Curious about habitats...

jean-marc · 6th November 2006, 21:56

Different habitats here :

cloche Douchet

cloche Isler

sven · 6th November 2006, 23:14

Recommended viewing: Cedric & Dr Mike's habitats for the Sra Keow cave in Thailand (nicknamed "Hilton" and "Ritz"): http://drmike.smugmug.com/gallery/1477842/2

Make sure you also read the story on Cedric's website: http://www.cedricverdier.com/200mdiveWeb.pdf

Greetings from sunny Sydney!

Mdemon · 7th November 2006, 06:54

Michael/Db8us,

A couple of questions if you don't mind?

Was the neoprene liner difficult to transport becuase of the buoyancy? I guess it was chosen for toughness.

The turfer winch under the habitat - any idea what the forces are acting on it? I guess there's a couple of tonnes of lift there?

How did the heater work? Nice touch!

db8us · 7th November 2006, 13:19

The neopren is great for insulation and yes, it is pretty bouyant and hard to handle under water.
But it always depens, if you have to transport the habitat for a long distance. You also have a lot of "heavy" materials on a habitat like the steel-frame and so far it was always negative, so the neoprene was never a problem bouyancy-wise.

The 2 person habitat creates roughly 1,5ton of lift. This is never ever a problem for the "Greifzug", which is the german name for this winch.
It is heavily used in the army and really solid. Our concern was always the structure, means the rock, that should be able to handle the uplift.

Heating is a nice feature, but you will notice no diffence of temperature in the habitat, if you have a heating shirt. It makes a big difference for comfort, but the habitat ended up at 22Celsius in around 12 Celsius Water.

Michael

Ben Field · 7th November 2006, 14:19

Does anyone know if a habitat has been used by "no commercial" project/divers in Open water?

Mdemon · 7th November 2006, 16:12

Quote: (Originally Posted by db8us)

The 2 person habitat creates roughly 1,5ton of lift. This is never ever a problem for the "Greifzug", which is the german name for this winch.
It is heavily used in the army and really solid. Our concern was always the structure, means the rock, that should be able to handle the uplift.

Do you hammer fittings into the rock or use climbing gear? (Slings, friends, nuts etc?) Does the diver winch himself up or is that a support diver's job?

Looks very impressive - do you prefer the rigid habitats to the soft ones?

johnv · 7th November 2006, 18:06

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mdemon)

Do you hammer fittings into the rock or use climbing gear? (Slings, friends, nuts etc?) Does the diver winch himself up or is that a support diver's job?

Looks very impressive - do you prefer the rigid habitats to the soft ones?

if possible it's easier to use chains / sling / ropes. Placing bolts underwater takes a fair time. Friends aren't ideal and loading wires with a tonne or so will mean you have to leave them there :-( A soft habitat is more versatile for transporting both in and out of the water.

My version 2 is probably the smallest size habitat which is useful (minitat?). this generates only 215kg of lift, however the whole thing can be packed into a tackle sack, sidemounted, and carried into a cave and assembled by a single diver. The smaller the habitat, the less strain on the anchors, the tradeoff being the less space you have.

AM · 7th November 2006, 22:17

Quote: (Originally Posted by lizardland)

The classic French wheelie bin is a thing of beauty underwater.

Olivier Isler had a very fancy habitat on ropes, the depth could be adjusted. .

Hi, yes you beat me to it with the wheelie bin habitat! I've also used an inflatable one, if it's set up right it's fantastic.

Regards

AnneMarie

db8us · 8th November 2006, 00:42

I am with JohnV, chains around rocks and then the steelcable connected to that.
For a one person habitat we had set 6-12 spits in the past, each one needs around 20Minutes.

Winching us up is a support.divers job, because he also has to take care about our security anyway

In general i like rigid habitats more, they give you more confidence about beeing solid and stable.

The trashbin stuff, i remember Rick and jasons habitat in the Ressel, it stinked like hell. Also "stealing" this bins from the road might piss people off, since sometimes they have to buy a new one for their trash then, since most divers never bring them back. So maybe they are not 100% political correct, but they work

Gobfish1 · 9th November 2006, 00:25

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field)

Does anyone know if a habitat has been used by "no commercial" project/divers in Open water?

yes one has been used but cant find the link sorry .

6th November 2006, 21:56	#11 (permalink)
jean-marc New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Montpellier - France Posts: 60	Re: Curious about habitats... Different habitats here : cloche Douchet cloche Isler
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6th November 2006, 23:14	#12 (permalink)
sven Blogs Admin / Forum Mod Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Evolution Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Sydney Posts: 551	Re: Curious about habitats... Recommended viewing: Cedric & Dr Mike's habitats for the Sra Keow cave in Thailand (nicknamed "Hilton" and "Ritz"): http://drmike.smugmug.com/gallery/1477842/2 Make sure you also read the story on Cedric's website: http://www.cedricverdier.com/200mdiveWeb.pdf Greetings from sunny Sydney! __________________ Regards, Sven [SIZE=1]The Sydney Project website: [URL]http://www.sydneyproject.com[/URL] My Blog: [URL]http://sven.rebreatherworld.com[/URL] "Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect." Mark Twain[/SIZE]
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7th November 2006, 06:54	#13 (permalink)
Mdemon SiegeEngine II Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Home Build Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: SWUK Posts: 1,927	Re: Curious about habitats... Michael/Db8us, A couple of questions if you don't mind? Was the neoprene liner difficult to transport becuase of the buoyancy? I guess it was chosen for toughness. The turfer winch under the habitat - any idea what the forces are acting on it? I guess there's a couple of tonnes of lift there? How did the heater work? Nice touch! __________________ www.southwestmafia.com "small minds talk about people, Average Minds Talk About Events, GREAT MINDS TALK ABOUT IDEAS!" The WRONG Attitude will get you killed. "Once the agenda-monkeys and perfect-worlders have moved on, perhaps we can do some diving?"
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7th November 2006, 13:19	#14 (permalink)
db8us Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Other SCR Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 227	Re: Curious about habitats... The neopren is great for insulation and yes, it is pretty bouyant and hard to handle under water. But it always depens, if you have to transport the habitat for a long distance. You also have a lot of "heavy" materials on a habitat like the steel-frame and so far it was always negative, so the neoprene was never a problem bouyancy-wise. The 2 person habitat creates roughly 1,5ton of lift. This is never ever a problem for the "Greifzug", which is the german name for this winch. It is heavily used in the army and really solid. Our concern was always the structure, means the rock, that should be able to handle the uplift. Heating is a nice feature, but you will notice no diffence of temperature in the habitat, if you have a heating shirt. It makes a big difference for comfort, but the habitat ended up at 22Celsius in around 12 Celsius Water. Michael
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7th November 2006, 14:19	#15 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,621	Re: Curious about habitats... Does anyone know if a habitat has been used by "no commercial" project/divers in Open water? __________________ Know your PPO2, Pre-breath, Use checklists, Validate cells at 6mtrs, Use pure O2 at or near surface, Use a BOV, Don't dive Solo, Change Slime and Cells as recommended by Manufacturer and RTFM! Beware Fridge Suck! www.hugsac.org.uk
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7th November 2006, 16:12	#16 (permalink)
Mdemon SiegeEngine II Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Home Build Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: SWUK Posts: 1,927	Re: Curious about habitats... Quote: (Originally Posted by db8us) The 2 person habitat creates roughly 1,5ton of lift. This is never ever a problem for the "Greifzug", which is the german name for this winch. It is heavily used in the army and really solid. Our concern was always the structure, means the rock, that should be able to handle the uplift. Do you hammer fittings into the rock or use climbing gear? (Slings, friends, nuts etc?) Does the diver winch himself up or is that a support diver's job? Looks very impressive - do you prefer the rigid habitats to the soft ones? __________________ www.southwestmafia.com "small minds talk about people, Average Minds Talk About Events, GREAT MINDS TALK ABOUT IDEAS!" The WRONG Attitude will get you killed. "Once the agenda-monkeys and perfect-worlders have moved on, perhaps we can do some diving?"
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7th November 2006, 18:06	#17 (permalink)
johnv Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Home Build Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Posts: 142	Re: Curious about habitats... Quote: (Originally Posted by Mdemon) Do you hammer fittings into the rock or use climbing gear? (Slings, friends, nuts etc?) Does the diver winch himself up or is that a support diver's job? Looks very impressive - do you prefer the rigid habitats to the soft ones? if possible it's easier to use chains / sling / ropes. Placing bolts underwater takes a fair time. Friends aren't ideal and loading wires with a tonne or so will mean you have to leave them there :-( A soft habitat is more versatile for transporting both in and out of the water. My version 2 is probably the smallest size habitat which is useful (minitat?). this generates only 215kg of lift, however the whole thing can be packed into a tackle sack, sidemounted, and carried into a cave and assembled by a single diver. The smaller the habitat, the less strain on the anchors, the tradeoff being the less space you have.
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7th November 2006, 22:17	#18 (permalink)
AM In love with the big blue Current Rebreather/s: Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Earth. Posts: 622	Re: Curious about habitats... Quote: (Originally Posted by lizardland) The classic French wheelie bin is a thing of beauty underwater. Olivier Isler had a very fancy habitat on ropes, the depth could be adjusted. . Hi, yes you beat me to it with the wheelie bin habitat! I've also used an inflatable one, if it's set up right it's fantastic. Regards AnneMarie __________________ Attitude keeps you alive
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8th November 2006, 00:42	#19 (permalink)
db8us Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Other SCR Other Rebreather/s: Other SCR Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 227	Re: Curious about habitats... I am with JohnV, chains around rocks and then the steelcable connected to that. For a one person habitat we had set 6-12 spits in the past, each one needs around 20Minutes. Winching us up is a support.divers job, because he also has to take care about our security anyway In general i like rigid habitats more, they give you more confidence about beeing solid and stable. The trashbin stuff, i remember Rick and jasons habitat in the Ressel, it stinked like hell. Also "stealing" this bins from the road might piss people off, since sometimes they have to buy a new one for their trash then, since most divers never bring them back. So maybe they are not 100% political correct, but they work
(Offline)

9th November 2006, 00:25	#20 (permalink)
Gobfish1 Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Evolution Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Manchester UK Posts: 363	Re: Curious about habitats... Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field) Does anyone know if a habitat has been used by "no commercial" project/divers in Open water? yes one has been used but cant find the link sorry .
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