Options for onboard gas access.

Gilles · 10th May 2007, 13:52

Attached are four different concepts for plumbing in access to onboard gas.
I would like your opinions please.

Which do you prefer? and what other ideas could you contribute.

You may tick more than 1 choice. Please note that option5 "2nd stages on each tank" means onboard tanks.

2nd stages on offboards is/was implied (totally unclearly, apologies to participants).

cedricverdier · 11th May 2007, 03:03

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gilles)

Attached are four different concepts for plumbing in access to onboard gas.
I would like your opinions please.

Which do you prefer? and what other ideas could you contribute.

You may tick more than 1 choice.

Hi Gilles,

I would suggest that you keep your configuration as simple and flexible as possible:
- BOV connected to your in-board diluent. It gives you the option to quickly switch to OC for sanity breaths if needed. No extra plumbing or QC or whatever.

- 2nd stage available on each sling tank you have. If you definitely need to go off the loop and ascent OC, then you switch from your BOV to a normal second stage and ascent. It also gives you the possibility to give your sling tank to another diver in need, without having to disconnect anything from your rebreather.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Explorer · 11th May 2007, 05:32

I agree with Cedric on these points. I have setup my Golem BOV to be connected to my onboard diluent. I have my setup similar to the pic below and it works great. No extra plumbing or QC or whatever.

Y Block & BOV 1.JPG

I agree with Cedric's second point on having a 2nd stage available on each sling tank you have. It is simple and makes sense. Like Heavy Breather says, "O/C is for bailout".

**UWSojourner** · 11th May 2007, 16:18

Does anyone know (reasonably guess) how much DIL you'd blow through before you could get a bad CO2 hit under control?

My concern is that with small onboard (13s or 19s), at depth, fast breathing, the onboard DIL would be gone before the symptoms were alleviated. But I don't know.

(Thanks for the poll Gilles, I just started thinking about going BOV and how the plumbing should be routed)

Mikel-Deko · 11th May 2007, 16:28

I think that a BOV with onboard will be the best solution for any kind of problem.
A few, no more than 10-15 breath will be nethesary to take the second stage from your independent bailout.

My two cents.

Best

Mikel

***ScubaDadMiami*** · 11th May 2007, 16:29

I also have mine configured this way. I have been using a BOV for only about 10 dives or less so far. Especially until I have a lot more experience, I want to keep my rig as simple as I can. So, I just have my BOV plumbed to onboard gas, and then I will switch to offboard open circuit. That's my plan.

Inasmuch as I use the 27 cubic foot steels on my Optima, I should have enough gas to take a couple of sanity breaths while deploying my offboard open circuit supply.

Mikel-Deko · 11th May 2007, 16:45

The question is: Do we always dive with our diluyent tank full?

Last week, diving solo to 82 mtrs, i run out of diluyent in the way down. I brake the surface with no more than 50 bar in my onboard diluyent.
I've two bailouts with me.
Between 60 and 70 mtrs, i run out diluyent. I had to connect my offboard diluyent to my manual add button and keep going down.
When i research the 82 mtrs, i've no gas for my wing (luckely i was in wetsuit). I had to flush up a little my loop, change the connection from the loop to the wing that was.

After that, i 've learn that i need to full my diluyent onboard tank every dive.

Best

Mikel

Gilles · 11th May 2007, 23:45

I'm often compelled to perform multiple dives in a day, causing depletion of onboard supplies. As a result, I've run out of dil a number of times (but I often do on purpose to keep on top of the skill and I often use 13's). If there could only be more Rebreather's in my location (2 in all of Borneo so far). There's also the cheap tightwad in me that doesn't like wing-inflating with Tmx.

2ndly, I'm still warm to Suttons idea of keeping a nitrox of some kind in the dil tank. Likewise with Cedrics above advice about keeping it simple as possible. Both these opinions are not necessarily contradictory and can be integrated.

I hope there can/will be a debate about this. Today I will practise handing off a connected offboard, and determine the added complication of the default connection to this offboard.

**UWSojourner** · 12th May 2007, 00:31

Some pics from those who have already implemented routing and switchblock configs would be beneficial, especially in gear with bailouts on. Would like to see if all the interconnected points make you look like you've been caught in a net

.

**Dave Sutton** · 12th May 2007, 02:29

Quote: (Originally Posted by Gilles)

I'm often compelled to perform multiple dives in a day, causing depletion of onboard supplies. As a result, I've run out of dil a number of times (but I often do on purpose to keep on top of the skill and I often use 13's). If there could only be more Rebreather's in my location (2 in all of Borneo so far). There's also the cheap tightwad in me that doesn't like wing-inflating with Tmx.

2ndly, I'm still warm to Suttons idea of keeping a nitrox of some kind in the dil tank. Likewise with Cedrics above advice about keeping it simple as possible. Both these opinions are not necessarily contradictory and can be integrated.

I hope there can/will be a debate about this. Today I will practise handing off a connected offboard, and determine the added complication of the default connection to this offboard.

Let us know how you find it. It's just one QD to undo, and if you use CEJN's with *genuine* Unisuit inflation hoses they are VERY easy to undo as the Unisuit hoses have a very good coupling to grab.

Just FYI, I put photos of my system on the rEvo forum thread named "nice pair". It should probably have gotten it's own thread elsewhere. I'll bring the photos over for this thread if interested and follow with more if desired. The photos show both the BOV supplies as well as my OC 02 system.

Dave

View Poll Results: Which BOV plumbing concept (to include onboard gas) is preferred?
All QD's using no switchblocks	14	38.89%
1 Switch for off to onboard dil. QD at BOV for O2	5	13.89%
Like option2 but QD's at switchblock	2	5.56%
Two switchblocks.	1	2.78%
Use 2nd stages on each tank	17	47.22%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 36. You may not vote on this poll

11th May 2007, 03:03	#2 (permalink)
cedricverdier S21 M.I.B. Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Not Bought Yet Inspiration Classic Inspiration Vision Sport Kiss Classic Kiss Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Worldwide! Posts: 486	Re: Options for onboard gas access. Quote: (Originally Posted by Gilles) Attached are four different concepts for plumbing in access to onboard gas. I would like your opinions please. Which do you prefer? and what other ideas could you contribute. You may tick more than 1 choice. Hi Gilles, I would suggest that you keep your configuration as simple and flexible as possible: - BOV connected to your in-board diluent. It gives you the option to quickly switch to OC for sanity breaths if needed. No extra plumbing or QC or whatever. - 2nd stage available on each sling tank you have. If you definitely need to go off the loop and ascent OC, then you switch from your BOV to a normal second stage and ascent. It also gives you the possibility to give your sling tank to another diver in need, without having to disconnect anything from your rebreather. Hope this helps Cheers __________________ Cedric Verdier PADI Course Director, ANDI-IANTD-PSAI-TDI-DSAT-DAN-NAUI-CMAS Instructor Trainer Trimix (CCR and OC) and Cave Diving Instructor Trainer www.CedricVerdier.com DIRrebreather member
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11th May 2007, 05:32	#3 (permalink)
Explorer Be vewy vewy quiet.... Current Rebreather/s: Evolution Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 748	Re: Options for onboard gas access. I agree with Cedric on these points. I have setup my Golem BOV to be connected to my onboard diluent. I have my setup similar to the pic below and it works great. No extra plumbing or QC or whatever. Y Block & BOV 1.JPG I agree with Cedric's second point on having a 2nd stage available on each sling tank you have. It is simple and makes sense. Like Heavy Breather says, "O/C is for bailout". __________________ TRAIN WRECKED.....
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11th May 2007, 16:18	#4 (permalink)
UWSojourner Pacific Northwest Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 556	Re: Options for onboard gas access. Does anyone know (reasonably guess) how much DIL you'd blow through before you could get a bad CO2 hit under control? My concern is that with small onboard (13s or 19s), at depth, fast breathing, the onboard DIL would be gone before the symptoms were alleviated. But I don't know. (Thanks for the poll Gilles, I just started thinking about going BOV and how the plumbing should be routed)
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11th May 2007, 16:28	#5 (permalink)
Mikel-Deko Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Basque Country -Sp- Posts: 406	Re: Options for onboard gas access. I think that a BOV with onboard will be the best solution for any kind of problem. A few, no more than 10-15 breath will be nethesary to take the second stage from your independent bailout. My two cents. Best Mikel __________________ Mikel-Deko Basque Country www.olatu.net "DIR is the nanny state for divers who cannot think on their own" Ron Micjan
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11th May 2007, 16:29	#6 (permalink)
*ScubaDadMiami* Moderator Current Rebreather/s: Optima Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida, USA Posts: 1,890	Re: Options for onboard gas access. I also have mine configured this way. I have been using a BOV for only about 10 dives or less so far. Especially until I have a lot more experience, I want to keep my rig as simple as I can. So, I just have my BOV plumbed to onboard gas, and then I will switch to offboard open circuit. That's my plan. Inasmuch as I use the 27 cubic foot steels on my Optima, I should have enough gas to take a couple of sanity breaths while deploying my offboard open circuit supply. __________________ Howard Packer IANTD CCR Instructor Miami Beach, Florida CCRDiveTraining.com
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11th May 2007, 16:45	#7 (permalink)
Mikel-Deko Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Inspiration Classic Other CCR Other Rebreather/s: Other CCR Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Basque Country -Sp- Posts: 406	Re: Options for onboard gas access. The question is: Do we always dive with our diluyent tank full? Last week, diving solo to 82 mtrs, i run out of diluyent in the way down. I brake the surface with no more than 50 bar in my onboard diluyent. I've two bailouts with me. Between 60 and 70 mtrs, i run out diluyent. I had to connect my offboard diluyent to my manual add button and keep going down. When i research the 82 mtrs, i've no gas for my wing (luckely i was in wetsuit). I had to flush up a little my loop, change the connection from the loop to the wing that was. After that, i 've learn that i need to full my diluyent onboard tank every dive. Best Mikel __________________ Mikel-Deko Basque Country www.olatu.net "DIR is the nanny state for divers who cannot think on their own" Ron Micjan
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11th May 2007, 23:45	#8 (permalink)
Gilles Worship the feminine Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Den Haag (Netherlands) Posts: 761	Re: Options for onboard gas access. I'm often compelled to perform multiple dives in a day, causing depletion of onboard supplies. As a result, I've run out of dil a number of times (but I often do on purpose to keep on top of the skill and I often use 13's). If there could only be more Rebreather's in my location (2 in all of Borneo so far). There's also the cheap tightwad in me that doesn't like wing-inflating with Tmx. 2ndly, I'm still warm to Suttons idea of keeping a nitrox of some kind in the dil tank. Likewise with Cedrics above advice about keeping it simple as possible. Both these opinions are not necessarily contradictory and can be integrated. I hope there can/will be a debate about this. Today I will practise handing off a connected offboard, and determine the added complication of the default connection to this offboard. __________________ Gilles http://www.dirrebreather.com
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12th May 2007, 00:31	#9 (permalink)
UWSojourner Pacific Northwest Current Rebreather/s: Megalodon Other Rebreather/s: Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 556	Re: Options for onboard gas access. Some pics from those who have already implemented routing and switchblock configs would be beneficial, especially in gear with bailouts on. Would like to see if all the interconnected points make you look like you've been caught in a net .
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12th May 2007, 02:29	#10 (permalink)
Dave Sutton Living on Animal Farm Current Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss MK 15.X rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Classic Kiss rEvo Other CCR Azimuth Home Build Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Narragansett, Rhode Island and Hackettstown, New Jersey Posts: 2,450	Re: Options for onboard gas access. Quote: (Originally Posted by Gilles) I'm often compelled to perform multiple dives in a day, causing depletion of onboard supplies. As a result, I've run out of dil a number of times (but I often do on purpose to keep on top of the skill and I often use 13's). If there could only be more Rebreather's in my location (2 in all of Borneo so far). There's also the cheap tightwad in me that doesn't like wing-inflating with Tmx. 2ndly, I'm still warm to Suttons idea of keeping a nitrox of some kind in the dil tank. Likewise with Cedrics above advice about keeping it simple as possible. Both these opinions are not necessarily contradictory and can be integrated. I hope there can/will be a debate about this. Today I will practise handing off a connected offboard, and determine the added complication of the default connection to this offboard. Let us know how you find it. It's just one QD to undo, and if you use CEJN's with genuine Unisuit inflation hoses they are VERY easy to undo as the Unisuit hoses have a very good coupling to grab. Just FYI, I put photos of my system on the rEvo forum thread named "nice pair". It should probably have gotten it's own thread elsewhere. I'll bring the photos over for this thread if interested and follow with more if desired. The photos show both the BOV supplies as well as my OC 02 system. Dave __________________ . "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others" Professional Small Boy: Never Successfully Cubicled.
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