Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
Not sure Id put the shut off valve there (if thats what youve got next to the QC) easy to accidentally roll it shut and hard to find quickly if your carrying multi tanks/gear. On a deep dive by time youve found it you could have lost half your tank
. I have mine screwed right into the 2nd stage so I can reach it and shut it (or open it) imediately and cant get rubbed closed.
The shut off valve can't roll off. It is an inline valve with positive detent, same as used on the ADV.
When kitted up, it is located right on the center of the chest. Can't be easier to find.
This configuration is only for OC bailout/OC deco and is already hooked up for deep nasal or BOV bailout. The shut off located in this position is infinately easier to operate than locating it on next to the reg (ie. no reaching through loop and one stop shopping for everything needed to make the switch)
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
Hmmm, have you dived it yet? When I experimented with having both sets of hoses coming from same side I found the hoses (when pressurised and therefore stiff) did make head movement to that side harder.
I did a shake down pool dive today with very pleasing results. I'm conducting two ocean dives tomorrow. Head movement was completely unrestricted (no exageration). The hoses are looped back around the head, but below the rear loop hoses. The movement is no different than using a long hose looped in the same manner.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
The issuse with some QCs is more the limiting flow rate through them. Your adding a QC, shut off valve, Y manifold and swivel between you and your gas supply - best to minimise pressure losses where possible when your facing high RMV at depth, which is why my QC is only for side reg - real bail is direct form off board 2nd stages with no elbows, qcs or flow stops =KISS
No flow restriction through the M&J. See photo. There is no pressure loss at the reg what so ever. With a IP gauge on a short hose off a LP port, the gauge reads 140 psi. With a IP gauge down line after the QC, shutoff, and Y-block where the reg would be plugged in, it still reads 140 psi. This was a requirement for me on this configuration. If there had been any pressure drop, I would have reconsidered.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
Personally I dont see need for BOV if you have a side reg (or visa versa) I dont see that as KISS. To me on of the major benefits of the side reg is you can continue to breathe during gas switching. - With your configuration you wont be able to do that as your side reg and bov are fed from same supply
I'm not using the nasal BO reg to breath during a gas switch. That would mean the nasal reg and the BOV would need to come from different gas supplies, and I find that potentially dangerous. Doing the switch takes less than 10 seconds when done slow and methodical.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
For you a gas switch will go something like this:
1) Find your next bail tanks QC, pull out hose..hold it in your right hand
2) Turn off current offboard bail tank valve with your left hand?
3) Breathe few more breaths from current offboard tank until pressure = zero*
4) Hold breath and fumble to disconnect QC (which takes 2 hands so you drop the new QC from your right hand)
5) Still holding breath try to relocate dropped new QC and then connect new QC (Fumble fumble fumble., why wont it connect?..fumble fumble, connect will you!, fumble fumble - need to breathe!, fumble fumble, getting stressed, fumble, fumble need to breathe, getting more stressed, wont connect! Oh shit!! [been there done that
]
Will actually go like this:
1. Deep bailout is already hooked up on on
-First gas switch:
2. Verify next bottle is pressurized
3. Hold current whip with right hand
4. Slide shutoff off with left hand
5. Slide disconnect with right hand
6. Pull out next whip with right hand and verify MOD placard
7. Plug in next whip
8. Slide shutoff on with left hand
9. Purge and breath
This is so simple it's silly. I'll have someone video it being performed when we get the chance.
This feed hose is held in place by the harness. It's not dropping anywhere. If all shit hits the fan, I still have 2nd stages on all bottles. We are all used to doing gas switches while blowing bubbles, right? OC days.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
At this point your
only opinion is to viloently rip off your full face mask and whilst recovering from shock of cold water on face and loss of vision adding even more stress to stressful situiation you struggle to find your bail gas 2nd stage and turn valve on. ..ahh a good day out
65 to 85 deg water is hardly cold.
Dropping a whip is no big deal. Trace the hand back to the 1st stage and start over. This isn't rocket science, and is simpler than a 2nd stage deployment by any stretch of the imagination.
Me thinks you are overcomplicating things a bit in your description. I think if a OW student can find a reg behind their back, I can find a whip in front or beside me.
Like I said, I'll video tape all the blunders that can happen and post them so you can give me the DrMike Good Seal of Approval!
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
In contrast my bail goes like this;
1) Begin nose breathing from side reg.
2) fumble for p-ported 2nd stage (take as long as you want because your side reg is plumbed into same bail tank)
3) casually, at your leasure, insert 2nd stage into front p-port opening
4) stop nose breathing and start mouth breathing
Well, you missed a few critical steps in there Mike. If I take out the verification steps, my list is as short as yours.
What gas is your nasal reg plugged into? Is it breathable at all depths? Once you do the switch on the mouth, you now have two different mixes for possible breathing. Not KISS in my mind at all. You say that they are both plugged in to the same tank, but not once you make the mouth switch. If so, you are set up the same as me.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
1) In case of QC stuck open failure in which case you will loose heaps of gas at depth, gas that your life may still depend on if your bail calcs are wrong
Hmmm. That's what that pesky inline shutoff is for.
Quote: (Originally Posted by
Drmike)
2) Most QCs are impossible to re-connect if 2nd stage side is still pressurised!! (see one cause of 5 above), another lesson learnt the hard way Thought of that. Worked fine today. Can always purge the line after shutoff and prior to disconnect. Not neccessary though. Like I said, this QC worked fine today. I'll verify this again tomorrow to please you.
This is a very simple and effective way to do gas switches over standard OC practices that the majority of Rebreather divers have to perform. Everything happens right in front of the face or chest. No running running around the neck or exposing your mouth to the sea. Just a plug and play. Twist it however you want. It's stupid simple.