Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice

wondersea · 8th June 2007, 14:55

Hi all,

Just wondering about your choice in matter of diluent / bailout and Deco line for let see :

1 / Dive at 40 m (130 ft)

2/ Dive at 60 m (196 ft)

3/ Dive at 100 m (328 ft)

Same or different gas for diluent / Bailout / Deco line (gas/depth) ?

Heliair / Trimix / Heliox / Triox / Nitrox ?

I presume that we are with CCR and we don't take all decompression bailout gaz onboard but just enough (with security) to join the Deco line if need.

Can you argument your choice

I think not all of you as the same strategy and it's will be great to compare it.

Thank's for your cooperation.

**nigelh** · 8th June 2007, 17:10

I have two 7L 232bar cylinders.
One is 'bottom mix' and one pure O2.
They both have whips to fit into the Inspiration injectors.

Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea)

1/ Dive at 40 m (130 ft)

Depending on the deco plan neither, bottom mix only or both.

Quote:

2/ Dive at 60 m (196 ft)

Both.

Quote:

3/ Dive at 100 m (328 ft)

Out of my range.

I don't do clever or complicated planning. I dive a Vision Electronics and a VR3.

I can get out of virtually anything I'd attempt on that, even a catastophic loop flood. If things went wrong after the first fault I have already decided I would miss deeper stops rather than reach for the O2 below 6m and breathe the tanks flat (and dump them to surface if needed) rather than surface with time to do.

Mark Chase · 8th June 2007, 18:32

Today after 40mins at 60-65m and having ascended to 40ish m. My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe) and at 21m on to a 7ltr of 50%

With 50mins of deco left to do @6m the 7ltr was down to 60-70bar.

The drop tank of 70% was all but emptied to complete the deco.

No drama because we were on a deco station surrounded by divers and gas and the drop tank got to us no problem.

No station no drop tank no buddy he would have missed some deco.

The morel of this tale is there IS no answer to the question in relation to depth alone. The answer has to relate to logistics, diving conditions, proposed run times and SAC of the individual diver.

My buddy had perfectly adequate bailout today but on the same dive with a free ascent in worse viz, it might have been a different story.

ATB

Mark Chase

wondersea · 8th June 2007, 22:27

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe)

what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand.

**nigelh** · 8th June 2007, 22:49

Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea)

what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand.

(I believe) means he is not sure but thinks these are the facts.
The details are probably not relevant to the post.

Your english may be a bit broken but it's better than my french.

PCDiver · 9th June 2007, 00:10

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

Today after 40mins at 60-65m and having ascended to 40ish m. My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe) and at 21m on to a 7ltr of 50%

With 50mins of deco left to do @6m the 7ltr was down to 60-70bar.

The drop tank of 70% was all but emptied to complete the deco.

No drama because we were on a deco station surrounded by divers and gas and the drop tank got to us no problem.

No station no drop tank no buddy he would have missed some deco.

The morel of this tale is there IS no answer to the question in relation to depth inlet. The answer has to relate to logistics diving conditions proposed run times and SAC of the individual diver.

My buddy had perfectly adequate bailout today but on the same dive with a free ascent in worse viz, it might have been a different story.

ATB

Mark Chase

No access to his onboard O2?

Mark Chase · 9th June 2007, 09:35

Quote: (Originally Posted by PCDiver)

No access to his onboard O2?

No

This is an interesting and it begs the question: "is it worse to add a failure point to a critical gas or is it better to have access to all gas?"

My conclusion is If I am so desperate that the 70-100ltrs of 02 i have left in my 3ltr on board is that critical Id take the tank off stick a reg on it and use it.

This is doable on a KISS without de kitting but not easy. On an inspo you would need a buddy.

ATB

Mark Chase

Mark Chase · 9th June 2007, 09:41

Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea)

what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand.

Could have been 19/50 but i think it was 18/45. We discussed bailout before the dive and compaired gas but at the time of writing this I had forgotten exactlywhat it was. I was on 18/45 10ltr 240bar and Ali 80 of 50% 205 bar. He was on an ali 80 of 18/45 and a Ali 7 of 50% both arround 200bar

The tank was marked up badly so i couldent read it the way it was mounted but I knew his deep bailout was in the big tank and shalow bailout was in the little tank so it was a no brainer just trace the reg back to the big tank.

ATB

Mark Chase

PCDiver · 9th June 2007, 11:50

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase)

Could have been 19/50 but i think it was 18/45. We discussed bailout before the dive and compaired gas but at the time of writing this I had forgotten exactlywhat it was. I was on 18/45 10ltr 240bar and Ali 80 of 50% 205 bar. He was on an ali 80 of 18/45 and a Ali 7 of 50% both arround 200bar

The tank was marked up badly so i couldent read it the way it was mounted but I knew his deep bailout was in the big tank and shalow bailout was in the little tank so it was a no brainer just trace the reg back to the big tank.

ATB

Mark Chase

Mark, what was the reason for bailout?

Mark Chase · 9th June 2007, 12:02

Quote: (Originally Posted by PCDiver)

Mark, what was the reason for bailout?

Total scrubber flood. He could breath in but couldent breath out at all and he got a taste of lime in the loop as well.

ATB

Mark

8th June 2007, 14:55	#1 (permalink)
wondersea New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: France - Gerzat (63) - Sanary (83) Posts: 78	Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Hi all, Just wondering about your choice in matter of diluent / bailout and Deco line for let see : 1 / Dive at 40 m (130 ft) 2/ Dive at 60 m (196 ft) 3/ Dive at 100 m (328 ft) Same or different gas for diluent / Bailout / Deco line (gas/depth) ? Heliair / Trimix / Heliox / Triox / Nitrox ? I presume that we are with CCR and we don't take all decompression bailout gaz onboard but just enough (with security) to join the Deco line if need. Can you argument your choice I think not all of you as the same strategy and it's will be great to compare it. Thank's for your cooperation. __________________ Antoine Pannetier DirRebreather member www.DIRRebreather.com
(Offline)

8th June 2007, 17:10	#2 (permalink)
nigelh New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Brighton, Sussex, UK Posts: 836	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice I have two 7L 232bar cylinders. One is 'bottom mix' and one pure O2. They both have whips to fit into the Inspiration injectors. Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea) 1/ Dive at 40 m (130 ft) Depending on the deco plan neither, bottom mix only or both. Quote: 2/ Dive at 60 m (196 ft) Both. Quote: 3/ Dive at 100 m (328 ft) Out of my range. I don't do clever or complicated planning. I dive a Vision Electronics and a VR3. I can get out of virtually anything I'd attempt on that, even a catastophic loop flood. If things went wrong after the first fault I have already decided I would miss deeper stops rather than reach for the O2 below 6m and breathe the tanks flat (and dump them to surface if needed) rather than surface with time to do. __________________ nigelh
(Online)

8th June 2007, 18:32	#3 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,694	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Today after 40mins at 60-65m and having ascended to 40ish m. My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe) and at 21m on to a 7ltr of 50% With 50mins of deco left to do @6m the 7ltr was down to 60-70bar. The drop tank of 70% was all but emptied to complete the deco. No drama because we were on a deco station surrounded by divers and gas and the drop tank got to us no problem. No station no drop tank no buddy he would have missed some deco. The morel of this tale is there IS no answer to the question in relation to depth alone. The answer has to relate to logistics, diving conditions, proposed run times and SAC of the individual diver. My buddy had perfectly adequate bailout today but on the same dive with a free ascent in worse viz, it might have been a different story. ATB Mark Chase __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System Last edited by Mark Chase : 9th June 2007 at 09:45.
(Online)

8th June 2007, 22:27	#4 (permalink)
wondersea New Member Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: France - Gerzat (63) - Sanary (83) Posts: 78	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe) what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand. __________________ Antoine Pannetier DirRebreather member www.DIRRebreather.com
(Offline)

8th June 2007, 22:49	#5 (permalink)
nigelh New Member Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Brighton, Sussex, UK Posts: 836	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea) what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand. (I believe) means he is not sure but thinks these are the facts. The details are probably not relevant to the post. Your english may be a bit broken but it's better than my french. __________________ nigelh
(Online)

9th June 2007, 00:10	#6 (permalink)
PCDiver Submerge Productions Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 962	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) Today after 40mins at 60-65m and having ascended to 40ish m. My buddy bailed out on to a Ali 80 of 18/45(I believe) and at 21m on to a 7ltr of 50% With 50mins of deco left to do @6m the 7ltr was down to 60-70bar. The drop tank of 70% was all but emptied to complete the deco. No drama because we were on a deco station surrounded by divers and gas and the drop tank got to us no problem. No station no drop tank no buddy he would have missed some deco. The morel of this tale is there IS no answer to the question in relation to depth inlet. The answer has to relate to logistics diving conditions proposed run times and SAC of the individual diver. My buddy had perfectly adequate bailout today but on the same dive with a free ascent in worse viz, it might have been a different story. ATB Mark Chase No access to his onboard O2?
(Offline)

9th June 2007, 09:35	#7 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,694	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by PCDiver) No access to his onboard O2? No This is an interesting and it begs the question: "is it worse to add a failure point to a critical gas or is it better to have access to all gas?" My conclusion is If I am so desperate that the 70-100ltrs of 02 i have left in my 3ltr on board is that critical Id take the tank off stick a reg on it and use it. This is doable on a KISS without de kitting but not easy. On an inspo you would need a buddy. ATB Mark Chase __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System Last edited by Mark Chase : 9th June 2007 at 09:42.
(Online)

9th June 2007, 09:41	#8 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,694	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by wondersea) what's hell, you believe ! Wake up me, or I don't understrand. Could have been 19/50 but i think it was 18/45. We discussed bailout before the dive and compaired gas but at the time of writing this I had forgotten exactlywhat it was. I was on 18/45 10ltr 240bar and Ali 80 of 50% 205 bar. He was on an ali 80 of 18/45 and a Ali 7 of 50% both arround 200bar The tank was marked up badly so i couldent read it the way it was mounted but I knew his deep bailout was in the big tank and shalow bailout was in the little tank so it was a no brainer just trace the reg back to the big tank. ATB Mark Chase __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System
(Online)

9th June 2007, 11:50	#9 (permalink)
PCDiver Submerge Productions Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Vision Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 962	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by Mark Chase) Could have been 19/50 but i think it was 18/45. We discussed bailout before the dive and compaired gas but at the time of writing this I had forgotten exactlywhat it was. I was on 18/45 10ltr 240bar and Ali 80 of 50% 205 bar. He was on an ali 80 of 18/45 and a Ali 7 of 50% both arround 200bar The tank was marked up badly so i couldent read it the way it was mounted but I knew his deep bailout was in the big tank and shalow bailout was in the little tank so it was a no brainer just trace the reg back to the big tank. ATB Mark Chase Mark, what was the reason for bailout?
(Offline)

9th June 2007, 12:02	#10 (permalink)
Mark Chase I go down for ages Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Kent Posts: 2,694	Re: Diluent / Bail-out / Deco Line gas choice Quote: (Originally Posted by PCDiver) Mark, what was the reason for bailout? Total scrubber flood. He could breath in but couldent breath out at all and he got a taste of lime in the loop as well. ATB Mark __________________ Is it supposed to make that noise ? I took my unit to the dive shop and demanded they bolt on every thing that would fit. Join my elite diving teem and get a Tshirt "Doing It Chasey"Hammerhead Eccr Advanced Diving System
(Online)

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