New KISS 2nd stage

***caveseeker7*** · 12th October 2006, 08:24

Jetsam is slated to exhibit at the NEC show, I'll ask the particulars.

As it's the old BOV with a new 2nd stage (not the newer prototype that Gordon was working on) I wouldn't get my hopes to high regarding the availabilty as an aftermarket BOV. For quite a while the BOVs have all been used for the rigs Jetsam builds.

Jason, thanks for the pics.

Jeff_B · 12th October 2006, 08:30

Quote: (Originally Posted by koputai)

It's a venturi reg, like the Dacor Vyper, so it should shove bucket loads of gas down your throat. Most people I talk to have leak problems with the Paragon too.

Cheers,
Jason.

I and most of the Kiss divers I know also have had nothing but problems with the paragon. My xmas project was to make an adapter for a better reg, but I will probably now use the new jetsam reg + adapter.

Jeff

RobPot · 12th October 2006, 08:59

I'd be interested in seeing some pics of just the adapter - sounds like it might be relatively straightforward job to fashion an adapter for other second stages.

RAL · 12th October 2006, 11:53

Quote: (Originally Posted by RichClark)

It's looks nice, but so far I haven't had a problem with the Paragon - granted that I've only used at 45m, and that wasn't in anger.

What are the perceived benefits of the mares reg... easier spares perhaps?

Cheers

Rich

Rich the benefit is you have a regulator that will not let you down at the worst possible time. Trust me taking a couple little sips while all is well is quite different from pulling hard on the paragon. The paragon performs so poorly at depth under a load that it is possible to invert the exhaust valve, been there done that and it aint pretty.

Some have already modifyed the dsv to accept good regs. Now you can have a stock adaptor from Jetsam.!!! My advise is run dont walk to the post office & get the money to Jetsam as soon as they are available!

RAL

Scubascooby · 12th October 2006, 13:19

Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier.

I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons.

RAL · 12th October 2006, 14:13

Quote: (Originally Posted by Scubascooby)

Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier.

I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons.

Its 28 grams heavier than the paragon setup in the dry. It may be less than that wet....anyone know? I use a G500 SP on my setup & it is a bit larger & heavier than the Proton. It has not been a problem.
I am surprized that Mares is not popular in GB. Somehow I cannot imagine spares being a problem though.
The paragon makes a small low drag setup, sadly size is the only positive it brings to the table. Its a little like having one of those pathetic undersized spares in the back of a CJ5 or Landrover. If you really needed it to get you back from the sticks you may find yourself in a bit of a bind. Do yourself a favor and get a full sized spare.

RAL

Hansson · 12th October 2006, 17:17

Does anyone know if the Jetsam Proton XL is moded in any way?

If it´s not one should be able to use any Proton 2:nd stage one could find (like the more robust metal one).

viscya · 12th October 2006, 17:50

Quote: (Originally Posted by Scubascooby)

Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier.

I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons.

It sounded like they went with Mares to get a quality reg and reliable delivery. The proton is Mares flagship line, and regularly receives good reviews. It is available in plastic or metal, but I'm not sure the adapters will be handle both. It has no adjustments, so there are fewer failure points. While I have had no issues, my buddy has had several problems with the paragon. I'm definitely getting the upgrade.

Ben Field · 13th October 2006, 09:34

Anyone got a Proton handy to measure?

Is the mouthpiece a more similar size to "normal" regs unlike the tiny Paragon... just wondering if the new adapter plate will except any other regs?

Mares has a bad reputation in the UK as overpriced flashy crap, that may not be the case but that is the situation we have.

RAL · 13th October 2006, 13:34

Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field)

Anyone got a Proton handy to measure?

Is the mouthpiece a more similar size to "normal" regs unlike the tiny Paragon... just wondering if the new adapter plate will except any other regs?

Mares has a bad reputation in the UK as overpriced flashy crap, that may not be the case but that is the situation we have.

The mouthpiece tube is closer to normal than the paragon. The body of the Proton mouthpiece tube is about 1 1/2" wide & 3/4" high. There is a lip on the end that is about 1 3/8" wide & 3/4" high. For comparison Apex T100: the body is 1 7/16" wide & 5/8" high. The lip about 1 1/2" wide & 3/4" high.
If Mares is crap then there may not be a word in the English language to describe the paragon. It may come to pass the paragon may come to mean something worse than crap.

RAL

12th October 2006, 08:24	#11 (permalink)
*caveseeker7* Who loves ya, baby Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Prism Topaz Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Too far from Neverland Posts: 5,435	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Jetsam is slated to exhibit at the NEC show, I'll ask the particulars. As it's the old BOV with a new 2nd stage (not the newer prototype that Gordon was working on) I wouldn't get my hopes to high regarding the availabilty as an aftermarket BOV. For quite a while the BOVs have all been used for the rigs Jetsam builds. Jason, thanks for the pics. __________________ Cheers Stefan "Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.'!"
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12th October 2006, 08:30	#12 (permalink)
Jeff_B New Member Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Chelmsford Posts: 29	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Quote: (Originally Posted by koputai) It's a venturi reg, like the Dacor Vyper, so it should shove bucket loads of gas down your throat. Most people I talk to have leak problems with the Paragon too. Cheers, Jason. I and most of the Kiss divers I know also have had nothing but problems with the paragon. My xmas project was to make an adapter for a better reg, but I will probably now use the new jetsam reg + adapter. Jeff
(Offline)

12th October 2006, 08:59	#13 (permalink)
RobPot Rebreather World Writer Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: May 2005 Location: Portishead - Gateway to the South West Posts: 180	Re: New KISS 2nd stage I'd be interested in seeing some pics of just the adapter - sounds like it might be relatively straightforward job to fashion an adapter for other second stages.
(Offline)

12th October 2006, 11:53	#14 (permalink)
RAL Longbottom Time Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: North Florida Posts: 386	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Quote: (Originally Posted by RichClark) It's looks nice, but so far I haven't had a problem with the Paragon - granted that I've only used at 45m, and that wasn't in anger. What are the perceived benefits of the mares reg... easier spares perhaps? Cheers Rich Rich the benefit is you have a regulator that will not let you down at the worst possible time. Trust me taking a couple little sips while all is well is quite different from pulling hard on the paragon. The paragon performs so poorly at depth under a load that it is possible to invert the exhaust valve, been there done that and it aint pretty. Some have already modifyed the dsv to accept good regs. Now you can have a stock adaptor from Jetsam.!!! My advise is run dont walk to the post office & get the money to Jetsam as soon as they are available! RAL __________________ The sea does not care about you.
(Offline)

12th October 2006, 13:19	#15 (permalink)
Scubascooby Better Off Out of the EU Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Great Britain Posts: 367	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier. I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons. __________________ "dove" is NOT the past tense of "dive" Better off OUT of the EU !
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12th October 2006, 14:13	#16 (permalink)
RAL Longbottom Time Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: North Florida Posts: 386	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Quote: (Originally Posted by Scubascooby) Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier. I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons. Its 28 grams heavier than the paragon setup in the dry. It may be less than that wet....anyone know? I use a G500 SP on my setup & it is a bit larger & heavier than the Proton. It has not been a problem. I am surprized that Mares is not popular in GB. Somehow I cannot imagine spares being a problem though. The paragon makes a small low drag setup, sadly size is the only positive it brings to the table. Its a little like having one of those pathetic undersized spares in the back of a CJ5 or Landrover. If you really needed it to get you back from the sticks you may find yourself in a bit of a bind. Do yourself a favor and get a full sized spare. RAL __________________ The sea does not care about you.
(Offline)

12th October 2006, 17:17	#17 (permalink)
Hansson New Member Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Helsingborg, Sweden Posts: 25	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Does anyone know if the Jetsam Proton XL is moded in any way? If it´s not one should be able to use any Proton 2:nd stage one could find (like the more robust metal one).
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12th October 2006, 17:50	#18 (permalink)
viscya Wrecking Crew Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Marlton New Jersey Posts: 140	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Quote: (Originally Posted by Scubascooby) Mares have never seemed to be huge sellers here in G Britain. I wonder what the reason for choosing this model was ? It's bulkier and heavier. I know there aren't many side exhaust design around but they would seem a better choice in terms of bulk and centre of gravity. No I am not a fan of Poseidons. It sounded like they went with Mares to get a quality reg and reliable delivery. The proton is Mares flagship line, and regularly receives good reviews. It is available in plastic or metal, but I'm not sure the adapters will be handle both. It has no adjustments, so there are fewer failure points. While I have had no issues, my buddy has had several problems with the paragon. I'm definitely getting the upgrade. __________________ "There is nothing majestic or dignified about being left to silently rot and collapse under heaps of old fishing net forgotten and unappreciated in dark and unvisited waters." DrMike
(Offline)

13th October 2006, 09:34	#19 (permalink)
Ben Field CK+Shearwater Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: London, England Posts: 1,571	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Anyone got a Proton handy to measure? Is the mouthpiece a more similar size to "normal" regs unlike the tiny Paragon... just wondering if the new adapter plate will except any other regs? Mares has a bad reputation in the UK as overpriced flashy crap, that may not be the case but that is the situation we have. __________________ www.hugsac.org.uk Beware Fridge Suck
(Online)

13th October 2006, 13:34	#20 (permalink)
RAL Longbottom Time Current Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: North Florida Posts: 386	Re: New KISS 2nd stage Quote: (Originally Posted by Ben Field) Anyone got a Proton handy to measure? Is the mouthpiece a more similar size to "normal" regs unlike the tiny Paragon... just wondering if the new adapter plate will except any other regs? Mares has a bad reputation in the UK as overpriced flashy crap, that may not be the case but that is the situation we have. The mouthpiece tube is closer to normal than the paragon. The body of the Proton mouthpiece tube is about 1 1/2" wide & 3/4" high. There is a lip on the end that is about 1 3/8" wide & 3/4" high. For comparison Apex T100: the body is 1 7/16" wide & 5/8" high. The lip about 1 1/2" wide & 3/4" high. If Mares is crap then there may not be a word in the English language to describe the paragon. It may come to pass the paragon may come to mean something worse than crap. RAL __________________ The sea does not care about you.
(Offline)

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