Rebreather World - View Single Post - Bringing an unconscious Rebreather diver up from depth

MHD · 13th May 2007, 06:59

Simple review of 3 real cases

1 JasonM, showed problems at approx 110m early in dive, ascended by self to approx 30m, was escorted by another diver during ascent, went unconscious at 30m and was blown by buddy (who himself had significant deco obligation) to surface and recovered by boat crew. Was resus'd by crew and transfered to hospital. Showed signs of severe DCS hit among other symptoms. Has since made an almost full recovery. (Jason may say what his residual issues are I know he had some sometime back but no clue to there real extent, but involved a spinal hit I think)

Key item here was that diver had significant DCS obligation, but made basically a straight ascent from 100 in the end. The cause for his problem is immaterial to the subsequent management of the deteriorating and finally unconscious divers, but the key was once on surface was recovered by boat crew almost instantly and air way safety and breathing re-established. But the key thing was that once he went unconscious his time in water where he could drown was minimal. Unconscious diver under water = future drowning victim

Bent divers can be treated, dead divers can't be

Case 2

Myron Wyntonik

Grand mal seizure at 42m early in dive, lost loop, teeth clenched so unable to put reg in mouth. Was bought by divers straight to surface and back of boat where resus was commenced. Was resuscitated but had recursive drowning, and was choppered out and resus'd by para's on several more occasions.

Was released from hospital and walking and basically physically fine the next day. Key element was that while air way was unprotected, total time was probably about 90 second with either loop out or breathing water. Again time is everything with an unconscious diver. Drowning is your worst enemy. Myron had no DCS symptoms, was chambered as a precaution for a AGE. Total time on bottom was less than 5 minutes so this is not unexpected

Case 3 Rob Cook

Grand mal seizure at 3m at end of dive, no deco obligation, Was in process of bailing out , but hadn't managed to get reg in by time of seizure, so breathed water, was instantly taken on board a boat and resus'd (ie brought to surface unconscious and not breathing). Choppered to hospital and released the next day.

All 3 are successful cases where the air way was compromised. In at least 2 cases there was nothing you could have done to restore gas quality to loop, for varous reason I wont explain (it may of made no difference in the third either).

The key is the longer the time underwater the unconscious diver spends the more likely they are to die. Very simple.

These successful cases all have one thing in common. They got to the surface ASAP (all well less than 90 seconds from point of unconsciousness), and got subsequent help that meant they lived. Screwing around trying to solve other non important issues is the same is finding interesting ways to kill them.

If you take 3 minutes to get diver with a unprotected air way to the surface (ie reg out) it is all over in practice.

If you take 3 minutes to get a non breathing diver to the surface it is all over

If you can not guarantee the diver is breathing, get them to surface, who cares what their loop is or there Deco obligation. The loop it is the most likely reason they went unconscious, so get them to the surface and breathing air ASAP. Every second you screw around it is more likely they will die. DCS can kill but drowning is faster. DCS can be treated post event, death is a little more hard to rectify. Drowning is the biggest risk at this point, manage that and you will have a hope.

There are several stories floating around about people trying this and that underwater with a unconscious Rebreather divers, and they all result with the death of the Diver, the successful cases all have one common factor, minimum time with the air way compromised.

There will always be the odd exception. but for me having known 2 of the above people and being full informed of the events (case 2 and 3), this the ultimate application of the K.I.S.S principal.

Matthew

13th May 2007, 06:59	#44 (permalink)
MHD Custom Title Allowed! Current Rebreather/s: Home Build Other Rebreather/s: Sport Kiss Home Build Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Brisbane, QLD, Australia Posts: 240	Re: Bringing an unconscious Rebreather diver up from depth Simple review of 3 real cases 1 JasonM, showed problems at approx 110m early in dive, ascended by self to approx 30m, was escorted by another diver during ascent, went unconscious at 30m and was blown by buddy (who himself had significant deco obligation) to surface and recovered by boat crew. Was resus'd by crew and transfered to hospital. Showed signs of severe DCS hit among other symptoms. Has since made an almost full recovery. (Jason may say what his residual issues are I know he had some sometime back but no clue to there real extent, but involved a spinal hit I think) Key item here was that diver had significant DCS obligation, but made basically a straight ascent from 100 in the end. The cause for his problem is immaterial to the subsequent management of the deteriorating and finally unconscious divers, but the key was once on surface was recovered by boat crew almost instantly and air way safety and breathing re-established. But the key thing was that once he went unconscious his time in water where he could drown was minimal. Unconscious diver under water = future drowning victim Bent divers can be treated, dead divers can't be Case 2 Myron Wyntonik Grand mal seizure at 42m early in dive, lost loop, teeth clenched so unable to put reg in mouth. Was bought by divers straight to surface and back of boat where resus was commenced. Was resuscitated but had recursive drowning, and was choppered out and resus'd by para's on several more occasions. Was released from hospital and walking and basically physically fine the next day. Key element was that while air way was unprotected, total time was probably about 90 second with either loop out or breathing water. Again time is everything with an unconscious diver. Drowning is your worst enemy. Myron had no DCS symptoms, was chambered as a precaution for a AGE. Total time on bottom was less than 5 minutes so this is not unexpected Case 3 Rob Cook Grand mal seizure at 3m at end of dive, no deco obligation, Was in process of bailing out , but hadn't managed to get reg in by time of seizure, so breathed water, was instantly taken on board a boat and resus'd (ie brought to surface unconscious and not breathing). Choppered to hospital and released the next day. All 3 are successful cases where the air way was compromised. In at least 2 cases there was nothing you could have done to restore gas quality to loop, for varous reason I wont explain (it may of made no difference in the third either). The key is the longer the time underwater the unconscious diver spends the more likely they are to die. Very simple. These successful cases all have one thing in common. They got to the surface ASAP (all well less than 90 seconds from point of unconsciousness), and got subsequent help that meant they lived. Screwing around trying to solve other non important issues is the same is finding interesting ways to kill them. If you take 3 minutes to get diver with a unprotected air way to the surface (ie reg out) it is all over in practice. If you take 3 minutes to get a non breathing diver to the surface it is all over If you can not guarantee the diver is breathing, get them to surface, who cares what their loop is or there Deco obligation. The loop it is the most likely reason they went unconscious, so get them to the surface and breathing air ASAP. Every second you screw around it is more likely they will die. DCS can kill but drowning is faster. DCS can be treated post event, death is a little more hard to rectify. Drowning is the biggest risk at this point, manage that and you will have a hope. There are several stories floating around about people trying this and that underwater with a unconscious Rebreather divers, and they all result with the death of the Diver, the successful cases all have one common factor, minimum time with the air way compromised. There will always be the odd exception. but for me having known 2 of the above people and being full informed of the events (case 2 and 3), this the ultimate application of the K.I.S.S principal. Matthew Last edited by MHD : 13th May 2007 at 23:36.
(Offline)