Nitrox cylinder valves

Scubascooby

Only of interest to the British.

Please take a moment to have a look at:

Petition to: prevent changes to the current regulations on scuba cylinder valves.


Thanks.

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"dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"

Stephane

I can't sign because I'm french but I fully agree with what is written. (except that the output thread is G5/8 not M25 which is the tank thread ).

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Stéphane
Hammer-rEvo powered!

Philippe GERIN

Fully agree with you guys.
Go get these dum' a$$ eurocrats ! Then you'll create a precedent and we in France can go after them as well and have them tolerate both DIN 200/300bars or G5/8 and M26.
This european law was transposed into the French set of laws overnight without even consulting with the "real" people who are concerned, namely the divers. Good for you, you caught it in time in the UK. Lobby against that non-sense!!!
I'd like to sign a million times but I'm not British and don't even live in the UK. Tell me if I still can. If yes, I'll do.

How's the situation in Spain, Germany, Italy, Belgium and Holland ?

Best
Philippe

Scubascooby

Ooops well spotted. I was reading a couple of articles when I wrote that so
probably got my wires crossed.

Peter

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"dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"

Scubascooby

The petition seems to be doing quite well. Thanks to all those who have voted so far.

If anyone would like to post it on other British fourms then please do unless it has all ready been done.

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"dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"

Scubascooby

There isn't long left now on the Petition so if you haven't yet signed please take a moment to have a look and add your name. It will save you a lot of money and frustration.

Peter

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"dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"

Scubascooby

The petition has now closed with3,441 signatures. I would like to thank everyone who signed. Unfortunately there has not yet been a response from the PM.

There were petitions and campaigns around Europe and it would be good to hear how they have got on.

Hopefully we can make it clear to those voting at the committees that we do not want a different valve for nitrox cylinders and regulators. We have to get the message across to them now, it's no use wating until the vote. If the decision is made we will be stuck with a pointless change of valve and having to discard lots of perfectly good equipment.

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"dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive"

Tim Franks

I have recently written to several MP's and MEP's to protest about these changes. Replies have been varied, as you might expect. I have copied, for your infomation, a reply I received after an MEP asked the HSE for an update;


BS EN 144-3:2003 Incorporating Corrigendum No. 1 - Respiratory protective devices - Gas cylinder valves - Part 3: Outlet connections for diving gases nitrox and oxygen

The above standard is due to be implemented in the UK in August 2008.

HSE did not support the drafting or introduction of BS EN 144-3, on the grounds that it was not necessary to improve safety. However, other CEN members accepted it and the proposal became a European standard.

Standards are not mandatory but provide a means of demonstrating appropriate risk controls have been applied - this may of course be achieved in other equally effective ways. Where a standard such as this for respiratory devices exists, it is open to manufacturers to manufacture such devices according to different standards (including their own standards) provided that the manufacturer can show that those non-standardised devices meet the essential requirements of the Directive.

Whilst this standard is not enshrined in UK legislation, it is now a harmonised European Standard and as such provides guidance to European industry on an accepted means to meet European Directives. Given this status, it is expected that the UK diving industry will comply with it from its implementation date of August 2008 and some diving manufacturers are already producing valves to BS EN 144-3 standard.

Whilst it is not the response I think your constituent was hoping for, I hope it clarifies the position.








I would encourage as many as possible to petition their own MP's and MEP's - even so I doubt that we will have any impact since the 'standard' has already been adopted!

JCdesign97

Requiring nitrox and trimix tanks to have a different valve than air scuba tanks??

This is another reason why we (the USA) have to politely decline being brought under UK rule. Add this as #10 in our reply to John Cleese's letter to the USA ... for those who remember that thread.

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Cheers,

John

Tim Franks

Can I suggest that as many people as possible follow up the on-line petition with individual letters to their MP's, MEP's and the PM.
I have cut pasted (if that's the expression) a copy of the letter/e-mail I have been sending - I'm not precious use it as you like. You can find the relevant addresses by visiting;


Dear, xxxxxxx
scuba divers employ the use of cylinders containing compressed gas to allow them to breath under water. The gas within the cylinders can be air (21% oxygen), or a mix of higher concentrations of oxygen combined with nitrogen (Nitrox) or something similar with the addition of helium (trimix), these mixes are oftern anoxic to allow the diver to operate at greater depths. The mix of gas in the cylinders is pre prepared to suit a particular dive, analysed, and the cylinders are labelled. Divers use the same cylinders for whatever mix they intend to use at that time, since there is an infinite number of mixes available how else could it be done?

Proposed EU changes to SCUBA cylinder valves will require a different sized valve for nitrox and ‘air’ gas mixtures (see BS EN 144-3:2003). This change means that the diver will be required to buy additional cylinders, valves and regulators to suit, in order to differentiate between gasses of 21% oxygen (this would include gases containing less than 21% oxygen) and gases containing 22% oxygen and above. WHY?

I understand that the new standard makes no reference at all to breathing mixes including helium. Not wishing to go into too much detail, this would mean the diver lulled into a false sense of security by the new regulations and believing an M25 valved cylinder must contain ‘air’ may be ‘unpleasantly surprised’ to find it contained a ‘deep’ trimix gas containing insufficient oxygen to support life on the surface or in shallow water.

There are no problems with the current A-clamp and DIN (M25) thread size and it has not been the cause of any incidents.

The proposed EU changes will lead to confusion and increased risk and it is a wholly unnecessary cost that divers and commerce can do without.

The HSE voted against the EU proposal however, the HSE was out-voted and a new standard was created, 'BS EN 144-3:2003'. The standard does not officially become mandatory until August 2008, and it has been suggested that the UK diving industry was hoping the problem would simply go away

‘Adaptors’ to circumvent the regulations are already available to divers; unfortunately these only add additional potential failure points within, what is a life support system, and ought to be avoided.

This is a ridiculous, over simplistic, ill informed and unnecessary piece of legislation which should not be adopted.