Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles

bjornaow · 6th November 2006, 16:01

Hi Chris

If you only are going to do 100feet (30m) dives I think an 80cf would be fine especial if you are planning to dive with a buddy on OC you need gas for him to!

Will say that I’m diving OC and not Rebreather but think that some RB divers have a relaxed attitude when it comes to the amount of bail-out gas they need if “the shit hits the fan” counting on a SAC of 20 or 25 L/min when you are stressed is just ridiculous and can get you killed.

A friend did buy the Amarillo set-up for bail-out tank's and it works well with him the tank's are out of the way for him.

P.s 30cf and 40cf is not for bail-out it's for oxygen at best!

Best regards

Bjorn Q

Dawktah · 6th November 2006, 16:48

O.K. dumb question, are tank boots, positive, negative or neutral? Never had to deal with one near water and not on a tank!

Also, is there a way to learn how to properly rig a bail/stage bottle without taking a course? I'd like to rig it before the course to save on task loading since I will have to take Advanced Nitrox in combination with CCR intro, MOD 1.

bjornaow · 6th November 2006, 19:08

Hi again Chris

check this addres out when i comes to riging stage/deco rigs DIR-diver.com - Equipment the owner of the site is conected to WKPP and a tech instructor!

Why do you want a tank boots for you tank's?

Best regards

Bjorn Q

Dawktah · 6th November 2006, 20:08

Quote: (Originally Posted by bjornaow)

Hi again Chris

check this addres out when i comes to riging stage/deco rigs DIR-diver.com - Equipment the owner of the site is conected to WKPP and a tech instructor!

Why do you want a tank boots for you tank's?

Best regards

Bjorn Q

Actually I don't, was just looking at picture posted by Mark Chase in which tank is floating boot end up.

Dutchy · 6th November 2006, 20:17

Boots sink... Only reason I use them on singles is to protect the paint.

a) Steel tanks tend to rust without them.
b) Steel tanks don't have a flat bottom and can't be placed upright without one.

At the same time I realize that they can have an adverse effect on rust because water can remain between the boot and the bottle. I solved that by cutting a circular big hole in the bottom of my boots and spacing the bottle from the boot by dropping in an axially placed 3mm rope. Now water can get in while rinsing (to remove salt) and water can just drop out of the bottom.

My guess is that the bottle in the picture is empty but still top heavy because of the reg. It would be even more so without the boot....?

Dawktah · 10th November 2006, 04:22

A steel HP 80 is 6" shorter than an Al cylinder. I'm considering an Insipration or Evolution, wouldn't steel's weight reduce the need to put (as much) weight in case? I'd be diving from home so quick rinse at dock and thorough rinse at home. Anybody ever season a steel tank? You wouldn't heat it up like you would a cast iron skillet but can't you rub something on it to make it hydrophobic just the same? Just thinking out loud.

***EBT*** · 10th November 2006, 10:44

Normally you weight for neutral with no stages, I cant think of any compelling reason not to do this as a beginner.

Steel tanks are normally zinc coated then painted. If you want to season it, Im partial to seared tuna so please make sure its capable of doing that

Dawktah · 10th November 2006, 15:18

I guess as a newbie I am confused why if a bailout is mandatory why you'd ring to be neutral without it? Is passing it off to a buddy really a good idea?

I can't wait to take intro course

Dutchy · 10th November 2006, 17:06

Because of when the moment arrives that you HAVE to hand it off one day you wouldn't want to be launched to the surface? Or if it get's stuck and you have to cut it away/take it off?
If you only have one stage it sounds absurd (you'll hand off the reg to your budy rather than handing over the complete stage I guess) but I guess that it's become a good habit with people that do pass stages around. Like in team bailout configuration or during dives where some gas is staged at a shot line...

Dawktah · 10th November 2006, 18:18

Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy)

Because of when the moment arrives that you HAVE to hand it off one day you wouldn't want to be launched to the surface?

Yeah, I realize that, it just concerns me that you'd hand off your gas at 100 fsw and next thing you know you need it back because you have some kind of failure...I guess to me "handing it off" means its no longer a mandatory piece of equipment. I'm only AOW certified so this is a foreign concept. It not a stage its a bailout??? Please help me understand...

6th November 2006, 16:01	#11 (permalink)
bjornaow New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: SWEDEN Posts: 20	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Hi Chris If you only are going to do 100feet (30m) dives I think an 80cf would be fine especial if you are planning to dive with a buddy on OC you need gas for him to! Will say that I’m diving OC and not Rebreather but think that some RB divers have a relaxed attitude when it comes to the amount of bail-out gas they need if “the shit hits the fan” counting on a SAC of 20 or 25 L/min when you are stressed is just ridiculous and can get you killed. A friend did buy the Amarillo set-up for bail-out tank's and it works well with him the tank's are out of the way for him. P.s 30cf and 40cf is not for bail-out it's for oxygen at best! Best regards Bjorn Q Last edited by bjornaow : 6th November 2006 at 19:21. Reason: spelling
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6th November 2006, 16:48	#12 (permalink)
Dawktah New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 38	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles O.K. dumb question, are tank boots, positive, negative or neutral? Never had to deal with one near water and not on a tank! Also, is there a way to learn how to properly rig a bail/stage bottle without taking a course? I'd like to rig it before the course to save on task loading since I will have to take Advanced Nitrox in combination with CCR intro, MOD 1. Last edited by Dawktah : 6th November 2006 at 16:51.
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6th November 2006, 19:08	#13 (permalink)
bjornaow New Member Current Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: SWEDEN Posts: 20	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Hi again Chris check this addres out when i comes to riging stage/deco rigs DIR-diver.com - Equipment the owner of the site is conected to WKPP and a tech instructor! Why do you want a tank boots for you tank's? Best regards Bjorn Q Last edited by bjornaow : 6th November 2006 at 19:09. Reason: spelling
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6th November 2006, 20:08	#14 (permalink)
Dawktah New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 38	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Quote: (Originally Posted by bjornaow) Hi again Chris check this addres out when i comes to riging stage/deco rigs DIR-diver.com - Equipment the owner of the site is conected to WKPP and a tech instructor! Why do you want a tank boots for you tank's? Best regards Bjorn Q Actually I don't, was just looking at picture posted by Mark Chase in which tank is floating boot end up.
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6th November 2006, 20:17	#15 (permalink)
Dutchy SK#007 Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Nieuwegein (The Netherlands) Posts: 724	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Boots sink... Only reason I use them on singles is to protect the paint. a) Steel tanks tend to rust without them. b) Steel tanks don't have a flat bottom and can't be placed upright without one. At the same time I realize that they can have an adverse effect on rust because water can remain between the boot and the bottle. I solved that by cutting a circular big hole in the bottom of my boots and spacing the bottle from the boot by dropping in an axially placed 3mm rope. Now water can get in while rinsing (to remove salt) and water can just drop out of the bottom. My guess is that the bottle in the picture is empty but still top heavy because of the reg. It would be even more so without the boot....? __________________ = This post is environmentally friendly. It is composed of 100% recycled electrons only. = SK #007
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10th November 2006, 04:22	#16 (permalink)
Dawktah New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 38	Does size matter? A steel HP 80 is 6" shorter than an Al cylinder. I'm considering an Insipration or Evolution, wouldn't steel's weight reduce the need to put (as much) weight in case? I'd be diving from home so quick rinse at dock and thorough rinse at home. Anybody ever season a steel tank? You wouldn't heat it up like you would a cast iron skillet but can't you rub something on it to make it hydrophobic just the same? Just thinking out loud.
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10th November 2006, 10:44	#17 (permalink)
*EBT* Apprentice Luddite Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: UK, Brighton Posts: 1,904	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Normally you weight for neutral with no stages, I cant think of any compelling reason not to do this as a beginner. Steel tanks are normally zinc coated then painted. If you want to season it, Im partial to seared tuna so please make sure its capable of doing that __________________ Eagles May Soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Rebreather World Terms of service Real diving t-shirts for real divers
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10th November 2006, 15:18	#18 (permalink)
Dawktah New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 38	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles I guess as a newbie I am confused why if a bailout is mandatory why you'd ring to be neutral without it? Is passing it off to a buddy really a good idea? I can't wait to take intro course
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10th November 2006, 17:06	#19 (permalink)
Dutchy SK#007 Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Nieuwegein (The Netherlands) Posts: 724	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Because of when the moment arrives that you HAVE to hand it off one day you wouldn't want to be launched to the surface? Or if it get's stuck and you have to cut it away/take it off? If you only have one stage it sounds absurd (you'll hand off the reg to your budy rather than handing over the complete stage I guess) but I guess that it's become a good habit with people that do pass stages around. Like in team bailout configuration or during dives where some gas is staged at a shot line... __________________ = This post is environmentally friendly. It is composed of 100% recycled electrons only. = SK #007
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10th November 2006, 18:18	#20 (permalink)
Dawktah New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Evolution Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 38	Re: Newbie and buying stage/bailout bottles Quote: (Originally Posted by Dutchy) Because of when the moment arrives that you HAVE to hand it off one day you wouldn't want to be launched to the surface? Yeah, I realize that, it just concerns me that you'd hand off your gas at 100 fsw and next thing you know you need it back because you have some kind of failure...I guess to me "handing it off" means its no longer a mandatory piece of equipment. I'm only AOW certified so this is a foreign concept. It not a stage its a bailout??? Please help me understand...
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