Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water???

Icarusflies · 3rd April 2007, 10:52

Hello All;

I would like to have the opinion of experienced divers and instructors about BOV's if not using FFM in warm water. Do you believe it brings an additional failure point and without FFM it does not give a safety advantage?

What would be an alternative.....how about power inflator / octo type of device ?

Thanks;

Ben Field · 3rd April 2007, 11:51

Hiya, IMVHO a BOV is a safety feature used on its own or with a FFM... there is very little in one to add much risk of failure anyway, its only a reg in most cases!

The Air2/Autoair combined inflators/regs tend to be far more troublesome than any BOV I've heard of, they tend to leak gas even when freshly tuned.

You can't beat the BOV when its comes to ease and speed of Bailing out, something alot of people who've had CO2 hits or floods have said is that they felt incapable of holding their breath to change regs, BOV is a 1 second operation and you keep it in your mouth the whole time.

Just out of interest what is your reason for not wanting one?

dive safe,
BEN

Icarusflies · 3rd April 2007, 12:02

Hi Ben;
The main reason is a conversation with an instructor who recommends an Air2/autoair type of set up. My first reaction was to get a BOV but now I am in doubt.

***Decodiver*** · 3rd April 2007, 12:35

I do not like the Autoair, anything that can freeflow at will and deplete your diluent is not too good an idea.

A BOV is a good thing, but when I have used them, I have always plugged them into an offboard gas.

Cheers,

Dave Cooper.

iani · 3rd April 2007, 12:39

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field)

You can't beat the BOV when its comes to ease and speed of Bailing out,

Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV

Ian

Sutty · 3rd April 2007, 12:51

Quote: (Originally Posted by iani)

Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV

Ian

Interesting!.... BUT if you have a CO2 problem could you just nose-breathe with the higher resistances that entails? I tend to feel a bit short-of-breath just walking up a few flights of stairs whilst eating!

Neil

Scubascooby · 3rd April 2007, 12:56

Thats' a clever idea but if you are about to suffer a CO2 ir O2 hit, is it
very easy to switch breathing method ? Being a FFM,you might be
able to close your mouth.

Once a BOV is switched, the pressure is off.

Ben Field · 3rd April 2007, 13:59

Quote: (Originally Posted by iani)

Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV

I meant with a seperate reg or autoair type device.... anyway nose breathing on a FFM is cheating

and you won't be inclined to do it with a mouthful of CO2 loop or caustic cocktail I'd wager...

Maybe someone should invent the AutoBOV, it switchs to OC when it detects low or high PPO2, and increase in CO2 or caustic goo flooding the inhale hose!

iani · 3rd April 2007, 14:26

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field)

I meant with a seperate reg or autoair type device.... anyway nose breathing on a FFM is cheating

and you won't be inclined to do it with a mouthful of CO2 loop or caustic cocktail I'd wager...

I've done it with a mouthful of cocktail, not pleasant but certainly doable. Ideally I'd have another p-ported 2nd stage so I could remove the CC mouthpiece and swap it over. I find breathing through the nose doesn't give me enough volume and when it starts snotting up..... This system is best for sanity breaths but I wouldn't want to do a long hang on it, luckily I was out in 8 mins or so.

Ian

seafox · 3rd April 2007, 15:29

Quote: (Originally Posted by Decodiver)

I do not like the Autoair, anything that can freeflow at will and deplete your diluent is not too good an idea.

A BOV is a good thing, but when I have used them, I have always plugged them into an offboard gas.

Cheers,

Dave Cooper.

DITTO!

Cornel

3rd April 2007, 10:52	#1 (permalink)
Icarusflies New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Miami Posts: 52	Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Hello All; I would like to have the opinion of experienced divers and instructors about BOV's if not using FFM in warm water. Do you believe it brings an additional failure point and without FFM it does not give a safety advantage? What would be an alternative.....how about power inflator / octo type of device ? Thanks;
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3rd April 2007, 11:51	#2 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,452	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Hiya, IMVHO a BOV is a safety feature used on its own or with a FFM... there is very little in one to add much risk of failure anyway, its only a reg in most cases! The Air2/Autoair combined inflators/regs tend to be far more troublesome than any BOV I've heard of, they tend to leak gas even when freshly tuned. You can't beat the BOV when its comes to ease and speed of Bailing out, something alot of people who've had CO2 hits or floods have said is that they felt incapable of holding their breath to change regs, BOV is a 1 second operation and you keep it in your mouth the whole time. Just out of interest what is your reason for not wanting one? dive safe, BEN __________________ www.hugsac.org.uk Beware Fridge Suck
(Online)

3rd April 2007, 12:02	#3 (permalink)
Icarusflies New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Miami Posts: 52	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Hi Ben; The main reason is a conversation with an instructor who recommends an Air2/autoair type of set up. My first reaction was to get a BOV but now I am in doubt.
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3rd April 2007, 12:35	#4 (permalink)
*Decodiver* Administrator Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Ouroboros rEvo Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Sport Kiss Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Geneva Posts: 2,164	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? I do not like the Autoair, anything that can freeflow at will and deplete your diluent is not too good an idea. A BOV is a good thing, but when I have used them, I have always plugged them into an offboard gas. Cheers, Dave Cooper. __________________ CCR/OC Trimix Instructor Trainer CCR Training to Mixed Gas in Switzerland, France, UK & Germany on Megalodon/COPIS-Megalodon/KISS/Sport KISS/Ouroboros/rEvo/Inspiration/Evolution/Sentinel www.zerogravitydiving.com Rebreather World Terms & Conditions
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3rd April 2007, 12:39	#5 (permalink)
iani Nefarious Activist Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Middlesex, UK Posts: 334	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field) You can't beat the BOV when its comes to ease and speed of Bailing out, Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV Ian
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3rd April 2007, 12:51	#6 (permalink)
Sutty Classic Kiss diver Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Glossop, Derbyshire, UK Posts: 763	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Quote: (Originally Posted by iani) Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV Ian Interesting!.... BUT if you have a CO2 problem could you just nose-breathe with the higher resistances that entails? I tend to feel a bit short-of-breath just walking up a few flights of stairs whilst eating! Neil __________________ Never forget that life is a finite resource.
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3rd April 2007, 12:56	#7 (permalink)
Scubascooby Better Off Out of the EU Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Great Britain Posts: 324	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Thats' a clever idea but if you are about to suffer a CO2 ir O2 hit, is it very easy to switch breathing method ? Being a FFM,you might be able to close your mouth. Once a BOV is switched, the pressure is off. __________________ "dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"
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3rd April 2007, 13:59	#8 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,452	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Quote: (Originally Posted by iani) Oh yes you can, panorama Nova FFM, just breathe through your nose to get OC gas, no lever to turn as with a BOV I meant with a seperate reg or autoair type device.... anyway nose breathing on a FFM is cheating and you won't be inclined to do it with a mouthful of CO2 loop or caustic cocktail I'd wager... Maybe someone should invent the AutoBOV, it switchs to OC when it detects low or high PPO2, and increase in CO2 or caustic goo flooding the inhale hose! __________________ www.hugsac.org.uk Beware Fridge Suck
(Online)

3rd April 2007, 14:26	#9 (permalink)
iani Nefarious Activist Current Rebreather/s: Ouroboros Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Middlesex, UK Posts: 334	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field) I meant with a seperate reg or autoair type device.... anyway nose breathing on a FFM is cheating and you won't be inclined to do it with a mouthful of CO2 loop or caustic cocktail I'd wager... I've done it with a mouthful of cocktail, not pleasant but certainly doable. Ideally I'd have another p-ported 2nd stage so I could remove the CC mouthpiece and swap it over. I find breathing through the nose doesn't give me enough volume and when it starts snotting up..... This system is best for sanity breaths but I wouldn't want to do a long hang on it, luckily I was out in 8 mins or so. Ian
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3rd April 2007, 15:29	#10 (permalink)
seafox 02ptima Instructor Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: TORONTO, CANADA -Have "02ptima" will travel! Posts: 172	Re: Advantage of BOV without FFM in warm water??? Quote: (Originally Posted by Decodiver) I do not like the Autoair, anything that can freeflow at will and deplete your diluent is not too good an idea. A BOV is a good thing, but when I have used them, I have always plugged them into an offboard gas. Cheers, Dave Cooper. DITTO! Cornel __________________ Protect the SHARKS! Excellence is never an accident; it is always the result of high intention, sincere effort, intelligent direction, skillful execution and the vision to see obstacles as opportunities. Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards!
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