Condensation In Your Rebreather

***caveseeker7*** · 20th March 2005, 19:48

Hi all,

I'm curious where most of the condensation occurs in your rebreather.
Basically which rebreather you dive, where the condensations occurs and collects, warm, temperate and/or cold water you dive in and if you see a difference in different environments.

The reason for the latter part stems from a recent converation with board member Joe Radomski. He reported seeing different condensation spots in his Inspiration (what's left of it anyway, it's more an Inscreation).

I cold NE Atlantic waters most condensation occurs in the down tube and collects at the bottom of the cannister, while in warm FL and Carribean waters most of the condensation occurs in the head.

I used the PRISM only in temperate waters (I've never, ever been diving warm water

) and condensations primarily occurs along the bucket and collects at its bottom (2 foam pads).

I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon, but curious about any unit, so if you dive a Cis, Dolphin, Azi, EDOxxPRISM in cold or warm water or something else please post those results, too.

Thanks

Andy M · 20th March 2005, 20:05

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

I'm curious where most of the condensation occurs in your rebreather.
Basically which rebreather you dive, where the condensations occurs and collects, warm, temperate and/or cold water you dive in and if you see a difference in different environments.

I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon

Well, speaking from just a few hours experience with Sport KISS in cold water (4-5C) most of the condensation is in the exhale side of the unit, around the right hand red pod area, seems to be mainly over the O2 sensors and in the exhale side of the scrubber. Not too much though. Some people have said the scrubber gets wet, but I have found it pretty dry each time I come to fill it. Not dived it in warm water yet.

***EBT*** · 20th March 2005, 21:22

A bit in the hoses, only really noticeable on the longer dives (90+) in <10c water.

The vast majority seems to settle in the central core and trickle down into the bottom 'gap'. This is where most of us stick an absorbent pad.

The counterlungs hardly collect a teaspoon...

/Zak

Pelagian · 20th March 2005, 21:42

The longest dives we've pulled out here are in the region of 4 hours during the summer months when the water is up to 85 F.

The loop temp sensor on my Meg sais the reaction is producing temperatues about 10 degrees hotter than the water.

I fly my unit manally and the solenoid usually only fires on ascent in the very shallows.

For the most part I find negligible condensation at the cells.

A little by the solenoid, but that's about it.

I seem to produce an enormous about of lung butter, so my Exhale CL can sometines have up to half a cup of goo, but I usually purge the loop a couple of times during the ascent, to dump this overboard.

I find the unit overall to be very dry. My shammy pads are usuaally only slighlty damp, and I attribute this to condendation.

Cheers

***caveseeker7*** · 21st March 2005, 03:09

Thanks for the responses, guys.

Drmike · 21st March 2005, 04:12

Condensation is going to occur in any Rebreather of course.

A good design deals with it without being a danger or an inconvenience to the diver (say easy to replace/dry moisture pads or sensor positioning to prevent condensation screwing up sensor outputs/ppo2 control) A bad design wont.

A design that allows condensation to screw up sensor outputs is plain crap in my opinion.

On very long dives on a YBOD you can not always get reliable sensor readings for the whole dive duration as condensation builds up or drips onto one or more cell faces.

On multi dive days you can forget alarm free dives unless you dry the head/sensor faces between dives.

I find it hard to keep a YBOD running reliably and trouble free without fussing around drying the head/sensor faces and hoses between dives, not swimming on back, not doing giant strides ect.

I like a design that keeps moisture away from the sensor faces - something the YBOD certainly doesn't do. This is the biggest flaw in the YBOD in my opinion.

I dont know about other units with similar designs like the PRISM or KISS but I do know with the MK15 series the sensors are bone dry all the time I just dry out the moisture pads at the end of each diving day for fuss free diving.

My comments/observations above are concerning warm water diving.

On a MK15.5 Ive only experienced condensation in the hoses and the dome scrubber lid.

decoweenie · 21st March 2005, 11:34

Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7)

I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon, but curious about any unit, so if you dive a Cis, Dolphin, Azi, EDOxxPRISM in cold or warm water or something else please post those results, too.

I dived Rebreather units ranging from 2C to 30C, and found condensation is worse in warmer water.

Sport-KISS (cold and warmwater): in exhalation hose (right) and in same side of scrubber. The rest is perfectly dry.

Classic-KISS (cold and warmwater): again, mostly in the exhalation hose and bottom of scrubber(before the sorb). Plus inside the scrubber head on the exhalation compartment. Very little in the CL.

MK-15 (coldwater): inside the center section, a few spoons full.

Dolphin (coldwater):inside counter-lungs.

XCR (warmwater):in the bellows and gas injection section.

BMR-500 (warmwater): same as MK-15.

PVR-BASC (warmwater): hard to determine since can't open the unit completely, but water didn't collect in the water trap and could be pumped out easily.

FathomsDown · 23rd March 2005, 16:16

Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike)

I like a design that keeps moisture away from the sensor faces - something the YBOD certainly doesn't do. This is the biggest flaw in the YBOD in my opinion.

Hmm, I wonder how the new Inspo 2 head will fare then?

The new design (for those of you who didn't get a good look at LIDS) has a flat lid with a smaller, caged area below it (which fits into the canister body) so I wonder if the two layers of plastic around the body of the head, the "cage" plastic to act as a condensing surface and thicker lid will help?

Has anyone with an Evo noticed the difference in where the condensation ends up?

lizardland · 23rd March 2005, 16:33

Going by the sticky liquid in my counterlung, I'd say most happens there though I get a little in the bottom of the bucket. Mine is a homebuild sidemount Rebreather, exhale bag (10litre) is inline with the route to the scrubber (not on a T).

h2ophotopro · 24th March 2005, 05:56

Dr. Mike

I completelyagree with you. The major flaw in the Insp is the moisture in the head and the sensitivity of the sensors to moisture. 3 of us took these units to Fiji in Dec/Jan, and we had numerous problems with the humidity. You certainly do have to be careful about how you turn in the unit, and once you get back on the boat. Although recommended in my training, it just is not practical (and its a pain) to open the head and dry off the sensors, etc in betwen dives.

If this gets taken care of, this would be one excellent unit.

20th March 2005, 19:48	#1 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,451	Condensation In Your Rebreather Hi all, I'm curious where most of the condensation occurs in your rebreather. Basically which rebreather you dive, where the condensations occurs and collects, warm, temperate and/or cold water you dive in and if you see a difference in different environments. The reason for the latter part stems from a recent converation with board member Joe Radomski. He reported seeing different condensation spots in his Inspiration (what's left of it anyway, it's more an Inscreation). I cold NE Atlantic waters most condensation occurs in the down tube and collects at the bottom of the cannister, while in warm FL and Carribean waters most of the condensation occurs in the head. I used the PRISM only in temperate waters (I've never, ever been diving warm water ) and condensations primarily occurs along the bucket and collects at its bottom (2 foam pads). I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon, but curious about any unit, so if you dive a Cis, Dolphin, Azi, EDOxxPRISM in cold or warm water or something else please post those results, too. Thanks __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.!"
(Offline)

20th March 2005, 20:05	#2 (permalink)
Andy M Dude Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Cambridge, UK Posts: 423	Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) I'm curious where most of the condensation occurs in your rebreather. Basically which rebreather you dive, where the condensations occurs and collects, warm, temperate and/or cold water you dive in and if you see a difference in different environments. I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon Well, speaking from just a few hours experience with Sport KISS in cold water (4-5C) most of the condensation is in the exhale side of the unit, around the right hand red pod area, seems to be mainly over the O2 sensors and in the exhale side of the scrubber. Not too much though. Some people have said the scrubber gets wet, but I have found it pretty dry each time I come to fill it. Not dived it in warm water yet.
(Offline)

20th March 2005, 21:22	#3 (permalink)
*EBT* Apprentice Luddite Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK, Brighton Posts: 1,970	Classic KISS A bit in the hoses, only really noticeable on the longer dives (90+) in <10c water. The vast majority seems to settle in the central core and trickle down into the bottom 'gap'. This is where most of us stick an absorbent pad. The counterlungs hardly collect a teaspoon... /Zak __________________ Eagles May Soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Rebreather World Terms of service Real diving t-shirts for real divers
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20th March 2005, 21:42	#4 (permalink)
Pelagian Multi-Circuit Meg Monkey! Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Sport Kiss Optima Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Leeds, England Posts: 282	The longest dives we've pulled out here are in the region of 4 hours during the summer months when the water is up to 85 F. The loop temp sensor on my Meg sais the reaction is producing temperatues about 10 degrees hotter than the water. I fly my unit manally and the solenoid usually only fires on ascent in the very shallows. For the most part I find negligible condensation at the cells. A little by the solenoid, but that's about it. I seem to produce an enormous about of lung butter, so my Exhale CL can sometines have up to half a cup of goo, but I usually purge the loop a couple of times during the ascent, to dump this overboard. I find the unit overall to be very dry. My shammy pads are usuaally only slighlty damp, and I attribute this to condendation. Cheers __________________ 'Because... I was Inverted!'
(Online)

21st March 2005, 03:09	#5 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,451	Thanks for the responses, guys. __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.!"
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21st March 2005, 04:12	#6 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,325	Condensation is going to occur in any Rebreather of course. A good design deals with it without being a danger or an inconvenience to the diver (say easy to replace/dry moisture pads or sensor positioning to prevent condensation screwing up sensor outputs/ppo2 control) A bad design wont. A design that allows condensation to screw up sensor outputs is plain crap in my opinion. On very long dives on a YBOD you can not always get reliable sensor readings for the whole dive duration as condensation builds up or drips onto one or more cell faces. On multi dive days you can forget alarm free dives unless you dry the head/sensor faces between dives. I find it hard to keep a YBOD running reliably and trouble free without fussing around drying the head/sensor faces and hoses between dives, not swimming on back, not doing giant strides ect. I like a design that keeps moisture away from the sensor faces - something the YBOD certainly doesn't do. This is the biggest flaw in the YBOD in my opinion. I dont know about other units with similar designs like the PRISM or KISS but I do know with the MK15 series the sensors are bone dry all the time I just dry out the moisture pads at the end of each diving day for fuss free diving. My comments/observations above are concerning warm water diving. On a MK15.5 Ive only experienced condensation in the hoses and the dome scrubber lid.
(Offline)

21st March 2005, 11:34	#7 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,487	Quote: (Originally Posted by caveseeker7) I'm particulary intrested in Sport and Classic KISS and Megalodon, but curious about any unit, so if you dive a Cis, Dolphin, Azi, EDOxxPRISM in cold or warm water or something else please post those results, too. I dived Rebreather units ranging from 2C to 30C, and found condensation is worse in warmer water. Sport-KISS (cold and warmwater): in exhalation hose (right) and in same side of scrubber. The rest is perfectly dry. Classic-KISS (cold and warmwater): again, mostly in the exhalation hose and bottom of scrubber(before the sorb). Plus inside the scrubber head on the exhalation compartment. Very little in the CL. MK-15 (coldwater): inside the center section, a few spoons full. Dolphin (coldwater):inside counter-lungs. XCR (warmwater):in the bellows and gas injection section. BMR-500 (warmwater): same as MK-15. PVR-BASC (warmwater): hard to determine since can't open the unit completely, but water didn't collect in the water trap and could be pumped out easily.
(Offline)

23rd March 2005, 16:16	#8 (permalink)
FathomsDown New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: London Posts: 76	Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike) I like a design that keeps moisture away from the sensor faces - something the YBOD certainly doesn't do. This is the biggest flaw in the YBOD in my opinion. Hmm, I wonder how the new Inspo 2 head will fare then? The new design (for those of you who didn't get a good look at LIDS) has a flat lid with a smaller, caged area below it (which fits into the canister body) so I wonder if the two layers of plastic around the body of the head, the "cage" plastic to act as a condensing surface and thicker lid will help? Has anyone with an Evo noticed the difference in where the condensation ends up? __________________ Dive deep, stay long, deco for friggin' ages.
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23rd March 2005, 16:33	#9 (permalink)
lizardland Yak Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: North... Posts: 1,302	Going by the sticky liquid in my counterlung, I'd say most happens there though I get a little in the bottom of the bucket. Mine is a homebuild sidemount Rebreather, exhale bag (10litre) is inline with the route to the scrubber (not on a T).
(Offline)

24th March 2005, 05:56	#10 (permalink)
h2ophotopro Photo Pro Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Woodland Hills, CA Posts: 161	Dr. Mike I completelyagree with you. The major flaw in the Insp is the moisture in the head and the sensitivity of the sensors to moisture. 3 of us took these units to Fiji in Dec/Jan, and we had numerous problems with the humidity. You certainly do have to be careful about how you turn in the unit, and once you get back on the boat. Although recommended in my training, it just is not practical (and its a pain) to open the head and dry off the sensors, etc in betwen dives. If this gets taken care of, this would be one excellent unit. __________________ Mike Luzansky H2O Photo Pros Underwater Photo & Video Visit our New Showroom 2429 W. Coast Hwy, #101 Newport Beach, CA 92663
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