Cell warning !!

***EBT*** · 8th January 2006, 22:04

Think batch failure problems.....

Drmike · 9th January 2006, 03:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by James Appel)

Why is it not a good idea to change all 3 cells at the same time? I was planning to change all 3 cells when they reached 12 months old, is this not a good idea (even if they are working well).

When the new cells age and fail you can have all three failing at the same time. If your not flushing at 6m to check for current limiting you may never find out until you tox that they are all current limited.

Having cells of different age makes it far less likely all 3 will fail at the same rate. So the good cell(s) will highlight that some are current limited.

May I ask you if this was covered in your training? I only ask because Im getting the impression that very little is taught on cell performance/failures on courses - and that really worries me.

Pierre Farrugia · 19th January 2006, 09:37

Hello,

Just finished changing the molex crimps for the sensor plugs and that involved a lot of @#$%

. Also people trying to solder the wire first take great care to how much you heat the wire as this in no time at all the insulation will shrink back and deform! And I was using a 25W soldering iron so low power and in order to do them with damage the insulation is to solder them very fast 2sec max!! Will tell you how it goes underwater and hopefully on the long run! I even applied a coat of plastic spray and just hope it does not kill me when underwater, left electronics open to vent the smell!

***jradomski*** · 19th January 2006, 09:59

Quote: (Originally Posted by Pierre Farrugia)

Also people trying to solder the wire first take great care to how much you heat the wire as this in no time at all the insulation will shrink back and deform! !

if you tinned the wire before crimping (which is MUCH better than actually soldering the connector to the wire), the melting/deforming isn't a bad thing it "seals" the wire..

Pierre Farrugia · 19th January 2006, 10:37

Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski)

if you tinned the wire before crimping (which is MUCH better than actually soldering the connector to the wire), the melting/deforming isn't a bad thing it "seals" the wire..

Joe,

I soldered the wire before crimping, being a technician myself I know what you mean but the problem with the wire used in my YBOD, it just gets shorter by 2-3mm and opens up, instead of mealting and bonding to the wire! With other wire just happens what you are saying but not with this one.

***jradomski*** · 19th January 2006, 12:03

Quote: (Originally Posted by Pierre Farrugia)

Joe,

I soldered the wire before crimping, being a technician myself I know what you mean but the problem with the wire used in my YBOD, it just gets shorter by 2-3mm and opens up, instead of mealting and bonding to the wire! With other wire just happens what you are saying but not with this one.

They must have changed wire (or maybe its my temp controlled soldering station) because I have done this in the past.. I just tin the wire with a tin/silver solder then crimp the connector onto the tinned wire.. I never had the problem of the insulator shrinking away..

Genesis · 19th January 2006, 12:52

The manufacturer should be using 100% tinned wire in the first place - if they did it would fail FAR less often.

This is a "marine environment" - go ask anyone who works on boats what the correct wire is to use in such an environment.

8th January 2006, 22:04	#31 (permalink)
*EBT* Apprentice Luddite Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK, Brighton Posts: 1,932	Re: Cell warning !! Think batch failure problems..... __________________ Eagles May Soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Rebreather World Terms of service Real diving t-shirts for real divers
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9th January 2006, 03:47	#32 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,161	Re: Cell warning !! Quote: (Originally Posted by James Appel) Why is it not a good idea to change all 3 cells at the same time? I was planning to change all 3 cells when they reached 12 months old, is this not a good idea (even if they are working well). When the new cells age and fail you can have all three failing at the same time. If your not flushing at 6m to check for current limiting you may never find out until you tox that they are all current limited. Having cells of different age makes it far less likely all 3 will fail at the same rate. So the good cell(s) will highlight that some are current limited. May I ask you if this was covered in your training? I only ask because Im getting the impression that very little is taught on cell performance/failures on courses - and that really worries me. __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment Last edited by Drmike : 9th January 2006 at 03:50.
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19th January 2006, 09:37	#33 (permalink)
Pierre Farrugia Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Malta Posts: 636	Re: Cell warning !! Hello, Just finished changing the molex crimps for the sensor plugs and that involved a lot of @#$% . Also people trying to solder the wire first take great care to how much you heat the wire as this in no time at all the insulation will shrink back and deform! And I was using a 25W soldering iron so low power and in order to do them with damage the insulation is to solder them very fast 2sec max!! Will tell you how it goes underwater and hopefully on the long run! I even applied a coat of plastic spray and just hope it does not kill me when underwater, left electronics open to vent the smell! __________________ Pierre Farrugia My wife told me " If you don't quit diving I'm going to leave you" My reply " God, I'll miss you" www.atlam.org www.divemed.com
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19th January 2006, 09:59	#34 (permalink)
*jradomski* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Optima rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: "Da" Bronx Posts: 2,896	Re: Cell warning !! Quote: (Originally Posted by Pierre Farrugia) Also people trying to solder the wire first take great care to how much you heat the wire as this in no time at all the insulation will shrink back and deform! ! if you tinned the wire before crimping (which is MUCH better than actually soldering the connector to the wire), the melting/deforming isn't a bad thing it "seals" the wire.. __________________ Joe Radomski CCR Trimix Instructor Trainer ANDI Instructor Trainer Director #10 All posts are personal opinions and DO NOT reflect any affiliated agency unless specifically stated.
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19th January 2006, 10:37	#35 (permalink)
Pierre Farrugia Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Malta Posts: 636	Re: Cell warning !! Quote: (Originally Posted by jradomski) if you tinned the wire before crimping (which is MUCH better than actually soldering the connector to the wire), the melting/deforming isn't a bad thing it "seals" the wire.. Joe, I soldered the wire before crimping, being a technician myself I know what you mean but the problem with the wire used in my YBOD, it just gets shorter by 2-3mm and opens up, instead of mealting and bonding to the wire! With other wire just happens what you are saying but not with this one. __________________ Pierre Farrugia My wife told me " If you don't quit diving I'm going to leave you" My reply " God, I'll miss you" www.atlam.org www.divemed.com
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19th January 2006, 12:03	#36 (permalink)
*jradomski* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Optima rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Megalodon Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: "Da" Bronx Posts: 2,896	Re: Cell warning !! Quote: (Originally Posted by Pierre Farrugia) Joe, I soldered the wire before crimping, being a technician myself I know what you mean but the problem with the wire used in my YBOD, it just gets shorter by 2-3mm and opens up, instead of mealting and bonding to the wire! With other wire just happens what you are saying but not with this one. They must have changed wire (or maybe its my temp controlled soldering station) because I have done this in the past.. I just tin the wire with a tin/silver solder then crimp the connector onto the tinned wire.. I never had the problem of the insulator shrinking away.. __________________ Joe Radomski CCR Trimix Instructor Trainer ANDI Instructor Trainer Director #10 All posts are personal opinions and DO NOT reflect any affiliated agency unless specifically stated.
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19th January 2006, 12:52	#37 (permalink)
Genesis Bubbless Box of Death Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Home Build Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Sunny Florida Posts: 1,394	Re: Cell warning !! The manufacturer should be using 100% tinned wire in the first place - if they did it would fail FAR less often. This is a "marine environment" - go ask anyone who works on boats what the correct wire is to use in such an environment.
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