Listen up manufacturers

**wedivebc** · 14th November 2008, 16:04

If you are in the business of making computers, RBs with handsets or any other equipment that needs to attach to a diver's wrist this post is for you.
Not all of us dive in tropical water using 3mil wetsuits and bare hands.
Some of us have to wear heavy gloves with dry cuffs. I have found almost every dive computer or Rebreather wristmounted handset lacking in the ease of which they attach or just the shear design of the attachment method. Let me give some specifics:
Hydrospace, your strap is too short and too flimsey. I do like the removeable pins so I can insert some cut off inner tube to replace the crappy strap.

Innerspace The handset on the primary is not bad but its too short for a bulky drysuit with dry cuffs. The velcro does quite reach at least not without doing it up so tight my hand turns purple. Again removeable mount and inner tube is the fix.

Shearwater C'mon Bruce. You dive cold water probably more than most. You must have to get help with your strap. I am sorry to say, your straps are the worst. (nice computer though) The closed design of the computer mount makes installing an innertube loop impossible too.

KISS Again very difficult to use when suiting up with big smurf gloves on but definately long enough and easy to replace with inner tube.

Liquivision X1 Another fine quality product with petite little girley strap. Actually the strap and buckle seem quite strong but the little small buckle and loops are a bitch to maneuver without a helper. This unit also has a closed loop design for the strap mount so no easy way to go with the innertube solution.

All the above mentioned companies make a fine product and obviously have put a lot of thought and effort into producing the high tech equipment we love so much. You all seem to treat the attaching arrangement as an afterthought and seem to put little attention into the ergonomics and usage of it.
At least that is this cold water diver's 2psi worth.

zzzzzzzz · 14th November 2008, 16:13

Surgical tubing still the best bang for the buck for wrist straps. If mfgs are reading, having some way to mount surgical tubing, either with zip ties or other means, knots, mazes...

Surgical tubing stretches more than inner tube (easy to grab and pull over rings with gloves on), is available in all manner of diameters 3/16" dia is nice. Also, it's got some grip! computers don't rotate on the wrist.

**Mark Chase** · 14th November 2008, 16:19

I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D

The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight.

It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad.

ATB

Mark

Gobfish1 · 14th November 2008, 16:27

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D

The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight.

It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad.

ATB

Mark

with mark on this one, I dont find a problem with the straps or the Persuit

paulraymaekers · 14th November 2008, 16:38

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gobfish1)

with mark on this one, I dont find a problem with the straps or the Persuit

only problem I found there was when the strap is complete open till the end, so there is no more 'strap-end' to pull on.

this is easy to solve, so I did: just make 2 holes in the strap a few centimeters from the end of the strap, and put a tye-rap trough them: the strap will only open till it touches the tye-rap, and there will always be a loose end to pull on, even with dry-gloves or thick neoprenes

paul

heyydude · 14th November 2008, 16:39

You didn't mention us, but I'll pop in here anyway...

I remember when the first HH came out, Dave Thompson called me and told me the straps we supplied were way too short. These straps, by the way, were modeled after the original Mark 15 Primary straps - I figured they must have spent some time thinking about this, so who was I to differ?

Not 10 minutes after that, I got a call from another of the "first adopters" of the HH for Inspo bitching about "those damned long straps"!

:D

We now have elastic straps, which are adjustable, but when units come in here for upgrades or repair, we still see them with all sorts of confabulations stuck on them...

Maybe straps are like Harnesses - not everyone likes the same thing (the dreaded "personal preference" of days gone by).

Oh well...

:)

Kevin Juergensen
Juergensen Marine, Inc.

Ben Field · 14th November 2008, 16:51

I dive in coldish UK water with Shearwater GF on Shearwater elastic straps over O'three neoprene suit with no problems, I'd go further to say my computer is rock solid on my arm and the supplied straps are perfect!

Perhaps you have mishaped girlie pipe cleaner arms?

Anyway- straps are straps, you don't like them so just change them out, it's hardly rocket science is it?

silentscuba · 14th November 2008, 17:06

Quote: (Originally Posted by wedivebc)

If you are in the business of making computers, RBs with handsets or any other equipment that needs to attach to a diver's wrist this post is for you.
Not all of us dive in tropical water using 3mil wetsuits and bare hands.
Some of us have to wear heavy gloves with dry cuffs. I have found almost every dive computer or Rebreather wristmounted handset lacking in the ease of which they attach or just the shear design of the attachment method. Let me give some specifics:
Hydrospace, your strap is too short and too flimsey. I do like the removeable pins so I can insert some cut off inner tube to replace the crappy strap.

Innerspace The handset on the primary is not bad but its too short for a bulky drysuit with dry cuffs. The velcro does quite reach at least not without doing it up so tight my hand turns purple. Again removeable mount and inner tube is the fix.

Shearwater C'mon Bruce. You dive cold water probably more than most. You must have to get help with your strap. I am sorry to say, your straps are the worst. (nice computer though) The closed design of the computer mount makes installing an innertube loop impossible too.

KISS Again very difficult to use when suiting up with big smurf gloves on but definately long enough and easy to replace with inner tube.

Liquivision X1 Another fine quality product with petite little girley strap. Actually the strap and buckle seem quite strong but the little small buckle and loops are a bitch to maneuver without a helper. This unit also has a closed loop design for the strap mount so no easy way to go with the innertube solution.

All the above mentioned companies make a fine product and obviously have put a lot of thought and effort into producing the high tech equipment we love so much. You all seem to treat the attaching arrangement as an afterthought and seem to put little attention into the ergonomics and usage of it.
At least that is this cold water diver's 2psi worth.

The straps on the Shearwater Pursuit have now been modified to take care of the type of problem you are talking about.

**wedivebc** · 14th November 2008, 17:10

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D

The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight.

It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad.

ATB

Mark

I don't see any dry cuffs in your avitar pic. The pursuit straps don't extend enough to slip over the cuff and like Paul mentioned if the strap is extended all the way to slide it over there is not enough fabric to grab onto to tighten it. Actually I don't mind the elasticity of the pursuit strap, I guess the length is the biggie.
I have tried lots of different kluges over the years but it seems silly to have several thousand dollars worth of dive gear held on my zip ties and bungie.

silentscuba · 14th November 2008, 17:10

If you have the old type of Shearwater Straps, just put a tye wrap around the end of the pull strap which creates some extended leader that you can now grab onto with your gloves.

That totally and very easily fixes the problem.

14th November 2008, 16:04	#1 (permalink)
wedivebc Dave Tomblin Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 1,699	Listen up manufacturers If you are in the business of making computers, RBs with handsets or any other equipment that needs to attach to a diver's wrist this post is for you. Not all of us dive in tropical water using 3mil wetsuits and bare hands. Some of us have to wear heavy gloves with dry cuffs. I have found almost every dive computer or Rebreather wristmounted handset lacking in the ease of which they attach or just the shear design of the attachment method. Let me give some specifics: Hydrospace, your strap is too short and too flimsey. I do like the removeable pins so I can insert some cut off inner tube to replace the crappy strap. Innerspace The handset on the primary is not bad but its too short for a bulky drysuit with dry cuffs. The velcro does quite reach at least not without doing it up so tight my hand turns purple. Again removeable mount and inner tube is the fix. Shearwater C'mon Bruce. You dive cold water probably more than most. You must have to get help with your strap. I am sorry to say, your straps are the worst. (nice computer though) The closed design of the computer mount makes installing an innertube loop impossible too. KISS Again very difficult to use when suiting up with big smurf gloves on but definately long enough and easy to replace with inner tube. Liquivision X1 Another fine quality product with petite little girley strap. Actually the strap and buckle seem quite strong but the little small buckle and loops are a bitch to maneuver without a helper. This unit also has a closed loop design for the strap mount so no easy way to go with the innertube solution. All the above mentioned companies make a fine product and obviously have put a lot of thought and effort into producing the high tech equipment we love so much. You all seem to treat the attaching arrangement as an afterthought and seem to put little attention into the ergonomics and usage of it. At least that is this cold water diver's 2psi worth. __________________ Cheers, Dave.... www.wedivebc.com
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 16:13	#2 (permalink)
zzzzzzzz Go diving Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Home Build Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Earth Posts: 176	Re: Listen up manufacturers Surgical tubing still the best bang for the buck for wrist straps. If mfgs are reading, having some way to mount surgical tubing, either with zip ties or other means, knots, mazes... Surgical tubing stretches more than inner tube (easy to grab and pull over rings with gloves on), is available in all manner of diameters 3/16" dia is nice. Also, it's got some grip! computers don't rotate on the wrist.
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 16:19	#3 (permalink)
Mark Chase So many CCR So little etc Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Classic Kiss rEvo Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 3,268	Re: Listen up manufacturers I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight. It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad. ATB Mark __________________ See my "Doing It Chasey" video where I'm locked into a padded room, naked, with two ball bearings and within an Hour, I manage to lose one and break the other!!! Kevin Juergensen 16/11/08 [/quote]
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14th November 2008, 16:27	#4 (permalink)
Gobfish1 RBW Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 610	Re: Listen up manufacturers Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight. It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad. ATB Mark with mark on this one, I dont find a problem with the straps or the Persuit Last edited by Gobfish1 : 14th November 2008 at 16:31.
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 16:38	#5 (permalink)
paulraymaekers rEvo's daddy Current Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: rEvo Other CCR Home Build Join Date: May 2005 Location: belgium Posts: 1,997	Re: Listen up manufacturers Quote: (Originally Posted by Gobfish1) with mark on this one, I dont find a problem with the straps or the Persuit only problem I found there was when the strap is complete open till the end, so there is no more 'strap-end' to pull on. this is easy to solve, so I did: just make 2 holes in the strap a few centimeters from the end of the strap, and put a tye-rap trough them: the strap will only open till it touches the tye-rap, and there will always be a loose end to pull on, even with dry-gloves or thick neoprenes paul __________________ www.rEvo-rebreathers.com .... the earth is flat, Elvis is alive, and radial scrubbers give longer dwell time than axials...
(Online)

14th November 2008, 16:39	#6 (permalink)
heyydude King of the Geeks Current Rebreather/s: MK 15.X Optima Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: May 2005 Location: Addison, Pennsylvania Posts: 535	Re: Listen up manufacturers You didn't mention us, but I'll pop in here anyway... I remember when the first HH came out, Dave Thompson called me and told me the straps we supplied were way too short. These straps, by the way, were modeled after the original Mark 15 Primary straps - I figured they must have spent some time thinking about this, so who was I to differ? Not 10 minutes after that, I got a call from another of the "first adopters" of the HH for Inspo bitching about "those damned long straps"! :D We now have elastic straps, which are adjustable, but when units come in here for upgrades or repair, we still see them with all sorts of confabulations stuck on them... Maybe straps are like Harnesses - not everyone likes the same thing (the dreaded "personal preference" of days gone by). Oh well... :) Kevin Juergensen Juergensen Marine, Inc.
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 16:51	#7 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Weymouth, England Posts: 2,009	Re: Listen up manufacturers I dive in coldish UK water with Shearwater GF on Shearwater elastic straps over O'three neoprene suit with no problems, I'd go further to say my computer is rock solid on my arm and the supplied straps are perfect! Perhaps you have mishaped girlie pipe cleaner arms? Anyway- straps are straps, you don't like them so just change them out, it's hardly rocket science is it? __________________ www.aquatec.co.uk www.hugsac.org.uk
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 17:06	#8 (permalink)
silentscuba rEvo CCR Driver Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic rEvo Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Mill Creek, WA USA Posts: 768	Re: Listen up manufacturers Quote: (Originally Posted by wedivebc) If you are in the business of making computers, RBs with handsets or any other equipment that needs to attach to a diver's wrist this post is for you. Not all of us dive in tropical water using 3mil wetsuits and bare hands. Some of us have to wear heavy gloves with dry cuffs. I have found almost every dive computer or Rebreather wristmounted handset lacking in the ease of which they attach or just the shear design of the attachment method. Let me give some specifics: Hydrospace, your strap is too short and too flimsey. I do like the removeable pins so I can insert some cut off inner tube to replace the crappy strap. Innerspace The handset on the primary is not bad but its too short for a bulky drysuit with dry cuffs. The velcro does quite reach at least not without doing it up so tight my hand turns purple. Again removeable mount and inner tube is the fix. Shearwater C'mon Bruce. You dive cold water probably more than most. You must have to get help with your strap. I am sorry to say, your straps are the worst. (nice computer though) The closed design of the computer mount makes installing an innertube loop impossible too. KISS Again very difficult to use when suiting up with big smurf gloves on but definately long enough and easy to replace with inner tube. Liquivision X1 Another fine quality product with petite little girley strap. Actually the strap and buckle seem quite strong but the little small buckle and loops are a bitch to maneuver without a helper. This unit also has a closed loop design for the strap mount so no easy way to go with the innertube solution. All the above mentioned companies make a fine product and obviously have put a lot of thought and effort into producing the high tech equipment we love so much. You all seem to treat the attaching arrangement as an afterthought and seem to put little attention into the ergonomics and usage of it. At least that is this cold water diver's 2psi worth. The straps on the Shearwater Pursuit have now been modified to take care of the type of problem you are talking about. __________________ Curt McNamee rEvo CCR Diver :D KISS CCR Diver www.silentscuba.com
(Online)

14th November 2008, 17:10	#9 (permalink)
wedivebc Dave Tomblin Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Sport Kiss Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Island BC Canada Posts: 1,699	Re: Listen up manufacturers Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) I dont find a problem with the Persuit so much but the old GF house brick spent most of its time underneath my arm :D The straps on the Persuit are dead easy to deel with wearing 5mm semi dry gloves but i never use the clips I just loosen it off to put on then pull tight. It still flops arround a bit but being smaller and lighter than the GF its not too bad. ATB Mark I don't see any dry cuffs in your avitar pic. The pursuit straps don't extend enough to slip over the cuff and like Paul mentioned if the strap is extended all the way to slide it over there is not enough fabric to grab onto to tighten it. Actually I don't mind the elasticity of the pursuit strap, I guess the length is the biggie. I have tried lots of different kluges over the years but it seems silly to have several thousand dollars worth of dive gear held on my zip ties and bungie. __________________ Cheers, Dave.... www.wedivebc.com
(Offline)

14th November 2008, 17:10	#10 (permalink)
silentscuba rEvo CCR Driver Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic rEvo Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Mill Creek, WA USA Posts: 768	Re: Listen up manufacturers If you have the old type of Shearwater Straps, just put a tye wrap around the end of the pull strap which creates some extended leader that you can now grab onto with your gloves. That totally and very easily fixes the problem. __________________ Curt McNamee rEvo CCR Diver :D KISS CCR Diver www.silentscuba.com
(Online)

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