15.5 or Borris???????????

Drmike · 19th August 2007, 20:14

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dave Sutton)

Yet all of these features can be retrofitted to a Mark-15 in one way or another... either by an electronics package change or some faitrly simple pneumatics mods.

Mark-15 is far more field maintainable, and in the long run, my bet is that they will still be in service long after the 'Boris is a curiousity.
Think of the divers who "upgraded" to a CIS... and now the CIS is passe', but the Mark-15 is still an icon. There's a reason for that.

Dave

I agree the very well engineered MK15.5 design and the robust simplicity of the unit will ensure it outlives most units Im sure.

Now Boris electronics in a mk15.5? You would have to fight back the buyers!

dive2dive2000 · 19th August 2007, 20:16

Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike)

Theres one in my gear room at home

Best electronics ever put in a MK15.5 imho (ie the only electronics that ever actually worked

)

My buddy uses Colkans electronics in his MK15.5 which seam to work fine

As for the boris v mk15.5 debate I still have my MK15.5 - what does that tell you?

Both are very good units for big dives. I like them both equally. Boris has good electronics and MK15.5 is more robust/simpler

Boris is a tad bigger and heavier than mk15.5 but hey I just dug my way into (and out of when the bank fell in behind me) upstream Cow springs N. florida wearing Boris so size isnt everything :-)

Fins make good shovels

Wow, C'mn Dr Mike Don't leave us hanging where is the dive report?

sorry for the hijack

Drmike · 19th August 2007, 21:18

Quote: (Originally Posted by dive2dive2000)

Wow, C'mn Dr Mike Don't leave us hanging where is the dive report?

sorry for the hijack

Um no report - cos nothing much happened. Expected Id have to dig out too as it was falling in behind me.

**Dave Sutton** · 19th August 2007, 21:28

Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike)

I agree the very well engineered MK15.5 design and the robust simplicity of the unit will ensure it outlives most units Im sure.

Now Boris electronics in a mk15.5? You would have to fight back the buyers!

Agreed, which was the first thing I thought when I saw Frankie's 'Boris.... I *really* like the buddy PP02 display, not for my buddy, but for setup on the bench. Pretty neat stuff.

But the 'Boris electronics functionality can be fairly well duplicated into a Mark-15 with off the shelf stuff. I already have offboard 02 and diluent quick connect fittings installed on my shoulders. The Colkan pods are reliable and robust, and do *exactly* what they are designed to do without fanfare. The 4th cell feeding my VR-3 adds deco function and (yet another) layer of redundancy to an already failure-tolerant electronics architecture, and all I'm really missing is a HUD. Think I "might" swap out the VR-3 for a Shearwater with HUD.... then it would basically do it all. What else? Not sure.... between the two we're picking nits. Mark-15's var widely in quality (of restoration), modification status, and electronics installation, so purchase of one is problematic.... in fact mine is the only one like it in the world, and is the best one (for me), and could not be duplicated thru direct purchase from anyone.... and every Mark-15 owner thinks exactly the same thing. Very few are identical. Purchase of a 'Boris is like picking an apple out of a barrel: Reach in and get one.

Po-Tay-Toes, Po-Tah-Toes. To-May-Toes, To-Mah-Toes: We're talking insignificant stuff here from a "better or best" standpoint.

Dave

aknelson · 20th August 2007, 02:53

The Boris has the electronics and the automation are what you really need.
I had no issues with the electronics.
What I like is the power system just using regular 1.5 V Batteries. So no issues with batteries however when the batteries get low the unit will nag you enough to change the batteries... And this after a week and plus of diving

So the The only comment I have is regarding the screen and what it shows.
at what time. So there is improvement possible and this what is going on.

Andreas

MatV · 20th August 2007, 10:55

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dave Sutton)

Mark-15 is far more field maintainable, and in the long run, my bet is that they will still be in service long after the 'Boris is a curiousity.
............

Dave

Dave, the point is that most divers today don't won't to maintain, they want to be entertained.....

greets,
Matthias

Drmike · 20th August 2007, 16:58

Quote: (Originally Posted by MatV)

Dave, the point is that most divers today don't won't to maintain, they want to be entertained.....

greets,
Matthias

personally i want a unit thats EASY to maintain/fix in the field so you can continuie to be entertained- thats the point i think daves making

If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one.

MatV · 20th August 2007, 21:44

Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike)

personally i want a unit thats EASY to maintain/fix in the field so you can continuie to be entertained- thats the point i think daves making

If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one.

I was not alluding to Mk 15 qualities, but to consumer mentality in general.

Matthias

decoweenie · 21st August 2007, 12:18

Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike)

If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one.

Uhmmm...

**Dave Sutton** · 21st August 2007, 12:48

Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie)

Uhmmm...

Mark-15 operators working with *good quality* Mark-15's enjoy excellent reliability.... and any variation in repliability is going to be at the electronics side, not the mechanical side. None of the mechanical aspects are in question. None need routine maintenance. Shit, looking at military issue ones, it looks like none get *any* maintenance at all...... In the oil field, we never opened them up other than to change 'sorb, gas, and batteries.

Now, as for electronics? "Actual quality may vary", to say the very least. The more deviation from the milspec electronics, the more likely the problem. The closer to the original milspec..... the less problems. I'm still liking my REV-G analog pod, I have to tell ya. It always works. Leave the deco and other magic to another system. My PP02 is all I want my PP02 controller to worry about.

Dave

.

19th August 2007, 20:14	#21 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,300	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Dave Sutton) Yet all of these features can be retrofitted to a Mark-15 in one way or another... either by an electronics package change or some faitrly simple pneumatics mods. Mark-15 is far more field maintainable, and in the long run, my bet is that they will still be in service long after the 'Boris is a curiousity. Think of the divers who "upgraded" to a CIS... and now the CIS is passe', but the Mark-15 is still an icon. There's a reason for that. Dave I agree the very well engineered MK15.5 design and the robust simplicity of the unit will ensure it outlives most units Im sure. Now Boris electronics in a mk15.5? You would have to fight back the buyers! __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

19th August 2007, 20:16	#22 (permalink)
dive2dive2000 PRISM DIVER & LUVIN IT! Current Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 793	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike) Theres one in my gear room at home Best electronics ever put in a MK15.5 imho (ie the only electronics that ever actually worked ) My buddy uses Colkans electronics in his MK15.5 which seam to work fine As for the boris v mk15.5 debate I still have my MK15.5 - what does that tell you? Both are very good units for big dives. I like them both equally. Boris has good electronics and MK15.5 is more robust/simpler Boris is a tad bigger and heavier than mk15.5 but hey I just dug my way into (and out of when the bank fell in behind me) upstream Cow springs N. florida wearing Boris so size isnt everything :-) Fins make good shovels Wow, C'mn Dr Mike Don't leave us hanging where is the dive report? sorry for the hijack __________________ Safe Diving, Martin
(Offline)

19th August 2007, 21:18	#23 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,300	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by dive2dive2000) Wow, C'mn Dr Mike Don't leave us hanging where is the dive report? sorry for the hijack Um no report - cos nothing much happened. Expected Id have to dig out too as it was falling in behind me. __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

19th August 2007, 21:28	#24 (permalink)
Dave Sutton Diveshop of Horrors Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Narragansett, Rhode Island and Hackettstown, New Jersey Posts: 2,688	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike) I agree the very well engineered MK15.5 design and the robust simplicity of the unit will ensure it outlives most units Im sure. Now Boris electronics in a mk15.5? You would have to fight back the buyers! Agreed, which was the first thing I thought when I saw Frankie's 'Boris.... I really like the buddy PP02 display, not for my buddy, but for setup on the bench. Pretty neat stuff. But the 'Boris electronics functionality can be fairly well duplicated into a Mark-15 with off the shelf stuff. I already have offboard 02 and diluent quick connect fittings installed on my shoulders. The Colkan pods are reliable and robust, and do exactly what they are designed to do without fanfare. The 4th cell feeding my VR-3 adds deco function and (yet another) layer of redundancy to an already failure-tolerant electronics architecture, and all I'm really missing is a HUD. Think I "might" swap out the VR-3 for a Shearwater with HUD.... then it would basically do it all. What else? Not sure.... between the two we're picking nits. Mark-15's var widely in quality (of restoration), modification status, and electronics installation, so purchase of one is problematic.... in fact mine is the only one like it in the world, and is the best one (for me), and could not be duplicated thru direct purchase from anyone.... and every Mark-15 owner thinks exactly the same thing. Very few are identical. Purchase of a 'Boris is like picking an apple out of a barrel: Reach in and get one. Po-Tay-Toes, Po-Tah-Toes. To-May-Toes, To-Mah-Toes: We're talking insignificant stuff here from a "better or best" standpoint. Dave __________________ "Changes in Lattitudes, Changes in Attitudes, Nothing remains quite the same".... www.nobubblediving.com
(Online)

20th August 2007, 02:53	#25 (permalink)
aknelson New Member Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Dolphin Other Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Dolphin Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 78	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? The Boris has the electronics and the automation are what you really need. I had no issues with the electronics. What I like is the power system just using regular 1.5 V Batteries. So no issues with batteries however when the batteries get low the unit will nag you enough to change the batteries... And this after a week and plus of diving So the The only comment I have is regarding the screen and what it shows. at what time. So there is improvement possible and this what is going on. Andreas
(Offline)

20th August 2007, 10:55	#26 (permalink)
MatV New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Ray Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Ray Other SCR Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Germayn Posts: 15	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Dave Sutton) Mark-15 is far more field maintainable, and in the long run, my bet is that they will still be in service long after the 'Boris is a curiousity. ............ Dave Dave, the point is that most divers today don't won't to maintain, they want to be entertained..... greets, Matthias
(Offline)

20th August 2007, 16:58	#27 (permalink)
Drmike Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Ouroboros Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 3,300	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by MatV) Dave, the point is that most divers today don't won't to maintain, they want to be entertained..... greets, Matthias personally i want a unit thats EASY to maintain/fix in the field so you can continuie to be entertained- thats the point i think daves making If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one. __________________ Cave diving is a sport Wreck diving is a sport Diving in general is a sport 'Rebreather diving' is not a sport its the delusional obsession with a highly dangerous and often inappropriate piece of equipment
(Offline)

20th August 2007, 21:44	#28 (permalink)
MatV New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Ray Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Dolphin Ray Other SCR Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Germayn Posts: 15	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike) personally i want a unit thats EASY to maintain/fix in the field so you can continuie to be entertained- thats the point i think daves making If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one. I was not alluding to Mk 15 qualities, but to consumer mentality in general. Matthias
(Offline)

21st August 2007, 12:18	#29 (permalink)
decoweenie Crash Test Dummy Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Cairo Posts: 5,510	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by Drmike) If your suggesting a m15.5 is high maintenance - you clearly havent ever owned one. Uhmmm... __________________ "...after a while you get bored offering advice to a bull that like to keep butting the fence with its head rather than walking through the open gate..." - Rebreather World PM
(Offline)

21st August 2007, 12:48	#30 (permalink)
Dave Sutton Diveshop of Horrors Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Narragansett, Rhode Island and Hackettstown, New Jersey Posts: 2,688	Re: 15.5 or Borris??????????? Quote: (Originally Posted by decoweenie) Uhmmm... Mark-15 operators working with good quality Mark-15's enjoy excellent reliability.... and any variation in repliability is going to be at the electronics side, not the mechanical side. None of the mechanical aspects are in question. None need routine maintenance. Shit, looking at military issue ones, it looks like none get any maintenance at all...... In the oil field, we never opened them up other than to change 'sorb, gas, and batteries. Now, as for electronics? "Actual quality may vary", to say the very least. The more deviation from the milspec electronics, the more likely the problem. The closer to the original milspec..... the less problems. I'm still liking my REV-G analog pod, I have to tell ya. It always works. Leave the deco and other magic to another system. My PP02 is all I want my PP02 controller to worry about. Dave . __________________ "Changes in Lattitudes, Changes in Attitudes, Nothing remains quite the same".... www.nobubblediving.com
(Online)

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