Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant…

Brainx3 · 22nd March 2008, 14:42

Hi,

Not if you go by the rules and remember to do so all the time. As you mentioned before that humans are unreliable in many points and MEMORY fails the person from time to time so stick to check list and update your information but once again what's important STICK TO STANDARDS AND DO'NT DO ANYTHING foolish.

Best Regards. Wael

Drmike · 22nd March 2008, 14:47

Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3)

STICK TO STANDARDS AND DO'NT DO ANYTHING foolish.

so hows relying on people to follow that method been working so far?

Brainx3 · 22nd March 2008, 14:53

Hi,

If people REALLY did that all the time then we would have seen another type accidents' reports. Some people really want to enforce safety standards and regulations while others choose to go whinning about how life is not good enough for everyone. You don't go to school to take a degree sweetheart, as you go to learn first.

Best Regards. Wael

Drmike · 22nd March 2008, 14:56

Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3)

Hi,

If people REALLY did that all the time then we would have seen another type accidents' reports. Some people really want to enforce safety standards and regulations while others choose to go whinning about how life is not good enough for everyone. You don't go to school to take a degree sweetheart, as you go to learn first.

Best Regards. Wael

think i need to go to school to work out what your talking about as I dont understand your post at all

Brainx3 · 22nd March 2008, 15:00

Hi,

Well, according to your logic then even kids in school will need to be selected to see whether they are smart enough to be able to take the level of learning before they start with it or maybe if they really NEED to learn in the first place?! But I guess you are more like a diving journalist.

Best Regards. Wael

Drmike · 22nd March 2008, 15:06

Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3)

Hi,

Well, according to your logic then even kids in school will need to be selected to see whether they are smart enough to be able to take the level of learning before they start with it or maybe if they really NEED to learn in the first place?! But I guess you are more like a diving journalist.

Best Regards. Wael

ah now I understand - you were just talking nonsense

and missunderstanding my logic

Why create a (flawed) analogy when the concept is so simple to understand. but anyway FWIW Kids in school are selected to see whether they are smart enough to take the level of learning before they start...its called school entry exams. not that any of that has anything to do with creating an atmosphere where unecessary use of higher risk equipment is volentarily discouraged by the community

Quote:

I guess you are more like a diving journalist

you lost me again. what does this mean?

Brainx3 · 22nd March 2008, 15:28

Hi,

Well, kids start schools according to their age the age, but again maybe they will need to have a real NEED to do so according to you? So maybe schools should start asking kids about their motives before they accept enrolling them. Diving journalist mean that you seem to like talk the talk but you don't seem to walk the walk. Anyhow, you should be more practically contructive.

Best Regards. Wael

Drmike · 22nd March 2008, 15:34

Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3)

maybe schools should start asking kids about their motives before they accept enrolling them.

schools (universities) that run specialised courses do exactly that. and again this is a crap and unecessary analogy

Quote:

Diving journalist mean that you seem to like talk the talk but you don't seem to walk the walk.

Still not getting it. Are you suggesting I dont dive enough? lol!

OceanOpportunity · 22nd March 2008, 15:35

last time I checked, people were pre-screened before going to school..at least college.

Dive!Dive! · 22nd March 2008, 15:50

OK, I should maybe start this in a separate thread, but its reading this one thats prompted the idea. Apologies in advance if its been asked before.
One of the things that is very hard to find is a comprehensive list of things that could go wrong with a specific rebreather, ideally backed up with specifics where they actually have gone wrong. This community must have the data out there. I think I understand my unit reasonably well, but I am not an engineer or Rebreather designer, so there are bound to be things I haven't even thought of.
I don't mean the generic things like Solenoid stuck open, current limited cells etc.
For example, I dive a Meg. I know (Thanks Dr Mike) that if my cells fall apart, I have a good chance of bypass. That's Meg specific and I do something about it by checking them every time I put the head together. The solenoid pipe can work loose from the head. So I check it periodcially and do bubble checks. There is lots of data on the battery bounce phenomenon on the Inspo classic - I dont think this can happen on a Meg in the same way but what else could go wrong ? Are there any actual instances of Meg handsets hanging. I've never seen them but I'm sure it could happen
Can we build such a list or will everyone be defensive about their units ? I for one am not and want to know all the potential problems, because as we know , none of the current units are perfect.
Cheers
Steve

22nd March 2008, 14:42	#31 (permalink)
Brainx3 Totally Submerged Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: International Waters Posts: 292	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Hi, Not if you go by the rules and remember to do so all the time. As you mentioned before that humans are unreliable in many points and MEMORY fails the person from time to time so stick to check list and update your information but once again what's important STICK TO STANDARDS AND DO'NT DO ANYTHING foolish. Best Regards. Wael __________________ The depth of life cannot be measured in Bars, nor can the sea of lies, that lies within. Sooner or later I'll be cracking your market and end your game. *I don't take crap for an answer...*
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 14:47	#32 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,322	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3) STICK TO STANDARDS AND DO'NT DO ANYTHING foolish. so hows relying on people to follow that method been working so far? __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
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22nd March 2008, 14:53	#33 (permalink)
Brainx3 Totally Submerged Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: International Waters Posts: 292	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Hi, If people REALLY did that all the time then we would have seen another type accidents' reports. Some people really want to enforce safety standards and regulations while others choose to go whinning about how life is not good enough for everyone. You don't go to school to take a degree sweetheart, as you go to learn first. Best Regards. Wael __________________ The depth of life cannot be measured in Bars, nor can the sea of lies, that lies within. Sooner or later I'll be cracking your market and end your game. *I don't take crap for an answer...*
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 14:56	#34 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,322	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3) Hi, If people REALLY did that all the time then we would have seen another type accidents' reports. Some people really want to enforce safety standards and regulations while others choose to go whinning about how life is not good enough for everyone. You don't go to school to take a degree sweetheart, as you go to learn first. Best Regards. Wael think i need to go to school to work out what your talking about as I dont understand your post at all __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 15:00	#35 (permalink)
Brainx3 Totally Submerged Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: International Waters Posts: 292	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Hi, Well, according to your logic then even kids in school will need to be selected to see whether they are smart enough to be able to take the level of learning before they start with it or maybe if they really NEED to learn in the first place?! But I guess you are more like a diving journalist. Best Regards. Wael __________________ The depth of life cannot be measured in Bars, nor can the sea of lies, that lies within. Sooner or later I'll be cracking your market and end your game. *I don't take crap for an answer...*
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 15:06	#36 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,322	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3) Hi, Well, according to your logic then even kids in school will need to be selected to see whether they are smart enough to be able to take the level of learning before they start with it or maybe if they really NEED to learn in the first place?! But I guess you are more like a diving journalist. Best Regards. Wael ah now I understand - you were just talking nonsense and missunderstanding my logic Why create a (flawed) analogy when the concept is so simple to understand. but anyway FWIW Kids in school are selected to see whether they are smart enough to take the level of learning before they start...its called school entry exams. not that any of that has anything to do with creating an atmosphere where unecessary use of higher risk equipment is volentarily discouraged by the community Quote: I guess you are more like a diving journalist you lost me again. what does this mean? __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment Last edited by Drmike : 22nd March 2008 at 15:22.
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 15:28	#37 (permalink)
Brainx3 Totally Submerged Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: International Waters Posts: 292	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Hi, Well, kids start schools according to their age the age, but again maybe they will need to have a real NEED to do so according to you? So maybe schools should start asking kids about their motives before they accept enrolling them. Diving journalist mean that you seem to like talk the talk but you don't seem to walk the walk. Anyhow, you should be more practically contructive. Best Regards. Wael __________________ The depth of life cannot be measured in Bars, nor can the sea of lies, that lies within. Sooner or later I'll be cracking your market and end your game. *I don't take crap for an answer...*
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 15:34	#38 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,322	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… Quote: (Originally Posted by Brainx3) maybe schools should start asking kids about their motives before they accept enrolling them. schools (universities) that run specialised courses do exactly that. and again this is a crap and unecessary analogy Quote: Diving journalist mean that you seem to like talk the talk but you don't seem to walk the walk. Still not getting it. Are you suggesting I dont dive enough? lol! __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

22nd March 2008, 15:35	#39 (permalink)
OceanOpportunity for a world of water Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Home Build Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Providence, RI USA Posts: 543	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… last time I checked, people were pre-screened before going to school..at least college. __________________ Michael Lombardi Oceans of Opportunity www.oceanopportunity.com Elected Director, Society for Human Performance in Extreme Environments MN'07, The Explorers Club Project Manager, Diving a Dream
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22nd March 2008, 15:50	#40 (permalink)
Dive!Dive! Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Somerset, UK Posts: 94	Re: Taking Responsibility for Complacency – A short rant… OK, I should maybe start this in a separate thread, but its reading this one thats prompted the idea. Apologies in advance if its been asked before. One of the things that is very hard to find is a comprehensive list of things that could go wrong with a specific rebreather, ideally backed up with specifics where they actually have gone wrong. This community must have the data out there. I think I understand my unit reasonably well, but I am not an engineer or Rebreather designer, so there are bound to be things I haven't even thought of. I don't mean the generic things like Solenoid stuck open, current limited cells etc. For example, I dive a Meg. I know (Thanks Dr Mike) that if my cells fall apart, I have a good chance of bypass. That's Meg specific and I do something about it by checking them every time I put the head together. The solenoid pipe can work loose from the head. So I check it periodcially and do bubble checks. There is lots of data on the battery bounce phenomenon on the Inspo classic - I dont think this can happen on a Meg in the same way but what else could go wrong ? Are there any actual instances of Meg handsets hanging. I've never seen them but I'm sure it could happen Can we build such a list or will everyone be defensive about their units ? I for one am not and want to know all the potential problems, because as we know , none of the current units are perfect. Cheers Steve
(Offline)

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