Rebreater and bundle OC for bailout?

Is it because it's considered an advanced way of diving and a lot of people have enough problems with OC?
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Old 1st April 2006, 18:12   #4 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

I doubt there will ever be an open-water rebreather course. To train on, and use, a rebreather safely and enjoyably you need to be comfortable with what you'll use as a bail-out when it all goes pear-shaped! Imagine a student who was afraid to go off the loop because they weren't used to O/C!
Now if everyone had a back-up rebreather....... :)

Neil

Last edited by Sutty; 1st April 2006 at 18:13.. Reason: Sppeling!
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Old 1st April 2006, 20:53   #5 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

I've seen several pole asking how long people have been diving before they went to rebreathers. If I remember rightly, the average inspo diver had been diving 15 years with 1500+ dives under their belts before they started looking at rebreathers.

This forum discusses the complex technicalities of Rebreather diving and IMHO I think maybe its easy to forget that OC diving isn't risk free.

What I'm trying to say is that diving is dangerous by nature and its a very good idea to get good with kit that doesn't try to kill you before you move to kit that does try and kill you.

What I do know, is having spent a lot of time on OC, my diving is automatic so I can concentrate on what my rebreather is doing/trying to tell me, everything else has become automatic.

The most important lesson I ever learned as an instructor (OC) is progression and again, IMHO I think the average person has enough on his/her plate being underwater in the early days without worrying about P02, loop flood, channeling, CO2 hits, MOD (for us poor SCRs:D) bailout etc, etc.

I know several other divers who've gone Rebreather with a lot less time on OC than me, and they are far less relaxed than I am (they havn't got there skills automatic yet).

All subjective, but I strongly recommend OC to get used to being underwater for a few years, before going Rebreather.

Whatever you do, have fun. (and anyway, you've got to dive OC to know how good RBs are :D:D)

Cheers

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Old 1st April 2006, 22:00   #6 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

Quote: (Originally Posted by curator)
What I do know, is having spent a lot of time on OC, my diving is automatic so I can concentrate on what my rebreather is doing/trying to tell me, everything else has become automatic.

The most important lesson I ever learned as an instructor (OC) is progression and again, IMHO I think the average person has enough on his/her plate being underwater in the early days without worrying about P02, loop flood, channeling, CO2 hits, MOD (for us poor SCRs:D) bailout etc, etc.

I know several other divers who've gone Rebreather with a lot less time on OC than me, and they are far less relaxed than I am (they havn't got there skills automatic yet).

All subjective, but I strongly recommend OC to get used to being underwater for a few years, before going Rebreather.
I totally agree with the above. OC training is absolutley necessary to learn basic diving skills before moving on to a MUCH MORE DEMANDING rebreather environment, wether it be as a diver or an instructor.

Just my two cents.

Regards,
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Old 2nd April 2006, 01:28   #7 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

Answer to both probably differ from agency to agency.

Regarding the instructor question for example NAUI doesn't just require you to get the OW instructor ticket first, but actually train 50 OW students before you can get your Rebreather instructor ticket. Happening as we speak to a friend of mine.

Regarding OW Rebreather certification, that has been done. NRC in Germany has certified initial OW students on Dräger Dolphins and Rays. The OW, the nitrox and SCR course are build into a single course.

Obviously it takes some extra time as well as quite a bit more extra effort by the student learning the needed theory and skills. Am not 100% sure, but I remember hearing that IANTD has likewise trained OW students on RBs. ANDI I'm less sure about ... maybe tried in a pilot program? Joe?

Combining specialty courses with OW courses isn't new, ANDI locally folds the LSU course into the class if students want to (32% and 36% nitrox), and OW students getting the drysuit training in cold areas is also common.
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Old 2nd April 2006, 04:03   #8 (permalink)
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Re: Must you be an OC instructor before CCR Instructor?

.... Am not 100% sure, but I remember hearing that IANTD has likewise trained OW students on RBs....

yo

Under IANTD you can do all training levels on a rebreather, from openwater all the way up without ever take a breath of oc ... if you would have a bailout rebreather with you. If not then your oc breathing would be limited to bailout scenarios in training or for real. That is for the user level, beginner, cave, trimix.

For the instructor level, while having the standards in front of me, it looks like you have to be oc first, at least for the advanced nitrox instructor level.... but a salways, I could be dead wrong...

Matt
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